This is the discussion thread for Dilandri, located here (http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?24254).
The exits are located at the front and side walls of the building, keep your hands, arms, and other appendages inside the thread at all times. Thank you and have a nice flight. :)
"Sunken Hills" is what grabbed my attention. Probably because they're sunken. Oh, and a fantasy world thriving on the fruits of trade and tourism? You bet I'm there!
I like that you start with a quotation from text in the setting. It kind of adds to the mythic, surreal feel. Other than that, I'll wait to see more before making comments.
Added some stuff about magic, hopefully I'll get some more stuff up this weekend.
Added some racial information on the humans, elves, and h-elves. Will try and get gnomes, halflings, orcs, and half orcs up tonight or Saturday.
Comment would be greatly appreciated.
Quote from: Phoenix KnightI like that you start with a quotation from text in the setting. It kind of adds to the mythic, surreal feel. Other than that, I'll wait to see more before making comments.
Thanks. I'm trying to get at least a small bit of text like that in each bit for exactly that reason.
Quote from: Sà ¤µà ¤¿à ¤·à ¥Âà ¤£à ¥ÂA Eponymity"Sunken Hills" is what grabbed my attention. Probably because they're sunken. Oh, and a fantasy world thriving on the fruits of trade and tourism? You bet I'm there!
I hope I don't disappoint with the Sunken Hills; it's my favorite region.
I like the new Table of Contents; using spoiler blocks in my own setting's Table of Contents is definately something I'm going to have to implement as well.
Quote from: Epic MeepoI like the new Table of Contents; using spoiler blocks in my own setting's Table of Contents is definately something I'm going to have to implement as well.
Glad I could help.
In other news... I've hit a bad creativity block, and am open to suggestions. What do you want to see next on this setting? What kind of questions do you have? Right now, I'm also taking suggestions for crystal powers, because I can't think of any. I'd really appreciate something to go on here. Thanks.
Well, I went headlong into this campaign with the intention of some heavy reviewing. It turns out there's not a lot here yet.
I read the opening quote and was a little confused. After some reference to a jewel in the sky I have to ask: Is Dilandri where the Gods live, or the world the campaign is set in?
How do orcs sail amongst the sunken hills? Are there rivers or something?
Tell us about the Five Gods. Who are they? Who worships them? Are they all good? All neutral? All evil? Are some good and some evil? Is there an opposing force?
Give us some regional information. Maybe a map? How big is the southern forest if the halflings that live there outnumber humans (who seem to control more land)
You could elaborate on the races. Describe the cultures of the races; don't just mention the source material. What if we don't know what Celtic culture was like? How then would we know what elves are like? Do the races use the same stats presented in the PHB or are they getting new ones?
I guess that's a lot of questions, but it's some things to think about.
Quote from: Seraphine_HarmoniumI guess that's a lot of questions, but it's some things to think about.
Which is exactly what I wanted. Thanks. It looks like I'm going to be polishing up the races, start a bit on the religions, followed by a brief description of all the regions and a map or eight.
I have a question about the half orcs. How are they exactly maintained as a race? Is 'half orc' just a euphemism for people who are descended of humans and orcs and generally breed among themselves?
Quote from: TybaltI have a question about the half orcs. How are they exactly maintained as a race? Is 'half orc' just a euphemism for people who are descended of humans and orcs and generally breed among themselves?
They are a race descendant from both humans and orcs. They can breed true, so they perpetuate like that. They are also usually where offspring of humans and orcs wind up, as that is still common.
I've been thinking. With the Arcanist class as a mix between the sorcerer and the Wizard, those two classes are going to look rather sad, especially the sorcerer, unchanged. Should I bother? Would it be bad to just go with the Arcanist? Or should I alter the wizard and sorcerer to keep up? If so, what would you suggest?
I feel that the Wizard and Sorcerer are already almost redundant. Yes there are subtle differences, but they use all the same spells, both have familiars, both have a d4 HD. I would say replace them both with your Arcanist. I'm planning to replace both classes with a single class in Avayevnon as well.
Quote from: Seraphine_HarmoniumI feel that the Wizard and Sorcerer are already almost redundant. Yes there are subtle differences, but they use all the same spells, both have familiars, both have a d4 HD. I would say replace them both with your Arcanist. I'm planning to replace both classes with a single class in Avayevnon as well.
Fair enough. Good to know I'm not way off base. And it means LESS WORK FOR ME! WOHOO!
The crystal magic stuff is interesting. It almost feels a little Final Fantasy.
I think you know, but the maps are not visible in the spoilers?
Minor note, your last post says "Region," but I think you meant "Religion" based on the subject matter.
You have an interesting emphasis on numbers.
Quote from: Phoenix KnightThe crystal magic stuff is interesting. It almost feels a little Final Fantasy.
Heh. That's odd, I've never played final fantasy.
Quote from: Phoenix KnightI think you know, but the maps are not visible in the spoilers?
There should be one map there. The others I'm still working on.
Quote from: Phoenix KnightMinor note, your last post says "Region," but I think you meant "Religion" based on the subject matter.
Thanks for the catch. Fixed.
Quote from: Phoenix KnightYou have an interesting emphasis on numbers.
...Thanks...I think.
Quote from: stargate525Quote from: Phoenix KnightYou have an interesting emphasis on numbers.
...Thanks...I think.
Heh, it was intended as a compliment. I meant that many real world cultures have concepts of sacred numbers. In your case, that number is five. You have five main gods, each of which (if I understand correctly) had five subservient gods. And so forth.
Quote from: Phoenix KnightQuote from: stargate525Quote from: Phoenix KnightYou have an interesting emphasis on numbers.
...Thanks...I think.
Heh, it was intended as a compliment. I meant that many real world cultures have concepts of sacred numbers. In your case, that number is five. You have five main gods, each of which (if I understand correctly) had five subservient gods. And so forth.
Ah. sorry, you're first post kinda confused me. You're right about the God's thing, but there are NOT going to be 125 Gods subservient to the Children... I'm not thinking them all up at least. :)
I think I'll holdoff on the review until you've got a little more, but I figured I'd point out that ElDo or Ishy would no doubt be happy to move Korumaine's post if you PMed one of them.
Quote from: RaelifinI think I'll holdoff on the review until you've got a little more, but I figured I'd point out that ElDo or Ishy would no doubt be happy to move Korumaine's post if you PMed one of them.
I'm trudging as fast as I can damnit! x. Seriously though, i look forward to seeing the review, it'll give me incentive to work faster.
I was actually about to do that. I did report it, but as you suggest, a PM might be better.
QuoteIt is fortunate that spend most of their time infighting with each other; acting as a single force, they would outnumber every other navy on Dilandri combined
This sentence confused me a bit and I would suggest it be re-written as:
"It comes as a blessing to the nations of Dilandri that they spend most of their time infighting, for if they were to act as a unified force they would outnumber all other navies on Dilandri combined."
Also, perhaps it would be a good thing to give reasoning why each races disagrees on the origins of the Sunken Hills. Perhaps the orcs (seafarers as they are) have a culture that places heavy emphasis on the stars. They worship the wonder of the stars and use them to guide their ships. Having observed the paths of comets across the night sky and seeing how they seem to fall from their heavenly office, they cannot help but notices the masses of land they navigate between.
Quote from: Seraphine_HarmoniumQuoteIt is fortunate that spend most of their time infighting with each other; acting as a single force, they would outnumber every other navy on Dilandri combined
This sentence confused me a bit and I would suggest it be re-written as:
"It comes as a blessing to the nations of Dilandri that they spend most of their time infighting, for if they were to act as a unified force they would outnumber all other navies on Dilandri combined."
Also, perhaps it would be a good thing to give reasoning why each races disagrees on the origins of the Sunken Hills. Perhaps the orcs (seafarers as they are) have a culture that places heavy emphasis on the stars. They worship the wonder of the stars and use them to guide their ships. Having observed the paths of comets across the night sky and seeing how they seem to fall from their heavenly office, they cannot help but notices the masses of land they navigate between.
I definitely like your sentence better. Consider it stolen, along with the star idea being abducted into the black hole that is my notes for review. :D
One good turns another, or so it goes.
You mention that tourism is a pretty big thing in Dilandri, but what about economic or political interaction? With elves being like the Japanese, and gnomes being like a "race of Da Vinci's," I'd like to see what kind of economic and political interactions take place between the various regions.
Does one group hate the other? Do some groups get along particularly well?
Does one region have an abundance of a certain resource that it can export? Does one region have a lack for said resource and must import it?
You mentioned the elves are sort of isolationist. Do they have everything they need? Or do they import a lot of resources?
I think these questions should help you flesh the regions out a little more. furthermore, since I just skimmed it over, if the answers to some of these are in there, perhaps you should consider making them stand out a little more.
Quote from: limetomOne good turns another, or so it goes.
You mention that tourism is a pretty big thing in Dilandri, but what about economic or political interaction? With elves being like the Japanese, and gnomes being like a "race of Da Vinci's," I'd like to see what kind of economic and political interactions take place between the various regions.
Does one group hate the other? Do some groups get along particularly well?
Does one region have an abundance of a certain resource that it can export? Does one region have a lack for said resource and must import it?
You mentioned the elves are sort of isolationist. Do they have everything they need? Or do they import a lot of resources?
I think these questions should help you flesh the regions out a little more. furthermore, since I just skimmed it over, if the answers to some of these are in there, perhaps you should consider making them stand out a little more.
It think all those questions are answered at least partially in the Relatiosn thread of the specific race. You're right though, they do need to be highlighted and expanded. Guess it's time to add some more stuff.
I wanted to add that I do rather like your way of fitting magic into the context of your game. Many fantasy settings just sort of assume that 'there's magic' but I like the fact that it is part of the very existence of society and how the world works. I was thinking that the crystals are a good expression of that; you might want to expand upon insofar as how the particular races and viewpoints see them and their uses.
Quote from: TybaltI wanted to add that I do rather like your way of fitting magic into the context of your game. Many fantasy settings just sort of assume that 'there's magic' but I like the fact that it is part of the very existence of society and how the world works. I was thinking that the crystals are a good expression of that; you might want to expand upon insofar as how the particular races and viewpoints see them and their uses.
Thanks. I'll keep that in mind for when I overhaul that section.
Since the weekend is approaching quickly, I can get some more of this setting done. I don't have anything really burning for me to write down, so I'm open to suggestions. What do you want to see more of by Monday?
I'm still working on this, I promise. In case any of you guys are watching....
Oh, we're watching you...
As I promised, here's the start of my Dilandri Review
I have some questions about the Arcanist; their number of "arcs" aren't given on the table, like the description says it is. If I'm understanding this correctly, an Arcanist can access any spell in their spellbook, but they can only have a number readied at any one time (and they get a number equal to their level as mastered spells). So, if I'm still understanding, they're a mixture of spontaneous and preparatory; I like it.
I finished reading your races and gods, and I like them very much. I particularly like the uniqueness of their origins, how they are all tied to a single pantheon of deities. They all fit together very well. I also like that Orcs are sea farers; the other races seem fairly unique too, but they still feel the same. The fact that you seemed to have not needed to create new races as of yet makes your setting all the more approachable.
