The Campaign Builder's Guild

In my campaign world, there is a place called the Great Empire of Un.Ã,  (If you want to learn more about it, check the Homebrew board.Ã,  I've posted most of what I have for it there.)Ã, The Great Empire of Un does not have a polytheistic religion.Ã,  They believe in one overgod figure (Bodin), but pray to a number of Saints.

Keeping in mind that I want this setting to be relatively low-magic (I don't want this to be a no-magic setting, I just don't want to go overboard with it as I feel the standard D&D setting does.) I'm not sure how I want to handle domains.Ã,  Each of theÃ, Saints areÃ, associated with certain things,Ã, so they allÃ, have their own portfolio.Ã, Ã, Spellcasting clerics, paladins, and other religious folk will be exceedingly rare in my world, but they will exist.Ã,  For theseÃ, rare few, I am unsure of how to handle domains.Ã,  They would be easy to create because each Saint has their own, clearly-defined portfolio.Ã,  Then again, if everyÃ, divine spellcaster that has aÃ, certainÃ, Saint as their patron uses the same magics it seems to take some of theÃ, impressiveness away from it's use, and that is not what I want.Ã,  (If someone uses magic in my world, I want it to be impressive and awe-inspiring, not commonplace and not repetitive.Ã,  That is the main thing I am going for byÃ, creating a moderately low-magic world.)

If anyone here has anyÃ, ideas of how I could handle this,Ã, I would like to hear them.Ã,  Any adviceÃ, from someone who has tackled similar issues would be most appreciated (I know that those people are out there because I have heard of people with similar ideas.) but I will happily and gratefully take help from anyone willing to offer it.Ã,  (Also, if anyone here could go take a look at what IÃ, have posted so far for the Great Empire of Un and leave feedback, that would be great.Ã,  Don't worry, it isn't long and should only take a few minutes to read all of it and that may give you a better idea of what I am asking here.)Ã, Ã, Ã, Ã, 

Each cleric should be allowed to select standard domains that do not contradict with his or her alignment, just like deityless clerics in Core D&D.

Quote from: CYMROEach cleric should be allowed to select standard domains that do not contradict with his or her alignment, just like deityless clerics in Core D&D.

I have never heard of anyone using deityless clerics in core D&D.Ã,  (Unless, of course, you mean clerics that serve a certain group of gods or an entire pantheon.)Ã,  How well does this work?Ã,  (Also, off topic, where are the powers said to come from?)

Quote from: Black Jack Davey

Quote from: CYMROEach cleric should be allowed to select standard domains that do not contradict with his or her alignment, just like deityless clerics in Core D&D.

I have never heard of anyone using deityless clerics in core D&D.Ã,  (Unless, of course, you mean clerics that serve a certain group of gods or an entire pantheon.)Ã,  How well does this work?Ã,  (Also, off topic, where are the powers said to come from?)

Well, it is part of RAW,a cleric serving a belief rather than a god.Ã,  It works quite well for those that do it.Ã,  My Cs requires a deity, though.
The powers, spells, turning abilities, domins, come from the power of the belief.Ã,  Simple and elegant.

Quote from: CYMRO

Quote from: Black Jack Davey

Quote from: CYMROEach cleric should be allowed to select standard domains that do not contradict with his or her alignment, just like deityless clerics in Core D&D.

I have never heard of anyone using deityless clerics in core D&D.Ã,  (Unless, of course, you mean clerics that serve a certain group of gods or an entire pantheon.)Ã,  How well does this work?Ã,  (Also, off topic, where are the powers said to come from?)

Well, it is part of RAW,a cleric serving a belief rather than a god.Ã,  It works quite well for those that do it.Ã,  My Cs requires a deity, though.
The powers, spells, turning abilities, domins, come from the power of the belief.Ã,  Simple and elegant.

That is a way that I had considered doing things for a while.Ã,  I never liked the idea of there being 'true' gods that do exist.Ã,  I would rather it be different people have different beliefs and no one can actually be sure who, if anyone,Ã, is right, just like the real world.

yeah, core d&d actually allows deityless clerics. mechanically, they work just like the other clerics. you'll notice most spells that rely on deities (spiritual weapon, some non-core spells), call out alignment-based specifics for deityless casters.

As far as flavor goes, clerics in your campaign could describe how their domain-choices relate back to the saints that they're following. if it's too much of a stretch, it might be a bad choice of domain?

some clerics might have one of their domains chosen due to family or location as well (every 3 or so generations, a cleric is born to the massa family, and they always have the fire domain, something like that...)

