My motivation to work on my setting, and game info in general, is back. I am setting up a few things I am going to write and submit to Wizards (I believe next submission date is April), but I also want to work on my setting devoid of a system. I want to begin by writing the "beginning of the book", which I'd want to be brief overviews of the races and "classes" (whether they're actual classes or just character templates). I have decided on shooting for 2 page descriptions for everything, and putting any further detail in the "back of the book" for those whose interest is peaked by the 2 pager.
I'm a writer, but I'm also an over-writer. If I start writing about one of my races, I find that I quickly go past the allotted 2 pages. So, I'd like to know which things you find immediately necessary to know before playing in a setting you know nothing about.
3E D&D had the following information about each race:
- Brief Description
- Personality
- Physical Description
- Relations
- Alignment
- Settlements
- Religion
- Language
- Names
- Adventurers
- Stats
4th Edition boiled it down to:
- One line descriptions
- Stats
- Play an X if ...
- Physical Qualities
- Playing an X
- Personality Characteristics
- Names
- X Adventurers (description of 3 premades)
Back when I was using 3E, I frequently went overboard with those descriptions, but I find the 4E descriptions to be especially sparse. There has to be some middle ground. Which things do you absolutely need to know before starting to think about making a character?
Quote from: XeviatWhich things do you absolutely need to know before starting to think about making a character?
Since we're talking about races, for me, the main thing I want to know is how these guys are "not human." What's different about them, their biology, their cultures, and so on? If you don't have much space, then the simple things that really make them stand out are probably enough, on the other hand, to be able to fit
an entire race in 2 pages is obviously streamlining things for the sake of playability...
...and assuming most players are going to play them as basically human with a few quirks anyway. :grin:
Personality, religion and language are the parts I read first. It gives the race the general background I need to get behind them (or rather inside their heads). Then of course I always like the sample adventurers or the racial backgrounds - it mixes all the elements mentioned before and shows you one possible connoction - so you know how does it mix together.
Focusing on what makes them "not human" sounds like a great way to do it. That would really parse my posts down. It seems like History, for instance, isn't needed unless it is a huge part of the race (in which case it can be mentioned in the introduction).
Kalontas, you like the things which focus on character then? I'm not one for sample adventurers, but if enough people like them then I'll include them.
Quote from: XeviatKalontas, you like the things which focus on character then? I'm not one for sample adventurers, but if enough people like them then I'll include them.
Yes. While appearance is important too, for that I prefer an actual picture - and I want the words to paint a psychological picture in my head.
New System
Teaser (basic overview, 2-3 sentences)
Brief Description (Physical Description & Personality Characteristics)
Where they Fit (in the setting (History, religion, etc.))
Names
Stats
Play an X if ...
Stats
I'd say don't limit yourself and put everything in one place. That's probably why people don't read my stuff most of the time, though.
The question is whether or not you want to ever revisit those races again in the book itself. Specifically, I liked the brevity of the 4E entries, even if I twitched over the general lack of information. Is it impossible for you to add more in-depth discussions of culture/religion/homeland/racial relations later in the book?
As an over-writer, myself, I find that having one brief, easily-comprehensible overview piece helps relate to my longer walls-of-texts later on. Not everyone (In fact, most, based on my experiences) don't really give a damn about anything more than-- as Sparkle put it-- the "quirks" that make a race not-human.
I suggest this:
Flavor Text - I really loved these from the 3E Complete books. Most were nothing beyond little quotes, but I am a sucker for them.
Appearance - Sorry, but I hate pictures, mostly because they tend to be drawn by fantasy artists catering to stereotypes (http://browse.deviantart.com/?qh=§ion=&q=Master+Chief#/d30tm0o) rather than being anatomically correct depictions. However, in the current market, I think they are all but essential. If you have good pictures, then this is best used describing details not as obvious through looking at the creature.
Stats - Not necessarily at the top, but setting the stats aside in their own block in 4E was a good idea. Sometimes it was a little difficult to find the 3E racial abilities amidst walls of same-looking text. What language(s) they speak should go here, too, but you don't need to write a research paper on made-up languages-- do that later in the book, if you really want to.