As for the deities, which your setting focuses on greatly, I'll try to comment on them individually:
First, The Five don't seem to have really defined portfolios of their own. Did you intend this? What do they do themselves? Do they just designate tasks to their children? And, for what reason is Lilnith LE instead of NE? Was that a typo?
I really like the origin of the gnomes and halflings, thus I like Quarren. Again, since I can't get a good feeling for the Five's portfolios, I'm not sure what else to say about them.
I guess I'd like to see the Children of Luminor updated more; I don't really have an impression of them. One question, though; if Luminor and Lilnith only had one child, where did the other children come from? Did they just come from themselves? Why is Lor evil (unless he does evil things with his servants that is)? The rivalry between Caed and Gudruun is quite amusing. Ganes made me laugh, and the thought of gnomes running around crying "Ni" did too (like Monte Python much?). I like the fact that your deities seem to have lives, even though they haven't been detailed to much. More detail on them would be appreciated, and I'll try to come up with some good questions on them specifically.
I will read and review more soon.
Quote from: XeviatAs I promised, here's the start of my Dilandri Review
You promised a review? I don't remember it, but thanks.
Quote from: XeviatI have some questions about the Arcanist; their number of "arcs" aren't given on the table, like the description says it is. If I'm understanding this correctly, an Arcanist can access any spell in their spellbook, but they can only have a number readied at any one time (and they get a number equal to their level as mastered spells). So, if I'm still understanding, they're a mixture of spontaneous and preparatory; I like it.
First, the reason the arcs are missing is because the crunch of the magic section is still in flux. Once that's cemented, the arcs will be too.
And I originally saw them as essentially a sorceror with a spellbook, but I think I like your idea of having a prepared list of spells that can be casted spontaneously. I'll have to think on this.
Quote from: XeviatI finished reading your races and gods, and I like them very much. I particularly like the uniqueness of their origins, how they are all tied to a single pantheon of deities. They all fit together very well. I also like that Orcs are sea farers; the other races seem fairly unique too, but they still feel the same. The fact that you seemed to have not needed to create new races as of yet makes your setting all the more approachable.
I'm assuming by 'feeling the same' you meant that they still feel like I pulled them straight out of the book. I was originally going to have five extra races, but early on I decided that I had enough races already to accomplish what I wanted to do with them, so they were dropped. The only one that I think I radically changed is the halflings; I'll try and get more on them up after my next update.
Quote from: XeviatAs for the deities, which your setting focuses on greatly, I'll try to comment on them individually:
First, The Five don't seem to have really defined portfolios of their own. Did you intend this? What do they do themselves? Do they just designate tasks to their children? And, for what reason is Lilnith LE instead of NE? Was that a typo?
Yes. That was a typo. I will fix. As for the actual five, I don't intend them to have too fleshed out of a portfolio, since they are not nearly as involved in the affairs of Dilandri than are the 25. You could say that they designate tasks to the five below them, but you could also say that the five below them are aspects of themselves personified. Another thing that I'll have to think on.
Quote from: XeviatI really like the origin of the gnomes and halflings, thus I like Quarren. Again, since I can't get a good feeling for the Five's portfolios, I'm not sure what else to say about them.
I'm glad you liked the origin; that was a result of me thinking up an explanation spur of the moment as to why there are six races and only five main deities.
Quote from: XeviatI guess I'd like to see the Children of Luminor updated more; I don't really have an impression of them. One question, though; if Luminor and Lilnith only had one child, where did the other children come from? Did they just come from themselves?
The child spoken of are the orcs. The 'children of the five' are deities. Either the gods' current partners aren't mentioned, or there was some kind of hanky panky going on with mortals, or they can simply create offspring. I haven't really decided yet.
You should keep in mind though, that the myths and legends in Dilandri are very much myths and legends. Stories of an event or the creation of a place can be completely different and even contradictory, depending on the race telling it.
Quote from: XeviatWhy is Lor evil (unless he does evil things with his servants that is)?
I think it was because that at the time I was planning on running the gods as a 'you are what you're worshiped as' kind of thing, and most societies consider death an evil. I've readjusted my outlook on that a bit, and am considering changing him to LN.
Quote from: XeviatThe rivalry between Caed and Gudruun is quite amusing. Ganes made me laugh, and the thought of gnomes running around crying "Ni" did too (like Monte Python much?).
Ni...? Crap, I completely forgot I left that in there. What can I say, a result of thinking up names and information at the wee hours of the morning.
Quote from: XeviatI like the fact that your deities seem to have lives, even though they haven't been detailed to much. More detail on them would be appreciated, and I'll try to come up with some good questions on them specifically.
I await them with great anticipation.
Quote from: XeviatI will read and review more soon.
I can't wait.
Stargate,
I owe you a more a review for your help on Five Realms last weekend so here it is.
First off a non setting comment. I really like the way you have layed the setting out. The format is very easy to read and flows very well. I especially like your little notes about inspiration. It is a peak inside your thought processes on the building. I will admit I may steal the format for my worlds too.
The Races-while you have tied the races to their individual lands you have given excellent reasons for how and why they all interrelate which helps bring the world together. You mention in the human post that they recognize only political boundaries vs racial ones. Is there a reason for that? I also like how when you have changed the 'typical' view of a race you give an excellent reason of how this came about. The half-orcs as an example.
Your regions section again is excellent. You have given such little details as 'the second and third largest rivers' which draws the reader further into the world. I look forward to seeing more maps!
Religion-I have to say creating 30 gods is a massive undertaking. Hats off to you. I like the Five a lot. You are excellent at tying your ideas together. I like the gnome/halfling split from Quarren, but was wondering if there was a reason that Theomis hadn't created his own race by then since everyone else had. The lost child of Quarren is inspired. As a player I would want to find out anything I could to discover who that was. Your gods are well thought out and cover just about anything a person would want to worship.
I would like to see further expansion on the actual religions of the world. For some reason that part of a fantasy world completely fascinates me and with your complex set of pantheons I think the actual religious heirarchys would be amazing. I would also like to see a chart detailing the Five, their children and then lines connecting the gods to their respective opposed.
Crystals-This is such a nice way to get away from the material components aspect of arcane magic. It appears that you can grow any of the types of crystals that are listed. Are there special requirements or materials needed to grow a Ionir versus a Kuvu?
Governments-In the dwarven Dauken you mention a metal that can improve other metals. Did I miss this metal being named or explained?
Chronology-excellent work on describing the various moon phases and how those days are viewed by the populace. And how it impacts magic.
Dragonfest- so do both the dwarves and halflings celebrate this festival? And separately? The way I first read it it seemed that they took turns being in charge of it. By the end it is obvious that they each do celebrate it. I would be interested in knowing more of this story.
Myths and Legends- your side note says that you are going to play to your strengths and you do. Each one that is currently listed is in a different 'voice' that makes it very easy to believe that it was written by a different race. Excellent job. I can't wait to see what other Myth and legends you create.
Even though we both of a Five themed worlds you have used that idea much more pervasively throughout your world to its benefit. I look forward to reading more.
Quote from: RavenspathFirst off a non setting comment. I really like the way you have layed the setting out. The format is very easy to read and flows very well. I especially like your little notes about inspiration. It is a peak inside your thought processes on the building. I will admit I may steal the format for my worlds too.
Thanks. I'm glad to see that someone likes those. I'll try and remember to keep adding them in, and feel free to steal the idea.
Quote from: RavenspathYou mention in the human post that they recognize only political boundaries vs racial ones. Is there a reason for that?
Yes. The humans as a collective are dozens of different kingdoms, and do little as a cohesive race. They are the only ones like this in Dilandri with the exception of maybe the dwarves. When dealing with another race, the humans don't see 'the halfling nation,' they see each individual territory as a different kingdom, and they cna't understand why the type of politics they have is not present among them.
Quote from: RavenspathYour regions section again is excellent. You have given such little details as 'the second and third largest rivers' which draws the reader further into the world. I look forward to seeing more maps!
I'm considering re-doing the maps, if I can find a different idea for mountains.
Quote from: RavenspathReligion-I have to say creating 30 gods is a massive undertaking. Hats off to you. I like the Five a lot. You are excellent at tying your ideas together. I like the gnome/halfling split from Quarren, but was wondering if there was a reason that Theomis hadn't created his own race by then since everyone else had. The lost child of Quarren is inspired. As a player I would want to find out anything I could to discover who that was. Your gods are well thought out and cover just about anything a person would want to worship.
Believe me, it was hard as heck to do. You missed something though, Theomis is the patron of Dwarves and Halflings; the dwarves he created, the halflings he adopted. It's kind of interesting to me, but both of the things you mention liking came around by accident. I needed a reason that the lawful god had two races, and I had six gods under the Lilnith and only four under Quarren, and I needed to balance.
Quote from: RavenspathI would like to see further expansion on the actual religions of the world. For some reason that part of a fantasy world completely fascinates me and with your complex set of pantheons I think the actual religious heirarchys would be amazing. I would also like to see a chart detailing the Five, their children and then lines connecting the gods to their respective opposed.
Don't worry, more detail is on the way. As for the chart idea, consider it stolen; it'll help me as much as the readers.
Quote from: RavenspathCrystals-This is such a nice way to get away from the material components aspect of arcane magic. It appears that you can grow any of the types of crystals that are listed. Are there special requirements or materials needed to grow a Ionir versus a Kuvu?
well there is a minimum caster level, an xp cost, and a gp cost, just like creating normal magic items. You could certainly play it that the character must quest around to find the ingredients, or just that he can buy them from the local shop. If you wanted an idea of what it would be, I'd say a fragment of the crystal they want to grow, probably from one that's been burnt out, some sort of growing medium for the crystal to sit on, and a container to house the mineral water for the crystal.
Quote from: RavenspathGovernments-In the dwarven Dauken you mention a metal that can improve other metals. Did I miss this metal being named or explained?
no you didn't. I haven't gotten to the section on special materials yet.
Quote from: RavenspathChronology-excellent work on describing the various moon phases and how those days are viewed by the populace. And how it impacts magic.
Thanks. I'm still a bit on the fence about keeping the magic impact or not, but I think it only enhances playing one.
I'm trying to figure out a way to get a calendar up, so watch out for that.
Quote from: RavenspathDragonfest- so do both the dwarves and halflings celebrate this festival? And separately? The way I first read it it seemed that they took turns being in charge of it. By the end it is obvious that they each do celebrate it. I would be interested in knowing more of this story.
The dwarves and halflings celebrate it separately, they don't like each other, remember? I'll probably get the full story in under myths and legends, once I figure out the whole thing.
Quote from: RavenspathMyths and Legends- your side note says that you are going to play to your strengths and you do. Each one that is currently listed is in a different 'voice' that makes it very easy to believe that it was written by a different race. Excellent job. I can't wait to see what other Myth and legends you create.
This is the best part of your entire review, mostly because it's stroking my ego ;) . I'm glad to see I'm not delusional when I talk about my writing skills. Expect some more this weekend, I've got monday off.
Quote from: RavenspathEven though we both of a Five themed worlds you have used that idea much more pervasively throughout your world to its benefit. I look forward to reading more.
Thanks again, I look forward to creating more. :)
...oh, and check your inbox.
Hi there--out of curiousity how much racial intermingling is there? If the gnomish nation is split into three governed areas that are independant but cooperative and humans for instance don't know about it then I take it there is little interaction on a regular basis? (I assume btw that merchants must travel there but perhaps not many?)