Quote from: brainfaceyeah, core d&d actually allows deityless clerics. mechanically, they work just like the other clerics. you'll notice most spells that rely on deities (spiritual weapon, some non-core spells), call out alignment-based specifics for deityless casters. As far as flavor goes, clerics in your campaign could describe how their domain-choices relate back to the saints that they're following. if it's too much of a stretch, it might be a bad choice of domain? some clerics might have one of their domains chosen due to family or location as well (every 3 or so generations, a cleric is born to the massa family, and they always have the fire domain, something like that...)

In character, I would never want the domains mentioned.Ã,  I want the world to feel like it isn't that orderly and clerics don't choose domains and gain things from them, they just have powers from their patron.

Quote from: Black Jack Davey

Quote from: brainfaceyeah, core d&d actually allows deityless clerics. mechanically, they work just like the other clerics. you'll notice most spells that rely on deities (spiritual weapon, some non-core spells), call out alignment-based specifics for deityless casters. As far as flavor goes, clerics in your campaign could describe how their domain-choices relate back to the saints that they're following. if it's too much of a stretch, it might be a bad choice of domain? some clerics might have one of their domains chosen due to family or location as well (every 3 or so generations, a cleric is born to the massa family, and they always have the fire domain, something like that...)

In character, I would never want the domains mentioned.Ã,  I want the world to feel like it isn't that orderly and clerics don't choose domains and gain things from them, they just have powers from their patron.

You could always eliminate domains.Ã,  Maybe give clerics an extra feat or two to compensate.

QuoteIn character, I would never want the domains mentioned

I want the world to feel like it isn't that orderly and clerics don't choose domains and gain things from them, they just have powers from their patron.[/quote]describe[/i] their domains as more given than chosen.

For npcs, i mean, that's all up to you? i mean, you just pick whatever domains as you like whenever you draw up a cleric. if you want them to be a weird, perhaps heretical cleric, give them offbeat domains, i dunno.

Really, though, i wouldn't think a cleric in your world having a specific domain would be a greater quandry than him being a cleric to begin with.

I am still undecided concerning what I will do in the end, but the feedback has been helpful.  Thank you.

Let clerics select any domains that do not conflict with their alignment. Additionally, add "non-X" alignment restrictions to certain domains: Death and Destruction should be "non-good", while Healing, Protection, and Sun could be "non-evil". My setting is animistic, so effectively clerics can choose any domains as long as they can describe why a deity would offer both of those domains together.

I also suggest that if you want domains to be more important, make two changes to clerics. First, remove their +1 domain spell slot per spell level and remove the ability to spontaniously convert prepared spells into cure/inflict spells. In return, grant the ability to spontaniously convert prepared spells into a spell from one of the cleric's two domains of that spell's level or lower. This makes a cleric with the Healing domain an undeniably better healer than a cleric with the Destruction domain.

Now for a slight change of topic.  What do you think about domain powers in a low-magic setting? To me, it seems like they should not be there.  They seem to powerful and out of place.

Also, as far as clerics preparing spells...no.  I hate the idea of preparing spells and I don't use it.  I'm unsure of what do with clerics because of this.  

you could replace the cleric class with the favored soul, from complete divine.  They're spontaneous divine casters.

Quote from: Black Jack DaveyNow for a slight change of topic.  What do you think about domain powers in a low-magic setting? To me, it seems like they should not be there.  They seem to powerful and out of place.

Also, as far as clerics preparing spells...no.  I hate the idea of preparing spells and I don't use it.  I'm unsure of what do with clerics because of this.  

 :knock:  :hammer: them!!!

I dropped them from Nordica, which is low to middlin magic, and the gods are quite prevalent in that setting.

Quoteyou could replace the cleric class with the favored soul, from complete divine. They're spontaneous divine casters.

This is actually a very good suggestion. Each favored soul could be like a mortal touched by the gods; they'd be very special individuals. Most devoted followers of a particular religion could be replaced with low level adepts, and favored souls could be like the champions of the individual religions. That'd keep the magic levels down, and yet still enable PCs to be powerful divine minions.

Quote from: nastynate

Quoteyou could replace the cleric class with the favored soul, from complete divine. They're spontaneous divine casters.

This is actually a very good suggestion. Each favored soul could be like a mortal touched by the gods; they'd be very special individuals. Most devoted followers of a particular religion could be replaced with low level adepts, and favored souls could be like the champions of the individual religions. That'd keep the magic levels down, and yet still enable PCs to be powerful divine minions.

I suppose that could work...I'll have to look into the Favored Soul again, though.  I'll do that later.  Maybe that will mesh better with my ideas for an MP based system.