Personality Characteristics - Namely, what kinds of character classes do they gravitate to, and what makes them different from humans. It should also explain how they relate to others within their own racial society. Lacking a dedicated section for interaction with other races, this should also include one or two major features of interactions or relations with other races. If you use alignment, you could probably fit that in here to save space and achieve the same result.
Sample Names - This is especially good if you have an existing earth culture in mind as a basis for your race. It also helps people make characters quicker, and it takes up little space, so that's a win-win.
"Brief" Description - Everything and anything else you still have room to fit. Depending on formatting and how much you reign yourself in, you could have up to a full page for this. I suggest using it to cover most of the elements that is important to the race. Some races may have virtues that favor their own culture highly, while others may have little care for their cultural history and instead be merry plundering pirates. This should probably include most of the elements you listed that didn't get their own cut, but it should also be tailored to the specifics of each race. If you can make this page two, then think of it as a one-page primer for a whole section later in the book.
!***Relations to other Races***! - Should only be used if you will NOT be adding any further races. Why? Because very little pisses me off as much as when a section like this fails to encompass all available races. Fail to heed this warning, and there shall be a Reckoning.
I don't like the "Relations to other races" sections at all, personally. It either assumes race-cultures (i.e., "the Elves" are one nation) or it assumes everyone is some sort of superficial racist. And, really, I'm not sure if a table is even needed for racial biases-- I think the general idea of "distrusting people who don't look like me" would work.
Quote from: sparkletwist
I don't like the "Relations to other races" sections at all, personally. It either assumes race-cultures (i.e., "the Elves" are one nation) or it assumes everyone is some sort of superficial racist. And, really, I'm not sure if a table is even needed for racial biases-- I think the general idea of "distrusting people who don't look like me" would work.
I agree. The writers are trying to use race as a way of saying "national culture" (i.e. instead of German-French relations, you have Wood Elf-Halfling relations). Its just awkward. Plus, the writers make the relationships far more personal/specific by stating things like "Elves like Halfling brandy but despise how thefts skyrocket every time a Halfling troupe comes to town."
See, I can do the "relations to other races" better in my setting as I know the overcultures that I'm using. Such an entry would be more of a cultural entry (and I'll probably end up having to fiddle with a race format to deal with culture). For instance, most races are distrustful of the Red Ifrit, as they're big on sacrificing their prisoners and a bit of ritualistic cannibalism, but the more chaotic races are perfectly fine with the Black Ifrit. I have two cultures for each of the non-human races in the continent I'm starting with, and four human cultures.
Thanks for the ideas folks. I'll be putting together some preliminaries and will be working on my wiki in the coming months.
[note]Resurrecting this old thread. I have incorporated suggestions form this thread, and I think I've created something that is workable. I worry I'm still over writing, but I'm always going to worry.
Now, I have chosen to present the race and cultures separately. I want to know your opinions on this set up; would it be better to choose on culture as "primary" and describe that first, then describe the other in terms of differences? Please let me know what you think.[/note] Dwarves
Dwarves, the final creation of the Earth Dragon, inhabit the mountains of the world. They are industrious and knowledgeable and are widely known as great craftsmen. Dwarves generally prefer to face their difficulties head on. Stability and tradition are tenants of their lives, and they fight hard to maintain them.
Physical Description
Dwarves stand an average of 4 to 4 1/2 feet tall, but their broad girth means they weigh between 150 and 200 pounds, with dwarven females being larger than males. They have broad chiseled features: large slightly upturned noses, small eyes, and wide mouths, with slightly enlarged canines and small sharp teeth. Both Dwarven men and women grow ample and thick hair, with women growing thick locks and men growing full beards; their hair partially grows down their upper back and upper chest, creating something of a mane. They have distinct markings in their hair, creating streaks of differing color, as well as markings that flare out from their eyes along their face.
Dwarves are carnivores, though they grow grain to feed their livestock. They age a little faster than humans. They are children at 2 years, adolescents at 9 years, young adults at 13 years, and adults at 16 years, reaching middle age at 30, and are venerable at 50. Dwarves rarely live beyond 70. It is a common misconception amongst humans that dwarves live extensively long; this is due to male dwarves growing their beards at age 10 and their hair graying to a dull silver as early as 30 (their dark hair markings generally take longer to gray).