Quote from: TybaltHi there--out of curiousity how much racial intermingling is there? If the gnomish nation is split into three governed areas that are independant but cooperative and humans for instance don't know about it then I take it there is little interaction on a regular basis? (I assume btw that merchants must travel there but perhaps not many?)
There actually is quite a bit of intermingling. I said that ignorant outsiders wouldn't know, meaning that people who have just heard about the gnomes might assume that they are a single country.
Perhaps I should have been more clear.
I really like the setting as it appears so far, especially the emphasis on trade and travel. Gives a great excuse for the characters to go out and explore the world even without anything massively out-of-the-ordinary going on to force them to.
I also like your honourable, jungle-warrior Halflings. More on them would be great.
The one thing that immediately struck me about this setting that I didn't like, was the use of the old "madcap inventor" archetype for the Gnomes. In fact, I only skimmed the entry on Gnomes after catching a couple of keywords that put me off. Now, that archetype may well work fine for you, and many others, but it's one I don't think I can ever like :P
Your Gods are good, I like the fact you have a God "of the elements." It's a pretty swish idea that I'd been toying with myself for quite a while. I also like the concept of each of the "Big Five" having their own "Little Five"
As you may be able to tell from the way I'm writing my own setting, I'm a big fan of using narrative to paint pictures of the world's elements. I always find this gives a much more vivid image than regular descriptive text (although some people have such a way with words that their descriptions are as vivid as others' narratives).
Anyway, it'd be nice to see a couple of little snippets of narrative, just to illustrate what kind of people live in the world, and what they get up to.
Overall, I like the work. Give me more Jungle Halflings!
Quote from: KindlingI really like the setting as it appears so far, especially the emphasis on trade and travel. Gives a great excuse for the characters to go out and explore the world even without anything massively out-of-the-ordinary going on to force them to.
Thanks. I'm in the bad habit of running my campaigns completely urban becuase I don't like that everywhere needs people's help RIGHT NOW. I wanted a reason to explore the place other than 'kill people and take their stuff'.
Quote from: KindlingI also like your honourable, jungle-warrior Halflings. More on them would be great.
Coming up!
Quote from: KindlingThe one thing that immediately struck me about this setting that I didn't like, was the use of the old "madcap inventor" archetype for the Gnomes. In fact, I only skimmed the entry on Gnomes after catching a couple of keywords that put me off. Now, that archetype may well work fine for you, and many others, but it's one I don't think I can ever like :P
Dangit, My gnomes aren't 'madcap inventors' simply because they've got flying machines! They're a brilliant race of philosophers, chemists, surgeons, doctors, radiation scientists...
alright, so they might be a tad bit madcap. ;) That wasn't exactly what I was going for, so it's time for a retooling.
Quote from: KindlingAnyway, it'd be nice to see a couple of little snippets of narrative, just to illustrate what kind of people live in the world, and what they get up to.
So, quotes from historic texts aren't enough then? ;) Narratives, coming up. It'll give me a chance to exercise my writing muscles anyway.
Quote from: KindlingOverall, I like the work. Give me more Jungle Halflings!
I'm trudging as fast as I can damnit! x.
I'm sorry if I may have slightly misintepreted your Gnomes, as I said I did only skim their entry after seeing a couple of phrases that turned me off to them.
I appreciate that they're a hard race to do well, as every single one of the stereotypes for them is comical. Making Gnomes come across serious is, in my mind, so hard a task that I would never attempt it, but rather simply omit them from a setting, so kudos for trying!
I have only read through your Races section so far. I will read the rest later. While reading it I jotted down my thoughts as I read the section. I skimmed this thread and I think there are some answers to questions I asked, like the "Do half-orcs breed true?", but I have not amended the thoughts below.
Races:
Humans:
Humans aren't the most abundant race? I like that it gets away from the norm a little, but not too much which is good. Is taxidermy popular with your Urban Humans? Meaning is hunting a popular form of showing that one has traveled the world, or do your humans just buy items in far off nations and then display them in their home or on their person?
Elves:
What made your Elves so insular? Did your elves know that there was a world beyond the cliffs and choose to stay where they were? How long ago were they discovered? If they wanted to remain hidden why did they not take the gnome expedition captive or even kill them?
Half-Elves:
Who do the half-elves moderate between?
If Half-elves are relatively young in the world how did they get a parcel of semi-fertile land? Since they have there own land do they breed true?
There may be a lot of potential here for a 'new' race. I put new in quotes because they would basically have the half-elf's stats with a new name. They would be a race that when bred with each other spawns another of there kind, but there are those with purer blood. The ones that come from a union of a Human and Elf are the purer bloods. (They can have more of a blending of Human and Elf stats with a +1 maybe +2 level adjustments.) This is your setting so if you don't like the idea you can tell me to bugger off. :)
Gnomes:
Gnomes are tinkerers? I really don't care for this. It is used a lot, but if it works for you then more power to you. Add-On: I suppose they do work well, since a few of your other races are not within the norm.
Halflings:
I like these Halflings a lot. There is not much more I need to say here.
Half-Orcs:
Like Half-elves, do half-orcs breed true?
If banishment is one of the highest forms of punishment; are they very group oriented? Do they value families, and group activities over being alone? If they do it would make being alone even more of a punishment.
Dwarves:
I don't know what to say about the dwarves. I like them, but they seem to be missing something I can't put my finger on it.
Races in general:
While reading your races I found something odd. I definitely like your trade and travel theme you have with the Humans, but after reading your races it doesn't seem to make sense. You have seven races. Of those seven, three are newly discovered, insular, and/or hostile, who don't really need to trade because they don't want to and they have been suppling their own goods for so long. Two are suppliers of grain and other trade items. That leaves only two races that would buy these trade goods and one of those is trying to cut Humans out of the picture. Are Orcs and Gnomes need Human grain that much?
Quote from: PoseidonHumans:
Humans aren't the most abundant race? I like that it gets away from the norm a little, but not too much which is good. Is taxidermy popular with your Urban Humans? Meaning is hunting a popular form of showing that one has traveled the world, or do your humans just buy items in far off nations and then display them in their home or on their person?
I hadn't even thought of taxidermy. I was thinking primarily artifacts and cultural items. Taxidermy has merit though, so I'll give it some thought.
Quote from: PoseidonElves:
What made your Elves so insular? Did your elves know that there was a world beyond the cliffs and choose to stay where they were? How long ago were they discovered? If they wanted to remain hidden why did they not take the gnome expedition captive or even kill them?
They were discovered some time ago, but the elves remain insular primarily by choice after seeing how the other races get along. I wanted to heighten the haughtiness that most elves seem to be played with almost to the ridiculous, and this is what I came up with. The reason they didn't screw around with the gnome expedition is that the elves were initially curious, until they actually looked out at the world.
Quote from: PoseidonHalf-Elves:
Who do the half-elves moderate between?
Humans and elves.
Quote from: PoseidonIf Half-elves are relatively young in the world how did they get a parcel of semi-fertile land? Since they have there own land do they breed true?
There may be a lot of potential here for a 'new' race. I put new in quotes because they would basically have the half-elf's stats with a new name. They would be a race that when bred with each other spawns another of there kind, but there are those with purer blood. The ones that come from a union of a Human and Elf are the purer bloods. (They can have more of a blending of Human and Elf stats with a +1 maybe +2 level adjustments.) This is your setting so if you don't like the idea you can tell me to bugger off. :)
Bugger off. ;)
But seriously, that's an idea. Half-elves aren't that new; they are humans with mixed in elven blood. The reason they have that land is that that's where the more explorative elves landed. Once they became a definable separate species, they were shunned.
Quote from: PoseidonGnomes:
Gnomes are tinkerers? I really don't care for this. It is used a lot, but if it works for you then more power to you. Add-On: I suppose they do work well, since a few of your other races are not within the norm.
Sigh... I must have really, really screwed up my description of gnomes. I was aiming for DaVinci, Plato, and Archimedes, not 'blow up your house generic mad scientist.'
Quote from: PoseidonHalflings:
I like these Halflings a lot. There is not much more I need to say here.
:)
Quote from: PoseidonHalf-Orcs:
Like Half-elves, do half-orcs breed true?
If banishment is one of the highest forms of punishment; are they very group oriented? Do they value families, and group activities over being alone? If they do it would make being alone even more of a punishment.
Yes, half-orcs breed true. Banishment is a high form of punishment for two reasons. One, it's difficult for an orc to exist outside of a teamwork setting; they got free from under the orcs by working together, and that tradition still carries over. Two, it's downright dangerous in the regions the half-orcs live. Unless you're very good or very lucky, banishment is essentially a death sentence with a waiting period.
Quote from: PoseidonDwarves:
I don't know what to say about the dwarves. I like them, but they seem to be missing something I can't put my finger on it.
Oddly enough, I've had that feeling too. If you figure it out, please tell me. It may be that they're the only race I really haven't tweaked.
Quote from: PoseidonRaces in general:
While reading your races I found something odd. I definitely like your trade and travel theme you have with the Humans, but after reading your races it doesn't seem to make sense. You have seven races. Of those seven, three are newly discovered, insular, and/or hostile, who don't really need to trade because they don't want to and they have been suppling their own goods for so long. Two are suppliers of grain and other trade items. That leaves only two races that would buy these trade goods and one of those is trying to cut Humans out of the picture. Are Orcs and Gnomes need Human grain that much?
Argh, more spotlight on my faults! x.
I haven't fleshed out the trade as much as I want to yet. Basically, the only ones that aren't getting grain from the humans are the half elves and the elves. Dwarves and Half-Orcs supply crystals, Halflings supply abundant and as-yet-unnamed resources from their jungle, and the Gnomes are traders in ideas, and make a hefty profit on moving all this junk around.
There's a reason this grian is so popular, but I haven't gotten to that quite yet...
Your review has helped me alot, and I look forward to seeing the rest of it.
Quote from: Stargate525Quote from: PoseidonHalf-Elves:
Who do the half-elves moderate between?
Humans and elves.
I thought you'd say that. It doesn't make sense to me. Traditional elves as written would probably view half-elves as mutant spawns of the evil foreigners. They wouldn't need to be moderators between humans and free elves because they've already been mingling. Humans are in direct competition with trade goods and want there land. I know that isn't a really a good reason for Humans, but you even state that Half-elves are reluctant to deal with Humans or Elves.
You state that they are on good terms with halflings. I was kinda hoping that is who they are a moderator for, since the halfings are hostile to almost everyone else.
Quote from: PoseidonI thought you'd say that. It doesn't make sense to me. Traditional elves as written would probably view half-elves as mutant spawns of the evil foreigners. They wouldn't need to be moderators between humans and free elves because they've already been mingling. Humans are in direct competition with trade goods and want there land. I know that isn't a really a good reason for Humans, but you even state that Half-elves are reluctant to deal with Humans or Elves.
You state that they are on good terms with halflings. I was kinda hoping that is who they are a moderator for, since the halfings are hostile to almost everyone else.
Agreed. Having them mediate between elves and humans seems a little bit odd.
But I'm curious where you got that halflings are hostile to everyone else from this;
[ic]Halflings get along well with almost everyone, especially Gnomes, their main trading partner. Dwarves and Elves are the only two races that they outright dislike; the Dwarves because of the ongoing wars between the two races, and the Elves for their attempted invasion over half a millenia ago.[/ic]
Misreading this:"Halflings are indigenous to the jungles of The Southern Continent, their lifestyle built around the myriad of ways one can get himself killed in the depths of the jungle." and partly assumption based off the misreading.
:( They're still cool, but they've lost some of there appeal. I was loving the Hostile Jungle Halflings.
First of all, I'll say there's a lot here and I haven't read all of it. I skipped around a lot to various things that looked most interesting, and especially read up on the different races, so please point me to the right section if some question I've asked is answered elsewhere.
It's interesting how each race has its own qualities and features, and a culture to it. I like that part a lot. I'm not sure about some of the generalizations, though, especially things like "Race X doesn't get along with Race Y," because that seems like something factors in a given geographical area or community could change heavily. Perhaps some of these "racial" characteristics may be better associated with the most dominant nations to be found within each of these racial groups, and be a sort of dispersion of the national culture, rather than some truly "racial" trait. Just a thought, though.
One note on languages: I'm not sure how much sense it makes to have languages defined by species in such a cosmopolitan world. I realize the D&D take on language is rather simple (especially compared to its roots, like Tolkien!), and I'm fairly interested in linguistics and such, so this may all be rather pedantic, but, it seems like linguistic communities would form around social strata or geographic areas, especially in more urban areas. And, in rural areas, well-- why would two people who never come into contact speak the same language?
Quote'Human Lands' is a fallacy; humans do not see racial borders, only political ones.
In the north is a high, rocky arpeggio as the continent gives way to the Sunken Hills[/quote]It is important to note that although I use the word 'technology,' the more appropriate word might be Magology.[/quote]Thus, the dirigibles above might use heat metal, continuous flame, or something similar instead of traditional gas.[/quote]The Elves have an almost Japanese attitude in world affairs, wanting to assimilate everything of the foreign culture.[/quote]Elves are a curious race, wishing to learn as much as possible about other cultures. This tendency, coupled with their xenophobia towards the actual foreigners, creates an interesting tear in the Elven culture while the majority attempt to have their cake and eat it too.[/quote]Half-Elves are almost forced into the spotlight as mediators between the humans and elves, a position they are far from ready to take.[/quote]They lack a strong central power, and so are almost always at war with each other (the famous dwarven logic breaks down in this regard)[/quote]other guy[/i] is the one being illogical. ;)
Quote from: sparkletwistQuoteHalf-Elves are almost forced into the spotlight as mediators between the humans and elves, a position they are far from ready to take.
Actually that makes a lot of sense and takes most of the oddity out of the equation.
Quote from: sparkletwistQuoteIn the north is a high, rocky arpeggio as the continent gives way to the Sunken Hills
No, I meant a musical term. I told you that the continent was odd.
x. Nice find, fixed. I'll reply to the rest tomorrow morning.
Catching up since my last post and wow, you have added a good deal!
Again I love your Myths Legends section. The elves Book of Five entry is fantastic. How you wove the plant traits into the racial tones blends wonderfully.
What makes the Wind pass lower winds so strong? Are you going with geography or is there some other reason for it?
For Vandaar you mention that this country is almost unknown by outsiders, but then you say that most outsiders don't like it?
Letters of Marque! Yeah! Sorry, but I love this plot device.
Addictive wheat? You are twisted and sick! Such a great idea to expand your trade! Have others tried to grow it in their regions and it just won't grow? Any mutations that are more addictive or have more side effects or withdrawal symptoms?
Love your world. I finally remembered to start tracking it so I can see updates quicker.
Look forward to even more from you!
Quote from: sparkletwistIt's interesting how each race has its own qualities and features, and a culture to it. I like that part a lot. I'm not sure about some of the generalizations, though, especially things like "Race X doesn't get along with Race Y," because that seems like something factors in a given geographical area or community could change heavily. Perhaps some of these "racial" characteristics may be better associated with the most dominant nations to be found within each of these racial groups, and be a sort of dispersion of the national culture, rather than some truly "racial" trait. Just a thought, though.
You're right, once I get all of the individual nations written up, I'll change it over to nation-by-nation. The thing is, only the humans have any real large distinction between nations, and any racial relationship information I give will have to be a generalization.
Quote from: sparkletwistOne note on languages: I'm not sure how much sense it makes to have languages defined by species in such a cosmopolitan world. I realize the D&D take on language is rather simple (especially compared to its roots, like Tolkien!), and I'm fairly interested in linguistics and such, so this may all be rather pedantic, but, it seems like linguistic communities would form around social strata or geographic areas, especially in more urban areas. And, in rural areas, well-- why would two people who never come into contact speak the same language?
I haven't really started messing with language yet, and the only one that I know already is half-elven (I have no idea why dwarves have that entry). Trust me, I like languages. Expect several.
Quote from: sparkletwistQuote from: sparkletwistNeat, I always like settings that meld magic and technology in interesting new ways, or work to make them two aspects of the same phenomenon. I'm a pretty big fan of that Arthur C. Clarke quote, too, actually. ;)
:) I have a fan.
Quote from: sparkletwistOr simply a magical technique for producing a lift gas-- in the past I've made use of airships filled with magically produced hydrogen, and it seems to strike a nice balance between the magical and the realistic.
hmm. I'll have to keep that in mind. I might utilize that for the dirigibles, but I don't think I can envision the windships with the kind of envelope needed for that technology.
Quote from: sparkletwistI really like this. It reminds me a lot of late 19th century Japan, specifically, actually, where Japan had both a strong element of wanting to be completely isolated from the outside world (as it had been for centuries) and yet a realization that if it did not absorb foreign technology and ideas, it would fall hopelessly behind.
Cool. I've got a secret; I actually know very little about Japan during that time period. I'm glad to see I was able to reproduce the flavor despite that.
Quote from: sparkletwistThis role got some flak, but I actually like it, so I'll propose an alternate rationale. Perhaps there is a certain grudging tolerance for half-elves in most elven communities-- they're not pure-blooded, but they're not entirely the devil foreigner, either. As the elves enjoy hearing of foreign lands without actually inviting those people in, half-elves provide a useful answer, as they can deal with someone who is both foreign and familiar at the same time. Perhaps there's even a sense among some that these people who have some elven blood can be "reclaimed" by the elves, in a way.
Consider it stolen. ;)
Quote from: sparkletwistQuote from: RavenspathCatching up since my last post and wow, you have added a good deal!
Again I love your Myths Legends section. The elves Book of Five entry is fantastic. How you wove the plant traits into the racial tones blends wonderfully.
Thank you.
Quote from: RavenspathWhat makes the Wind pass lower winds so strong? Are you going with geography or is there some other reason for it?
Geography. Of course, my geography might not hold water, and then I'll have to make up something else.
Quote from: RavenspathFor Vandaar you mention that this country is almost unknown by outsiders, but then you say that most outsiders don't like it?
Fixed that. Somewhat silly.
Quote from: RavenspathLetters of Marque! Yeah! Sorry, but I love this plot device.
So do I. I was a bit surprised that Eberron didn't have them.
Quote from: RavenspathAddictive wheat? You are twisted and sick! Such a great idea to expand your trade! Have others tried to grow it in their regions and it just won't grow? Any mutations that are more addictive or have more side effects or withdrawal symptoms?
Yeah, it won't grow in other regions. I'll add that in. And I will have to toy with other strains.
Quote from: RavenspathLook forward to even more from you!
I hope to provide.
Quote from: Stargate525Off all the words in my setting, that stupid sentence has given the most confusion. I've changed it, hopefully it makes more sense.
For Vandaar you mention that this country is almost unknown by outsiders, but then you say that most outsiders don't like it?[/quote]Addictive wheat? You are twisted and sick! Such a great idea to expand your trade! Have others tried to grow it in their regions and it just won't grow? Any mutations that are more addictive or have more side effects or withdrawal symptoms?
[/quote]
Hmm, and what if you brew it into beer?
Maybe it becomes downright narcotic! :demon:
Quote from: sparkletwistQuote from: RavenspathAddictive wheat? You are twisted and sick! Such a great idea to expand your trade! Have others tried to grow it in their regions and it just won't grow? Any mutations that are more addictive or have more side effects or withdrawal symptoms?
And thats the whole evil wheat to a completely new level! Can you imagine an Octoberfest (of Dilandri equivalent) with this beer? Ouch. You could have a whole nation of beer addicted alcholics.
Like some of the others, I'll admit to not having read absolutely all the material
I agree with Ravenspath that you present your material quite professionally. It's a very good start, and sort of the opposite of the way I do things.
I appreciate the precise arrangement of relationships among all your thirty gods, (it reminds me of all the guilds in Magic's Ravnica setting,) but they feel like pretty standard D&D deities, considering that the setting's connection to the gods is the very first thing you mention in your premise. Is there anything unusual about your characters' relationships with the gods that I'm missing?
Also, to help players take in the symmetry of your pantheon (and to help them remember all the gods' names,) you might want to draw some kind of big Venn diagram with the five major gods and the minor gods inside heir spaces, with lines to denote the alliances and rivalries.
The Tome of Knowledge and Secrets is an interesting idea, but, speaking personally as a DM, if a source writer tells me never, ever to use the major artifact he's written, I'm going to be tempted all the more to use it. If you want it never to be a part of a campaign, what effect can it have on the play experience of your players? In other words, why write about it?
I loved the premise for gnomes (a whole society of nothing but brilliant inventors and Renaissance men,) but I don't think you took the premise far enough in practice. If EVERY gnome is a super-ambitious engineer, who gets stuck doing the other work that needs to be done? Although they're extroverted, wouldn't they have trouble working together if they all wanted to be the one in charge of a project? Is a gnome city a little like Los Angeles, dominated by a single "glamour industry" where the supply of talent far exceeds demand and every menial laborer has a screenplay (or in this case a blueprint) that they're trying to sell? Are there gnomish patent attorneys?
Ah, but forgive me. I only go on like I do because I like so much what you've written so far.
Quote from: sparkletwistWhat I'm trying to say, basically, is that it seems to me that the non-human races have an odd sort of racial unity that seems a bit out of place in a world with lots of different nations and well-travelled people.
Quote from: sparkletwistI'm not sure how this works. Looking at the modern world, and the history of the world, it seems that race and politics are hopelessly linked. Any sort of separation between race and politics is a much newer idea-- this is not to say that another world may not achieve this separation earlier, but in the face of so many other sentient species about, don't you think some sense of "human identity" would arise? On the darker side of it, people are people, for good or ill, and there's probably some "human supremacists" out there...
Is it just me, or do those two paragraphs contradict each other?
Quote from: sparkletwistHmm, and what if you brew it into beer?
Maybe it becomes downright narcotic! :demon:
:o You're even more evil than I am! I am totally stealing this, but it won't be narcotic (otherwise people would start to get suspicious of the wheat.)
Quote from: Bill VolkI appreciate the precise arrangement of relationships among all your thirty gods, (it reminds me of all the guilds in Magic's Ravnica setting,) but they feel like pretty standard D&D deities, considering that the setting's connection to the gods is the very first thing you mention in your premise. Is there anything unusual about your characters' relationships with the gods that I'm missing?
There will be, I hope. I haven't gotten to fleshing out religion beyond the names and personalities (hence the blank section of heirarchy below it), but I hope I'll be able to get some unique stuff in there still.