Personality
Dwarves are often seen as stubborn, greedy, and reserved, but these flaws can just as often be the virtues of reliability, thrift, and cautiousness. They make friends slowly, but once friendship is given it is almost impossible to lose. If they are slighted, they typically deal out a punishment, and then the slight is forgiven (though sometimes the punishment is death). Value is of utmost importance, so if there is nothing to gain from a given endeavor, it will generally not be undertaken. While they tend to be stoic and rational, they are well known for their bouts of rage.
Deep Dwarves
The first of the dwarves, deep dwarves reside under the Grand Spire Mountains in central Krellshah. Their homes are built deep inside mountain caverns, which are beautifully and meticulously carved. They have less contact with the surface world, both protecting them from its dangers but cutting them off from its benefits. Deep dwarves are the most untrusting breed of dwarves.
Appearance
Deep dwarves are shorter and heavier than other dwarves. Their eyes are light blue or white, their hair is black (with rare brown and red) with paler markings, and their skin is a deep to grayish brown with tan markings flaring out from their eyes. Their clothes tend to be modest and simple, and are typically made of animal skins, although the wealthy wear imported cloth and silk. Dwarven craftsfolk favor wearing jewelry of their own creation, but their disdain of excessiveness generally has them wear only a single piece of jewelry at a time; this allows them to show their skill and wealth in a single stroke without being ostentatious. Deep Dwarven warriors favor their mining tools (hammers and picks) when they march into battle; almost all dwarven warriors carry shields, since longer weapons are difficult to wield in cramped tunnels. They favor metal armor, often meticulously crafted.
Culture
Deep dwarves place vast importance on honor and tradition in all aspects of life. Society is divided into professional castes, with only warriors and priests having real mobility. Individual families strive to profit by trading their excess with other families. Love is a non-issue for deep dwarves; marriages are organized to benefit families, and are kept together out of loyalty and honor. Females and males both work for their families, but females work within the family while males work outside. Settlements are typically a single clan (though Citadels are composed of many clans), and each clan is lead by a monarch. Power changes are rare, but they are swift to dispose an unfit ruler. They are distrustful of outsiders, but are forced to trade for food, making them cold and shrewd traders. They are deeply religious, both worshipping their creator Tyrannon and the spirits of their ancestors and the earth around them; their religion isn't dogmatic, rather it is focused on honoring and pleasing the spirits to receive blessings and guidance.
Names
Deep dwarves possess one name, given to them at birth, decided by the elders of their family and approved by elders of the clan (great care is taken to not repeat the name of great heroes or villains in their past, lest it color the dwarven child's destiny). Instead of possessing a family name, as humans do, deep dwarves generally refer to themselves as the child of their father or mother, and also the child of any great dwarves in their ancestry. Their clan also serves as an additional name, although the clan's name is often the clan's founder's name. A typical deep dwarven name might be "(name), son/daughter of (father's name), son/daughter of (family hero), of clan (founder's name)." Names, and the history and tradition they represent, are very important to dwarves.
Adventurers
Deep dwarven society possesses a great amount of structure and duty, where every dwarf has their place; thus, average dwarves rarely take up the life of an adventurer. Typical dwarven adventurers are warriors sent out on specific missions, dwarves from fallen families or clans trying to rebuild their family or clan honor, or dwarves who simply didn't fit in with typical society. Most deep dwarven adventurers are warriors or priests.
Hill Dwarves
The hill dwarves separated from the other dwarves at the same time the humans defeated the giants. While the deep dwarves dug into the mountains and closed their citadel doors to hide from the giants, the hill dwarves battled the giants and forced them further into the mountains; they then built a wall to hold them back. They settled into the mineral rich hills, and brought the knowledge of mining and metalworking to the new land. Rather than burrowing into the hillside and building a subterranean home, the hill dwarves chose to remain largely on the surface, and built strong relations with the local humans. They are less devoted to tradition and honor than other dwarves, and have instead developed a sense of community which extends to their friends and allies.
Appearance
Hill dwarves are slightly taller and considerably leaner than other dwarves. Their eyes are generally green, their hair is blonde or red with black markings, and their skin is a deep earthy brown with darker markings. They dress much like the Holylands humans, except their clothes are lighter and they don't favor coats. Common fashion encourages hill dwarves to keep their hair trim and well kept, unlike the wild manes of deep dwarves. Even when not on duty, or when retired, hill dwarves from the military are fond of wearing their badges and awards at all times. A well crafted sidearm is as fashionable as jewelry for other races. While many hill dwarven warriors wield the hammers and picks of their deep dwarf cousins, axes are common. Templar exclusively wield one-handed swords, in honor of the Gold Knight. They favor metal armor, and are fond of adding gold (or brass) trim.
Culture
Hill dwarven society is centered upon the community; everyone works for the community and the community provides for everyone. A monarch rules over their entire nation, but elected representatives lead each settlement. Families are matrilineal, but beyond living relatives only the community matters. Although most are free to move into any profession, all young adults are required to participate in the military for two years. Aside from expectant and nursing mothers, there is little societal differentiation between males and females; the only difference is during wartime, where males leave to fight and females remain to defend. Pragmatism puts little value on art, relegating them to the status of a hobby, except amongst the clergy; most hill dwarven art is religious in nature. Hill dwarven religion is a mixture of ancestral worship and the Holylands humans' tenants of chivalry (especially courage, since a hill dwarf once wielded the Gold Knight's sword). The clergy have little political influence, though their templar make up the elite forces of the military.
Names
A hill dwarf has three names. First, a personal name given to them by their parents on their first birthday; before that, they are referred to simply as "child", "son", or "daughter". Second is the name of their mother. Third is the name of their home. A typical hill dwarven name is (personal name), son/daughter of (mother's name), of (place). Upon marriage, a male hill dwarf replaces "son of (mother's name)" with "husband to (wife's name)". In large towns and cities, a hill dwarf's mother's name is replaced with a family name, which is typically the name of a former head of the family.
Adventurers
Hill dwarf adventurers are frequently on quests that relate directly to their community. Although their travels may take them far from home, the memory of their home is never far from their thoughts. They typically see their adventuring companions, even those who are non-dwarves, as part of their family, and often expect the same treatment in return. Some hill dwarves were too greedy and focused on personal gain for polite society, so they leave to find their fortunes else where. The quest to find the Gold Knight's sword is of particular importance to chivalrous hill dwarves, as they believe it is their destiny to wield it again. Most hill dwarven adventurers are warriors and warrior-priests.
Here's a version 2 of the Dwarves that is significanly parsed. I have removed the need for the cultural descriptions, and will talk about them in more detail in a later part of the book. I figure the consolidated "races" chapter would be better suited to exist to tell you what the race does (stats) and tell you enough about the race to decide if that's what you want to play. (It helps if I post the information ...)
Dwarves
Short, tough, hairy. Courageous, stoic, stubborn. Dwarves, the final creation of the Earth Dragon, inhabit the mountains and hills of the world. They are industrious and rational, and are widely known as great craftsmen. Dwarves generally prefer to face their difficulties head on. Stability and tradition are tenants of their lives, and they fight hard to maintain them.
Physical Description
Dwarves stand an average of 4 to 4 1/2 feet tall, but their broad girth means they weigh between 150 and 200 pounds, with dwarven females being larger than males. They have broad chiseled features: large slightly upturned noses, small eyes, and wide mouths, with slightly enlarged canines and small sharp teeth. Both Dwarven men and women grow ample and thick hair, with women growing thick locks and men growing full beards; their hair partially grows down their upper back and upper chest, creating something of a mane in males. They have distinct markings in their hair, creating streaks of differing color, as well as markings that flare out from their eyes along their face.
Personality
Dwarves are often seen as stubborn, greedy, and reserved, but these flaws can just as often be the virtues of reliability, thrift, and cautiousness. They make friends slowly, but once friendship is given it is almost impossible to lose. If they are slighted, they typically deal out a punishment, and then the slight is forgiven (though sometimes the punishment is death). Value is of utmost importance, so if there is nothing to gain from a given endeavor, it will generally not be undertaken. While they tend to be stoic and rational, they are well known for their bouts of rage.