Quote from: Bill VolkAlso, to help players take in the symmetry of your pantheon (and to help them remember all the gods' names,) you might want to draw some kind of big Venn diagram with the five major gods and the minor gods inside heir spaces, with lines to denote the alliances and rivalries.
And here I was going to write a song based on the animaniacs countries of the world...
Kidding, but you aren't the first to request that sort of thing.
Quote from: Bill VolkThe Tome of Knowledge and Secrets is an interesting idea, but, speaking personally as a DM, if a source writer tells me never, ever to use the major artifact he's written, I'm going to be tempted all the more to use it. If you want it never to be a part of a campaign, what effect can it have on the play experience of your players? In other words, why write about it?
By all means, use it. I put it there because it is one of the religious artifacts and the list would be incomplete without it. It's something I as a DM would use in a heartbeat, but need to make sure that the players can never actually USE it. Kinda like the Holy Grail in the Last Crusade.
Quote from: Bill VolkI loved the premise for gnomes (a whole society of nothing but brilliant inventors and Renaissance men,) but I don't think you took the premise far enough in practice. If EVERY gnome is a super-ambitious engineer, who gets stuck doing the other work that needs to be done? Although they're extroverted, wouldn't they have trouble working together if they all wanted to be the one in charge of a project? Is a gnome city a little like Los Angeles, dominated by a single "glamour industry" where the supply of talent far exceeds demand and every menial laborer has a screenplay (or in this case a blueprint) that they're trying to sell? Are there gnomish patent attorneys?
Ah, but forgive me. I only go on like I do because I like so much what you've written so far.
Haha, that was funny. I tried to balance that out by having gnome society based on merit; those who aren't as good don't get as good of jobs. I am totally stealing your 'everyone has a blueprint' idea, as well as the gnomish patent attorneys.
Quote from: Stargate525Is it just me, or do those two paragraphs contradict each other?
do[/b] have a strong sense of their own identity.
I guess I wasn't really being contradictory, it's just that it seemed strange to me that humans think one way and the other races all think a different way, when it seems more like they should all be closer to somewhere in between.
Of course, this is all invalid if there's some biological or other difference that causes them to think differently, but then you should probably mention this.
Quote from: sparkletwistQuote from: Stargate525Is it just me, or do those two paragraphs contradict each other?
do[/b] have a strong sense of their own identity.
I guess I wasn't really being contradictory, it's just that it seemed strange to me that humans think one way and the other races all think a different way, when it seems more like they should all be closer to somewhere in between.
Of course, this is all invalid if there's some biological or other difference that causes them to think differently, but then you should probably mention this.
Ok, I think I understand you now.
It'sw not so much that they identify as a race rather than as a political body, it's that they identify as a species. Comparing Humans to Gnomes is not like comparing Africans to Caucasians, It would be like comparing Humans and Ferengi. Since I based the humans so much on imperialistic europe, I needed the national identity for them, and I think it's what us as humans would do.
Looking at it logically, however, if aliens suddenly came to your planet, wouldn't you want to work with them as a single entity rather than a legion of small states? The other races understand this, and no matter their internal squabbles, they work as a united, solid front when dealing with other races (D&D definition). The humans simply don't have this, as their racial internal politics are the center of their world, and they simply don't understand it.
Does that explain it at all?
I've been browsing Dilandri a chunk at a time for a couple of days now, and I'm just pleased as punch to be writing about it this morning! I'm going to go through your setting thread and more or less address things in order.
Quote from: An Elf on a Human CityIt is an unclean, filthy place, full of noise and bustle without meaning. The air is polluted with the smell of people, the ground is barren with the tramples of feet, and at night the very stars are blocked out by their lights. It is a vile place.
I wouldn't leave it for the world.
Papyrus font overuse[/url], but that's not going to be me. :)
Your gods are an interesting setup. I feel their names could do with a bit of sprucing up in some cases-- some of the names strike me as all-too-descriptive. (Luminor, the Beacon? Evil Lilnith, one letter away from Lilith? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilith) Perhaps I am being a little too picky.) In general, I get a sense of unlikely levels of symmetry in your gods: five gods, each having exactly five subordinates... seems a little to convenient to have likely arisen naturally. (Which perhaps is exactly the point.) I do not think the number and detail of your gods and their children are excessive or overly complex, but do not be surprised if many players ignore the children to focus on the simpler concept of the Big Five.
Gudruun and Caed, with their opposite takes on their book symbol, strike me as among the most interesting characters here. Ganes' five-sided dice are impossible to create with all sides the same size and shape (and so would have to be "weighted" towards particular values, which perhaps is exactly the point. Cheater. :) ) Vidac Ni strikes me as a cheap gimmick for turning gnomish armies into the Knights Who Say Ni, which undermines their overall straight-up and serious treatment (one of the things I liked best about them.) Asumai creates an interesting juxtaposition of the "barbaric" halfling culture previously described, against the ideals of love and honor. I like it. If Dessas's symbol is a rat's skull, have your world's thinkers identified rats (and their fleas) as disease vectors? How much do they know about bacteria and the spread of sickness?
Overall, the spread seems to imply that death is a terrible thing to be feared, and that magic is generally benevolent. Is this an accurate reading?
Your dwarven clans seem to operate less like families and more like castes. Are dwarves born into their clans and forced to pursue appropriate trades, or do they join clans based on their aptitudes? Clan Thovar seems almost superfluous (and is certainly the least interesting, as written-- the clan that basically is normal.) If it's the oldest clan and other clans broke apart from it, it might be possible to "disappear" Thovar as entirely transformed into the others.
I find it interesting that you consistently abbreviate "Dwarven Mining League" as "DLM", rather than "DML." Is this an issue of dwarven syntax, or a persistant typo?
I do like what you've done here, quite a bit. This setting has a lot going on, a great deal of detail to get interested in. I'd be curious about what sorts of adventures you have in mind as especially well-suited for the setting, and other information about how you expect it to play out in-game.
Review for Dilandri.
Chapter I Races
Humans
Your humans are pretty standard, but frankly humans are standard in every setting. I really like how humans have almost a strangle hold on grain and how they are trying to acquire as much territory as possible.
Now are humans fighting each other for more land? Are they attacking the other races territory? Settling unclaimed territory? or all of the above?
Elves
I like how the elves are somewhat based on the Japanese culture of the late 19th century. I like how there are two sub cultures, each adapting to contact with other species. I like the Elves belief that art and music have magical powers. Well that begs the question do they? (I mean from beyond the bard spell list ). I think it would be rather cool if they were able to cast really powerful spells by just playing a song, telling a story, or painting a picture. The dragon saints concept seems very interesting.
Is the small sect of dragon worshippers growing in power?
How do they gain magical powers from the saints?
Do you have any info on the Dragon saints?
Half-Elves
Why do half-elves favor chaos over law and good over evil?
Gnomes
The gnomes you have created are exactly how gnomes should be. The only thing I can commit on is how much I really like them.
Halflings
I like how you have made Halflings. They have a really big Mayan vibe to them. Which is cool and one doesn't see much in a D&D setting much any more. (not counting the forgotten realms offshoot maztica).
Half Orcs'
I like how you have made them more the barbarians and how you have giving them this drive to take care of there own kind no mater where they are.
Dwarves
Dwarves seem very standard; I do like how they have only just discovered paper. You say that there are no writers among them, I was wondering if they have ancient Egyptian mentality of carving all of their information on the walls of their important structures?
Classes
First off I love the ARCANIST. It is a great class, from forgotten realms and I am glad that somewhere some one is using it. I like how you have altered it to fit your setting.
The Regions
I like what you have so far, my favorite regions are the sunken hills and the dragon lands, I would really like to get more info on them. Also, your maps are huge, and there is nothing wrong with that. They look amazing and have some good detail in them.
Magic
I really like the idea of the crystals, the way you have incorporated them is logical and an interesting way to use components and not have to carry vast sums of crap.
Religion.
I like how each of the 5 gods has five sub gods. Also I really like Lor how he takes souls that have no where to go, and after a time of servitude with him, they go off with obella. My question is what do the souls do while in Lor's service?
The coming of age for each of the races is also a nice touch.
One last question, why did you change the name of the world?
All in all I really like the setting, and I would really like to see a sections on how each race views character classes. A section on how races view weapons. What I mean by that is do humans have a fascination with swords (like in the real word), do elves view the bow to be only suitable for hunting and not for war, stuff along those lines.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonConsidering the strife between various members of the five gods, I have a real hard time buying the "let's forge a land and rule together in peace and unity" line being spoken by them. Am I to assume that the Book of the Five is a somewhat romanticised version of this story, or have the relations between the gods not always been as strained? :)
It's definitely romanticized; if you have several versions of an event, the Book of the Five probably has the least accurate version. Once I get more religion stuff up, you'll see why.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonThis summary paragraph struck me as a little odd, because it seems to be written for an audience of people who read about various fictional worlds all day long, rather than, say, people who like a little fantasy fiction. Otherwise, why mention technology just to say it's a non-factor, and how magic "scientifically" replaces it? It's like reading a plot summary on the back of a book, and finding that it mentions things that have nothing to do with the book-- a little weirdly jarring.
Bolding mine. Isn't that what you are? Honestly, why would I write a summary that isn't based on the people who will most likely be reading it?
Quote from: Luminous Crayon[ooc]I am skipping over the Table of Contents, and just reading down your thread one post at a time. I am operating under the assumption that the table of contents leads only to posts within your main thread, not any outside content, so I won't be missing anything by just going in order.
If I'm wrong about this, please do correct me. :)[/ooc]
You're right. If you wanted the thing wikified, that's as close as it'll get. ;)
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI was confused the first time I read this, and made a mental note to comment on it, because of how the last line makes little sense. If the human city is so vile and awful, why would this incidental narrator want to stay there so badly?
On my second read, it occurred to me that the narrator might simply be a wheat addict, without realizing it. Have I hit truth, or should I take off my tinfoil hat?
Remove your tinfoil (at amplifies the brainwaves us aliens need anyway). What I was trying to convey there is how some people will come to a city and dislike its dirt and bustle, really all the individual things about it, but still fall in love with its atmosphere. If you notice, the 'human on an elf homestead' is like that, but reversed.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonYour conception of gnomes leaves me with mixed feelings. I think I have some not-too-unusual prejudices against tinkering gnomes, and magic-technology has similarly never been one of my preferences. On the other hand, I'm really quite pleased to see them being treated "seriously", and the overall air of ingenuity astounds me. I think this may be the first time I've ever seen a setting with explicit acknowledgement of the possibility of making a living through production and licensing of ideas, which strikes me as very, very cool. I also really like the image of moving lifts and platforms to navigate the cliffs.
I've discovered that you can't please everyone with Gnomes, as much as I'd like to try. Glad you like some aspects of them though.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonThis confuses me. How does one build a lifestyle around ways to get killed?
Not ways to get killed, ways NOT to get killed. When you're living somewhere that requires constant attention to remain alive, your lifestyle sort of grows around that.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonThe dichotomy between "traditional" elves and Free Elves is interesting, but it leaves me wondering what exactly the Free Elves have been freed from. I think a little elaboration of elven society or politics, as relevant to the difference between Free and "normal" elves, would be really useful.
Free doesn't mean 'not a slave' in this case, more 'free to do what they want.' Free elves have relations with other races, normal elves do not.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonThis last sentence throws me off. It seems strange for a culture to place such a high importance on spoken stories, then place such a severe restriction on how those stories can be used. (Because honestly, if you want to keep somebody from learning a story, you pretty much have to be sure never to tell it while they're in earshot. Wouldn't this trust issue essentially kill the whole storytelling element of culture whenever a non-trusted person is nearby?)
I really like the business about elven knot-stories.
Hearing a story and being taught a story are different, especially to an elf. Also, learning a story word-for-word orally would take several repetitions.
I'll probably end up making a section on elven storytelling.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI'd like to hear more about this. It seems to be an important point, and is completely glossed over in abstract terms when it would benefit from specificity.
Myths and Legends section will be including histories soon, and it will go in there. You're right though, it does need more explaining in the Elf section.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonYour half-orcs are not the first thing in your setting that has given me a bit of an Eberron vibe, but they're probably the strongest. (You may not be aware, but there's a pretty big part of that setting that involves half-orcs acting as wilderness guides in areas where magical crystals have been discovered.) Like my comments on gnomes, I have never been a fan of the idea of half races that exist because of rape. Then again, in the case of half-orcs in just about every setting, that seems to be the norm due to unspoken consensus-- nobody seems to be able to get away from the idea.
This part really intrigues me, and I think makes half-orcs the one of your races that stands out most in my mind as interesting.
I wasn't aware actually. The more I'm filling in the sections, the more I'm coming to realize I may have to make Orcs a playable (read: integrated as playable) race. If I do, the 'byproduct of rape' will probably be thrown out the window.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonYour dwarves strike me as the race you've done the least interesting things with, but there again, you're in good company. There is a strong tendency for anyone who uses dwarves to use them in boring ways, which is unfortunate.
It's difficult to make them unique without making them feel gimmicky. If you have a suggestion, I'm open to it.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI like your maps. Someone, somewhere, is going to give you grief for contributing to the global epidemic of Papyrus font overuse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papyrus_%28font%29), but that's not going to be me. :)
I had no idea. Although, it's not my fault that they made a really good font, is it?
Quote from: Luminous CrayonYour gods are an interesting setup. I feel their names could do with a bit of sprucing up in some cases-- some of the names strike me as all-too-descriptive. (Luminor, the Beacon? Evil Lilnith, one letter away from Lilith? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lilith) Perhaps I am being a little too picky.) In general, I get a sense of unlikely levels of symmetry in your gods: five gods, each having exactly five subordinates... seems a little to convenient to have likely arisen naturally. (Which perhaps is exactly the point.) I do not think the number and detail of your gods and their children are excessive or overly complex, but do not be surprised if many players ignore the children to focus on the simpler concept of the Big Five.
Ignoring the smaller gods is something I'm already expecting, unfortunately. But in regards to symmetry, if you look at the bible and analyze it, there are some remarkable affinities for numbers. You're right on your assessment, the Five are not designed to be something that feels organic; it should feel very structured and organized.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonGudruun and Caed, with their opposite takes on their book symbol, strike me as among the most interesting characters here. Ganes' five-sided dice are impossible to create with all sides the same size and shape (and so would have to be "weighted" towards particular values, which perhaps is exactly the point. Cheater. :) ) Vidac Ni strikes me as a cheap gimmick for turning gnomish armies into the Knights Who Say Ni, which undermines their overall straight-up and serious treatment (one of the things I liked best about them.) Asumai creates an interesting juxtaposition of the "barbaric" halfling culture previously described, against the ideals of love and honor. I like it. If Dessas's symbol is a rat's skull, have your world's thinkers identified rats (and their fleas) as disease vectors? How much do they know about bacteria and the spread of sickness?
In order:
Thanks, I like them too. Shape yes, size no, but you're right, they would have to be weighted to work correctly. That was something my unconscious mind thought up when I was writing one time, and slipped by my editing; will remove. Thank you. Yes, they know that rats carry disease, and they know about contagiousness, but I doubt they know about bacteria beyond simple practical uses (covered food keeps better, etc.).
Quote from: Luminous CrayonOverall, the spread seems to imply that death is a terrible thing to be feared, and that magic is generally benevolent. Is this an accurate reading?
Pretty much. People do worship Lor, so there is that, but in general, yes.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonYour dwarven clans seem to operate less like families and more like castes. Are dwarves born into their clans and forced to pursue appropriate trades, or do they join clans based on their aptitudes? Clan Thovar seems almost superfluous (and is certainly the least interesting, as written-- the clan that basically is normal.) If it's the oldest clan and other clans broke apart from it, it might be possible to "disappear" Thovar as entirely transformed into the others.
Eh, I didn't do a good enough job describing. The Clans work somewhat like castes, but it isn't solid. For example, you've got Miners and Craftsmen in the Glanmalk clan, but Warfare is what they are known for, and what most young Glanmalkians(?) would be pushed towards (but certianly not 'forced'). Clanship is based on birth, and can only be changed by marriage. I know that Thovar seems unneeded, but in that society it's essential, since it's the only one that actually has a balanced society within itself.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI find it interesting that you consistently abbreviate "Dwarven Mining League" as "DLM", rather than "DML." Is this an issue of dwarven syntax, or a persistant typo?
Persistent typo that is now related to syntax and grammar. ;)
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI do like what you've done here, quite a bit. This setting has a lot going on, a great deal of detail to get interested in. I'd be curious about what sorts of adventures you have in mind as especially well-suited for the setting, and other information about how you expect it to play out in-game.
Thanks, glad you like it, have a badge. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v220/stargate525/DilandriCrystal.png) (http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?24254)
Quote from: XXsiriusXXHumans
Your humans are pretty standard, but frankly humans are standard in every setting. I really like how humans have almost a strangle hold on grain and how they are trying to acquire as much territory as possible.
Now are humans fighting each other for more land? Are they attacking the other races territory? Settling unclaimed territory? or all of the above?
Yes, Not recently, yes, and yes. :)
Quote from: XXsiriusXXElves
I like how the elves are somewhat based on the Japanese culture of the late 19th century. I like how there are two sub cultures, each adapting to contact with other species. I like the Elves belief that art and music have magical powers. Well that begs the question do they? (I mean from beyond the bard spell list ). I think it would be rather cool if they were able to cast really powerful spells by just playing a song, telling a story, or painting a picture. The dragon saints concept seems very interesting.
Is the small sect of dragon worshippers growing in power?
How do they gain magical powers from the saints?
Do you have any info on the Dragon saints?
Yes, the same way as other divine spellcasters (yet to be detailed), and I soon will.
As for whether their music actually has power, I'm not sure about. I might have to give it some thought, but it certainly won't become a separate type of magic.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXWhy do half-elves favor chaos over law and good over evil?
Just the way they're programmed. Why do standard dwarves favor law over chaos? I'll probably get some fluff that explains eventually.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXGnomes
The gnomes you have created are exactly how gnomes should be. The only thing I can commit on is how much I really like them.
Seriously, this is the most controversial topic in my entire setting.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXHalflings
I like how you have made Halflings. They have a really big Mayan vibe to them. Which is cool and one doesn't see much in a D&D setting much any more. (not counting the forgotten realms offshoot maztica).
Minus the whole 'sacrifice and eat the heathens' thing, yes.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXHalf Orcs'
I like how you have made them more the barbarians and how you have giving them this drive to take care of there own kind no mater where they are.
Thank you.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXDwarves
Dwarves seem very standard; I do like how they have only just discovered paper. You say that there are no writers among them, I was wondering if they have ancient Egyptian mentality of carving all of their information on the walls of their important structures?
On walls, as well as stone tablets for portability. And you do NOT want to see an ancient Dwarven archive room. ;)
Quote from: XXsiriusXXFirst off I love the ARCANIST. It is a great class, from forgotten realms and I am glad that somewhere some one is using it. I like how you have altered it to fit your setting.
Forgotten realms? Really? I altered a class I found on the WOTC boards... huh.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXI like what you have so far, my favorite regions are the sunken hills and the dragon lands, I would really like to get more info on them. Also, your maps are huge, and there is nothing wrong with that. They look amazing and have some good detail in them.
Info will be coming. The maps are huge because they are based off scans of a huge map.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXI really like the idea of the crystals, the way you have incorporated them is logical and an interesting way to use components and not have to carry vast sums of crap.
Thank you.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXI like how each of the 5 gods has five sub gods. Also I really like Lor how he takes souls that have no where to go, and after a time of servitude with him, they go off with obella. My question is what do the souls do while in Lor's service?
Serve Lor, and help with his duties. He can't be everywhere at once (he is only a god, after all), so his servants take care of the common deaths, while Lor does large or prestigious jobs (sunken ships, death of Kings, etc.)
Quote from: XXsiriusXXThe coming of age for each of the races is also a nice touch.
Thank ye.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXOne last question, why did you change the name of the world?
:?:
Explain please.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXAll in all I really like the setting, and I would really like to see a sections on how each race views character classes. A section on how races view weapons. What I mean by that is do humans have a fascination with swords (like in the real word), do elves view the bow to be only suitable for hunting and not for war, stuff along those lines.
Thanks, glad you like it, have a badge. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v220/stargate525/DilandriCrystal.png) (http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?24254)
As for how they view weapons... I never thought of that. Consider it on my to-do list.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonThis summary paragraph struck me as a little odd, because it seems to be written for an audience of people who read about various fictional worlds all day long, rather than, say, people who like a little fantasy fiction. Otherwise, why mention technology just to say it's a non-factor, and how magic "scientifically" replaces it? It's like reading a plot summary on the back of a book, and finding that it mentions things that have nothing to do with the book-- a little weirdly jarring.
Bolding mine. Isn't that what you are? Honestly, why would I write a summary that isn't based on the people who will most likely be reading it?[/quote]isn't[/i], an element of misdirection is put into play-- it focuses the audience
away from the thing being described, for just a moment. Plenty of people do this to great effect, but I'm not sure it's the sort of thing I'd want to be doing right off the bat.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI was confused the first time I read this, and made a mental note to comment on it, because of how the last line makes little sense. If the human city is so vile and awful, why would this incidental narrator want to stay there so badly?
On my second read, it occurred to me that the narrator might simply be a wheat addict, without realizing it. Have I hit truth, or should I take off my tinfoil hat?
Remove your tinfoil (at amplifies the brainwaves us aliens need anyway). What I was trying to convey there is how some people will come to a city and dislike its dirt and bustle, really all the individual things about it, but still fall in love with its atmosphere. If you notice, the 'human on an elf homestead' is like that, but reversed.[/quote]
Your dwarves strike me as the race you've done the least interesting things with, but there again, you're in good company. There is a strong tendency for anyone who uses dwarves to use them in boring ways, which is unfortunate.
[/quote]
It's difficult to make them unique without making them feel gimmicky. If you have a suggestion, I'm open to it.[/quote]et al.,[/i] but that doesn't provide much footing for a player wanting to play a dwarf character in one of your games (which may discourage your players from trying.)
Quote from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_NumerologyBiblical Numerology,[/url] to Ivan Panin's controversial ideas on that subject, or perhaps to something else? This sounds like a subject I'd be interested to read more about, if you happen to have any extra information sitting about.
Quote from: XXsiriusXXOne last question, why did you change the name of the world?