Life and Society
Dwarf communities are made of deeply bound clans that are loosely bound together as a whole. A clan is an extended family, and clans are largely self sufficient. Clans work together as a community, but they also compete for prestige and power. Dwarves frequently worship Tyrannon, the Earth Dragon, their creator. He asks of them to build stone monuments, to seek the riches of the earth, and to remain stable and grounded. Dwarves also venerate their ancestors, the progenitors of their clans, and great heroes, striving to follow their examples and respect their memories.
Dwarves are carnivores, though they grow grain to feed their livestock. They age a little faster than humans. They are children at 2 years, adolescents at 9 years, young adults at 13 years, and adults at 16 years, reaching middle age at 30, and are venerable at 50. Dwarves rarely live beyond 70. It is a common misconception amongst humans that dwarves live extensively long; this is due to male dwarves growing their beards at age 10 and their hair graying to a dull silver as early as 30 (their dark hair markings generally take longer to gray).
Adventurers
Dwarven adventurers are often on quests that directly relate to their community. Although their travels may take them far from home, the memory of their home is never far from their thoughts. Their adventuring companions become an extension of their family. Other adventurers leave their homes behind to escape the strict and regimented society, embracing the wild chaos of the world that is so opposite their own natures. At their worst, dwarven adventurers embody selfishness and greed.
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Do you think the parsed version is better?
Well, instead of somewhere between a 3x race description and a 4e race description, I am getting comfortable with Rite Publishing's format of an entire book (20 - 30 page) dedicated to each race: biology, culture, society, 'in character' description, size/weight, age span; then on to game mechanics: favored classes, class archetypes, racial paragon class, new traits, feats, equipment/weapons, and new racial magic items.
One thing to note is Rite Publishing's concept of racial paragon class. It's not the same as paragon was described for 3x monsters. A Rite Publishing paragon class is a 20 level depiction of race doing what the race is best at.
For example, the Taurian race is based on Minotaurs. In the Bestiary, minotaur is a CR4 monster. In the paragon class, once a taurian is 4th level, he is equivalent to the bestiary listing of racial features for minotaurs. This means a 1st - 3rd level minotaur has less features than that of the bestiary listing. On the other hand from 5th - 20th level, the Taurian gets progressively better at doing minotaur things than the bestiary version. Minotaurs of the taurian race increase in natural armor, increased damage from gore attacks, get enlarged to the next size modifier, gain extra speed, special axe wielding capability, etc.
When I make a simple monster stat block, I use what comes in the bestiary. When truly describing a race though, I'm thinking in multiple pages...
Sounds like a cool way to do expansions, and it's something I would definitely consider for as future "supplements", but right now I'm worrying about how to write up a brief explanation of each race at the beginning of my "book". In the introductory chapter, each of the races and classes are explained in quick two sentence descriptions, so that a player can decide what seems interesting. They then move onto the race chapter and can see more detail, and it is then they pick their race. For those players who want more detail, I could see giving each race a chapter in a later section (since my "book" is just going to be an expanding wiki, unless D&D5's licensing is like 3rd's).
The race-as-class writeup would have excited me back in my D&D3 days. We had a player who was using the Savage Species level breakdown for his half-orc barbarian turned werewolf, and was progressing towards being a werewolf lord (were-dire wolf).
Quote from: Xeviatrace-as-class
That sounds like original old Basic D&D.
My class is "Dwarf"! :D
If they were alongside the standard classes, I would actually welcome "Dwarf", "Elf", and even "Human" as prebuilt class/multiclass templates. It both helps you to see what the bulk of people would be (not the specialists), and also really strengthens the theme of races. What would "human" be you ask? A generic "hero", the sort we see in many fantasy stories. Someone who can do a bit of everything, a jack of all trades who doesn't sing like a bard. Some small measure of spellcasting, but drawn from all of the classes (switching on my 3E brain, perhaps a 1st-4th level spell progression like the Paladin and Ranger), with some good fighting ability but not the specialties of the fighter.
So does my shortened Dwarf entry there hit all the points needed to play one (aside from stats that is)?