:?:
Explain please.
shed some light[/url] on this particular confusion: :)
Quote from: Stargate525PLease note I've changed the name of my setting to Aardvar-Dilandri. Thank you. ;)
Anyway, as for this:
Quote from: http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?24254(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v220/stargate525/DilandriCrystal.png)[/url]
Thank you. I'll wear it with pride.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonWonderful! I can't wait.
Neither can I! I only know half of the stuff that I type before I write it down, and that's usually the most boring stuff.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonThat is precisely what we are, but that's not really my point. The thing about that particular paragraph that struck me was that it didn't seem to be written for a world designed to stand on its own, and I certainly think Dilandri is big enough and interesting enough to stand on its own without being contrasted against a small ocean of similar projects by other people.
To put it another way: every time anyone describes anything by mentioning what it isn't, an element of misdirection is put into play-- it focuses the audience away from the thing being described, for just a moment. Plenty of people do this to great effect, but I'm not sure it's the sort of thing I'd want to be doing right off the bat.
Ah. I understand now. I'll probably give that a bit of a retooling then.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonPleasing everyone is not the best goal, anyway. Nobody in the history of the world has ever written anything that has pleased everyone who read it. But your ideas here are pretty well- and thoroughly-developed, whether I like them or not (and which is more important, anyway.) Keep it up.
Besides, I like most aspects of them. :)
Then I've pleased you. Honestly, I ain't picky. All I'm going for is that everyone who reviews it has no aspect to which they just go 'I just HATE that! Why did you do such a stupid thing?' And so far, I'm good. And besides, I need to please myself first.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonIt's difficult to learn every single word of a story, with no substitutions or mistakes, after a single hearing. It's fairly easy to learn a story's characters, plot events, and other features well enough to retell the story in one's own words. To an elf, is it not the "same" story, or not a "correct" story, unless it is a word-for-word reproduction of the original?
This is a pretty interesting take, and puts a whole new light on professional storytellers in elven society. I think a section on elven storytelling would be an interesting read, and I doubt I'm the only one.
Aye, it'll be coming.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonWould they take over the role of half-orcs, then? Or would half-orcs stick around? Would full-blooded orcs be de-monsterized to the point where voluntary human-orc pairings could believably produce an entire population of half-orcs, perhaps?
Half orcs would stay around, and since half-orcs breed true, you wouldn't really need THAT many original half-orcs. The problem with de-monsterizing the Orcs is that I need to figure out motive and position in the world, while still figuring out how they can be non-monsters, unreliant on human grain, and still terrorize nearly all the other races.
I originally based them on REAVERS for cryin' out loud, and now look what I'm contemplating?!
Quote from: Luminous CrayonYou already have some good things going in the area of the clans, and I think that giving us just a little more information about that may take you in some interesting directions without even much deliberate effort required. They function perfectly well as a strange "other", which is how they've always historically functioned in literature like that of Tolkien et al., but that doesn't provide much footing for a player wanting to play a dwarf character in one of your games (which may discourage your players from trying.)
I sure as heck hope so.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonNot at all. Also, I hope you are interpreting my ribbing about the font in the spirit in which it was intended: as good-natured, gentle teasing, not as a serious criticism. :)
You kidding? I don't take ANYTHING you say seriously. ;)
Quote from: Luminous CrayonQuick derail: are you referring here to Biblical Numerology, (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biblical_Numerology) to Ivan Panin's controversial ideas on that subject, or perhaps to something else? This sounds like a subject I'd be interested to read more about, if you happen to have any extra information sitting about.
I got it from my religion teacher mostly, and yes it would be close to Biblical Numerology and how these numbers, especially in revelation and other prophecies, mean certain things. For instance, 12 can mean God's influence on Earth by taking 3(number for God) multiplied times 4(number for man).
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI think it's pretty cool that if you are important enough (or if you die in a big group of people, I guess), the god of death shows up in person to come collect you.
Heh, something I borrowed from Pratchett. I also am willing to bet that some of Lor's 3125 assistants don't want to leave. I mean that must be a pretty interesting job.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI believe I can shed some light (http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?15399.last) on this particular confusion: :) Quote from: Stargate525PLease note I've changed the name of my setting to Aardvar-Dilandri. Thank you. ;)
Ah. That was a joke. Hence the ;). You can't take anything that I say seriously when it's followed by a ;).
Quote from: /= nonsensical. That's the purview of madness. Why wouldn't he just make two chaotic races?)
[quoteRamanasta: Ramanasta is the Neutral God, and her alignment is naturally True Neutral. She is known as Mother Nature, The Stabilizer, and The Twilight. She is worshiped world-wide by those who are unsure of their true nature, as well as those who wish to maintain the status-quo. The Elves are her race, and until recently they were believed to be extinct. No one knows for certain how the Elves interpret Ramanasta's teachings.
I like the whole 'No one knows for certain how the elves interpret' idea, but you should still here let /us/ know, because if someone was wanting to play an Elf, they'd have to know how their religion functioned. Questions: Why is she called the Twilight? What significance does that have? By being a Neutral God, is she more than just a nature God, but rather cover all of true neutrality?
That's it for now. I think the coolest part of Dilandri is the magic, so I'll definately be going over that later.
I should have told you; Most of the answers to your questions can be found in the histroy section, under creation stories and myths.
OMG. You and I both have Halflings (hobyts in Celtricia) as the most populous races. That's just too wierd.
[blockquote=SG525]The humans are based loosely off of Europe during the Imperialism of the late 19th and early 20th centuries. The governments are struggling to acquire as much foreign land as possible, while the average citizen sees this as the perfect time to become a cosmopolitan and see the world. [/blockquote]Does the human mentality include the boundless optimism and faith in 'progress'?
[blockquote=SG525]In addition to the Normal Pantheon of races, Elves also practice a pseudo-worship of a large number of dragon 'saints,' which have their own pantheon and spheres of influence. Nearly all elves worship the Five and their Children, seeing the dragon saints as more heroes than anything, but there is a small but growing sect of ultra-conservative Elves who see the dragons as the true Gods, and refuse to even associate with those 'tainted' by the Five.[/blockquote]+ love the 5, and the 30 total dieties, and how they are organized...makes some sense, and seems real-ish. The dragon-saints...love them.
[blockquote=SG 525]It is important to note that although I use the word 'technology,' the more appropriate word might be Magology. The gnomes approach problems with the mindset of creating a magic item (or clapping together several items) to solve it. Thus, the dirigibles above might use heat metal, continuous flame, or lifters instead of traditional gas.[/blockquote]I'd like this setting. My game system (not the setting, my crunch) has artificers as the second most common casters, and your gnomes sound like I imagine my artificers.
I aslo like the way the racial relations seem a natural outgrowth of this mentality. You have a very clear view here.
[blockquote=SG525]Elves are a naturally curious race, wishing to learn as much as possible about other cultures....Artistically, they are rigid-minded and set to a pattern. [/blockquote] a few lines apart, these seem contradictory. I know you mentioned a few weird off-kilter tendencies that contradicts, but the elves seemed to be the least clear to me, even adding the 'Free elves' in.
[blockquote=SG525]Lands:Half-elves hold the eastern coast of the Northern Continent, not as fertile as the human lands, but more than enough to relieve the strangle-hold the humans have on the grain market, should they ever start large scale selling. Both the Free Elves and the Humans know this, and contention for the half-elves' land is fierce.[/blockquote] I have enough trouble believing in a world where every race seems to separate nations by race, but imagining a country of half elves, instead off staying put in one of the parent race countries, stretches even a fantasy world logic. I know you have the new ones staying there, but having a 'mutt-land' is a little wierd. Maybe it is more of a duchy or province?
[blockquote=SG525]I wanted the Half-Orcs to have a viable place in the world, beyond the outcast living on the fringes of society. This is my attempt to remedy that.[/blockquote]
Very, very good idea. I totally agree. I did the same with Orcs, actually.
[blockquote=SG525]Culture: Half-Orc culture is one of restraint. The blood of the orcs is in constant war with the milder, more reasonable blood of humans, and this shows. Half-Orcs place great weight in their system of laws, both within a town and among the race as a whole. They see laws as a way to embrace the human in them, and reject the orc. This doesn't always work; Orcs can be short tempered and easily angered, making the half-orc law system one of the most strictly and harshly enforced. Punishments range from a whipping (the lightest sentence) to being abandoned among the sunken hills (the harshest sentence, essentially a prolonged death at the hands of Orcs or, if you're lucky, starvation).
Orcish hierarchy is based on aptitude, something they quickly learned to appreciate from the Gnome example. Each town has an Admiral or Overseer who runs the town, and answers to no one save another of his same rank. They are duty-bound to assist half-orcs in need, no matter if they belong to an enemy town or friendly.[/blockquote]
This was also a very good snapshot, and sympathetic to a race that is always getting the shaft.
Ths sunken hills, in general, are a cool area.
What areas are mixed race? Are the cosmpolitan human lands open to more races?
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[blockquote=SG525]Umer: God of the Orcs, Umer is chaotic evil. He is the designated guardian of the orcs, and is credited with teaching the orcs how to master the waters of their homeland. Umer is also the Orcish God of death; Lor does not collect Orc souls. His symbol is a black, tattered sail.[/blockquote]So Umer is really eveil, yet orcs worship him...So your orcs are really monstrous...
[blockquote=SG525]Neme: Neme, the Goddess of revenge and vengeance, is chaotic evil. The most emotional of the Gods, there are many reports of Neme herself destroying entire cities that have done wrong in her eyes. her worship has faded in favor of Tyrsis of late, but she is still the primary God of law in some remote areas.
Micas: God of destruction, Micas is chaotic evil. He is worshipped by barbarians as well as those whose job it is to destroy or tear down. The illegitimate sixth child of Lilnith, he was taken in by Quarren after the death of his fourth son in the hopes of preventing him from becoming a rogue force. It succeeded, and he is now relatively peaceful. His symbol is a ruined tower. [/blockquote]
Neme, Chaotic, Evil, Emotional, unstable...God of Law. Sure. Why not?
Mica, Chaotic, Evil, patron of ruiners and destruction...relatively peaceful. And are barbarians chaotic evil here?
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Really loved the dwarven clan culture...
[blockquote=sg525]Dwarves have few inter-clan organizations, preferring not to deal with the difficulty that a multi-clan business would entail. However, a few of these have sprung up from the need to present a unified face to the outside world. [/blockquote]This was especially good. The 'clannishman makes me thing of Dwarves with a scottish accent. which is always kind of funny.
The Goldenhall knights are also great, and something I hope your PC's use.
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QuoteNights when two or more moons are full are known as Promstrahs, and nights with several new moons are known as Mistrahs. Promstrahs are characterized by a surge in latent magic, and, to a small extent, a surge of life. The effect on magic-users is beneficial; Casters receive a roughly 10% boost in their magical reserves on these days. Mistrahs are the opposite of Promstrahs, where magic seems to be ebbing away. Casters take a 10% hit in their casting ability on these days. On the few occasions when both a Promstrah and a Mistrah fall on the same night, their effects cancel each other out, and nothing special happens.
I really like this effect. I like how it would influence events in the past and PC play.
Does magic flow from the moons? I'd need to make the inference that celestial bodies were the source of magic, or at least connected to them.
More coming later, I hope. This sis a good start...
I notice your language groups--are the language groups based on racial relationship as well? Normally most wouldn't say for instance that halflings, goblins and gnomes are similar yet you present it as such.
No, the language groups are simply a relation in syntax, grammar, and style to an (often dead) proto-language.
Using your example, the gnomes, halflings, and goblins aren't racially similar at all, they just happened to pick up the same base language, which split into what is now the three different languages.
QuoteI have enough trouble believing in a world where every race seems to separate nations by race, but imagining a country of half elves, instead off staying put in one of the parent race countries, stretches even a fantasy world logic. I know you have the new ones staying there, but having a 'mutt-land' is a little wierd. Maybe it is more of a duchy or province?
Remember, until relatively recently, most nations in our world were split along racial lines, and anyone who wan't that suffered rather severe penalties. considering these aren't just races, but separate species, I think they're doing pretty well.
As for the half-elves, they are a separate race, and breed true. They have for many, many generations.
QuoteSo Umer is really eveil, yet orcs worship him...So your orcs are really monstrous...
Think the Reavers in Serenity and Firefly. That's my Orcs.
QuoteNeme, Chaotic, Evil, Emotional, unstable...God of Law. Sure. Why not?
Law, in this case, being the retributive kind. Eye for an eye, that kind of thing. If your sister died by starvation, go ahead and starve her murderer, several times, if you wish.
That seems rather fitting of a chaotic society to me, despite codified rule systems.
QuoteMica, Chaotic, Evil, patron of ruiners and destruction...relatively peaceful. And are barbarians chaotic evil here?
Barbarians don't have to be. But you need to remember relative. Stuff still gets destroyed, just not as bad as it woud be should he have not been checked.
I've just read the main thread, and will just state my opinions of things chronologically as I sift thru it a second time.
Races
It's almost like reading a travel brochure and finding out what people are like over there. But what's missing from these entries are cultural quirks and idiomatic expressions.
For instance, in many brochures that showcase Hispanic countries they state that men will yell, whistle and hiss at beautiful women from across the street. Also, in the French language, you never introduce yourself by saying "I am Eric", you'd say it "I call myself Eric". This actually signifies very deep and profound differences into the psych of both French and Hispanic cultures. Not that we play D&D to create new cultures.
Any particular reason why only the races from the PHB are used? (Did somebody already ask that question?)
Humans: The typical everywhere, everything race. Nothing wrong with that.
Half-Orcs as Pirates? Sure. But are orcs greasy, ugly pig-men, or WoW styled feral green skined peeps?
Also, I'd be interested in having the orcs go WAAAAGH!
Gnomes: Always the inventors. Nothing wrong with that.
Halflings: I can't stand these personally, but you've made them fill a niche I'd use grots for. I like your style. Comical and ingenious.
Dwarves: Typical crafts people of the Undermountain. A safe bet to use this model.
Elves and Half-elves: I've stopped liking the idea that elves are mortals of flesh and blood. I like Tolkien Elves or Keeblar Elves (AKA: Shoe Gnomes). No other comments.
Arcanist Class
It's a wizard, on ice. There's no numbers in under the "Arcs" column and I don't understand what's up with the "Spells Mastered" column, as none of the ability descriptions explain it.
It's so much like the wizard, that I wounder why you bothered. It just seams to be a whole lotta work to keep track of spells and minutes and what's online an what day of the year it is, and leaves them vulnerable to ambushes.
Regions
The most interesting area to me is the Sunken Hills. Reefs, shallow water and orcs, orcs, orcs. I smell a pirates life!
Crystals
These things appear to be must have items, so why do I have to pay for them?
It's like Natural Spell and Druids.
As crafted items, I say ditch that idea. Make these items class features, like familiars but not a hidden weaknesses that waiting to be exploited if used. At level X you have a set of crystals of X power levels. If you loose one, you go home and get another. Kinda like replacing followers or generic zombies.
New Items
I like the concept of windships. I myself am a zeppelin/Cloud City fan. As to the other items...
The Plungus bush is interesting, but I wouldn't use it.
Daumar: No comment.
Golden Wheat: Meh... Interesting, but I wouldn't use it.
Life in the World
Religion: Skipped. 5 gods with 5 kids each. Not gonna bother.
Mythology: I found no spelling mistakes nor grammatical errors, but it wasn't memorable. But the idea that there' is not much of a recorded history and that people can only tell the story of their world thru myths, legends and fables is ingenious.
Tymeline: Arbitrary numbers. Whatever. The Newyears festival seams like an excuse for warrior types to get all uppity and try to bone spellcasters. That could make an interesting plot device...
Holidays and Festivals: Post Moar Plz
Governments and Organizations
I didn't read these. Sorry.
QuoteRaces
It's almost like reading a travel brochure and finding out what people are like over there. But what's missing from these entries are cultural quirks and idiomatic expressions.
For instance, in many brochures that showcase Hispanic countries they state that men will yell, whistle and hiss at beautiful women from across the street. Also, in the French language, you never introduce yourself by saying "I am Eric", you'd say it "I call myself Eric". This actually signifies very deep and profound differences into the psych of both French and Hispanic cultures. Not that we play D&D to create new cultures.
I do need to add that stuff, haven't quite gotten around to fleshing our the races to that extent, simply becuase it's covered more on a nation-by-nation case.
QuoteAny particular reason why only the races from the PHB are used? (Did somebody already ask that question?)
Yeah. I didn't want a slew of new races, or force into the setting MM races. The original ones do it for me.
QuoteAlso, I'd be interested in having the orcs go WAAAAGH!
:?:
QuoteHalflings: I can't stand these personally, but you've made them fill a niche I'd use grots for. I like your style. Comical and ingenious.
What don't you like about them, and what's so comical?
QuoteArcanist Class
It's a wizard, on ice. There's no numbers in under the "Arcs" column and I don't understand what's up with the "Spells Mastered" column, as none of the ability descriptions explain it.
It's so much like the wizard, that I wounder why you bothered. It just seams to be a whole lotta work to keep track of spells and minutes and what's online an what day of the year it is, and leaves them vulnerable to ambushes.
Uh-huh. Heaven forbid a casting class have a weakness, right?
As for the missing info, it's becuase I haven't finished the magic system that supports this guy. He's replacing both the wizard and the sorcerer classes.
QuoteCrystals
These things appear to be must have items, so why do I have to pay for them?
It's like Natural Spell and Druids.
Er, you pay for a fighter's weapon, you pay for a cleric's holy symbol, why WOULDN'T you pay for these? Some of them provide rather large bonuses, besides.
QuoteAs crafted items, I say ditch that idea. Make these items class features, like familiars but not a hidden weaknesses that waiting to be exploited if used. At level X you have a set of crystals of X power levels. If you loose one, you go home and get another. Kinda like replacing followers or generic zombies.
Yeah, so free, expendable, and powerful magic items going to a full-casting class with no side effects? Right. Did you notice they pay for costly items components AND XP costs?
QuoteNew Items
I like the concept of windships. I myself am a zeppelin/Cloud City fan. As to the other items...
The Plungus bush is interesting, but I wouldn't use it.
Daumar: No comment.
Golden Wheat: Meh... Interesting, but I wouldn't use it.
The wheat, primarily, can't be used, as most of the world are already addicted. It's flavor text and setting info rather than 'here's a bunch of stuff players will enjoy.'
Quote from: Stargate525QuoteAlso, I'd be interested in having the orcs go WAAAAGH!
:?:
It's a 40k reference. If you don't get it that's fine.
Quote from: Goblins. Nice.
[quote1196108419QuoteArcanist Class
It's a wizard, on ice. There's no numbers in under the "Arcs" column and I don't understand what's up with the "Spells Mastered" column, as none of the ability descriptions explain it.
It's so much like the wizard, that I wounder why you bothered. It just seams to be a whole lotta work to keep track of spells and minutes and what's online an what day of the year it is, and leaves them vulnerable to ambushes.
Uh-huh. Heaven forbid a casting class have a weakness, right?
This is a either horrible unrecoverable weakness, or an extra redundant layer of weakness on top a weakness that horribly rapes your character anyway. Being at a disadvantage because a Babau got the drop on you is one thing, but being vulnerable every unforeseeable encounter is not a weakness I would ever consider PCs having. Remeber, after level 16, casters do every thing, and if one isn't, then there's a good chance for a TPK.
[quote1196108419]
QuoteCrystals
These things appear to be must have items, so why do I have to pay for them?
It's like Natural Spell and Druids.
Er, you pay for a fighter's weapon, you pay for a cleric's holy symbol, why WOULDN'T you pay for these? Some of them provide rather large bonuses, besides.[/quote]
Bad examples. Equipment dependent character classes like fighters and barbarians have golf bags of sticks they pick up from adventuring. They never buy equipment. Ever. The turnip and gold economies specifically rape characters that try to craft and sell magic swords, or buy them. The only thing you "purchase" is starting equipment, and wands of cure light wounds. Everything else is covered by having a well balanced team of PCs.
Holy symbol? 4 ranks in Craft and some pocket change you can mug hobos/ogres for.
[quote1196108419]
QuoteAs crafted items, I say ditch that idea. Make these items class features, like familiars but not a hidden weaknesses that waiting to be exploited if used. At level X you have a set of crystals of X power levels. If you loose one, you go home and get another. Kinda like replacing followers or generic zombies.
Yeah, so free, expendable, and powerful magic items going to a full-casting class with no side effects? Right. Did you notice they pay for costly items components AND XP costs?[/quote]
No actually, I didn't notice that. But I don't like that part either.
The thing is, every character class brings to the party a set of resources that they expend against any encounter's expenditure of resources in an effort to gain XP. You can say that some character's don't care much for monster slaying and XP grinding, they just want renown. But to acquire renown, you must perform tasks that require a certain level of power, and your level of power is based apon your XP total. You're sword must be
this long to slay the dragon and your staff
this long to lay the princess.
Forcing someone to spend XP to stay level apropriate is contradictory, and when done right can be abused as part of a difference engine. GP and wealth by level guidelines become irrelevant after level 11, and can even be circumvented as early as level 4.
Players and DMs should only have to be burdened with two types of resources:
*Infinite resources of limited scope and circumstance: weapons strikes, sneak attack and wands of firebolt*Finite expendable resources that can be replenished: Followers/zombies/flying monkeys, spell slots/points, ammunition, HP
Acquirable resources that can be shuffled and mutated lead to imbalances like
Fabrication factories and fighters not being able to contribute to combat after level 10.
QuoteIn my experience, halflings have been used as an excuse to play midgets...
What I find comical is that you placed halflings in a role that I would attribute to being invested with goblins. Really short ugly people of the jungle. To me Pygmies = Goblins. Nice.
That's an issue with the players then, not the setting. If you look, the Halflings are a rather serious bunch
QuoteThis is a either horrible unrecoverable weakness, or an extra redundant layer of weakness on top a weakness that horribly rapes your character anyway. Being at a disadvantage because a Babau got the drop on you is one thing, but being vulnerable every unforeseeable encounter is not a weakness I would ever consider PCs having. Remeber, after level 16, casters do every thing, and if one isn't, then there's a good chance for a TPK.
Again, HOW ARE THEY WEAK? That they have a little less power on some days, and more on others? That they are spontaneous casters WITH spellbooks?
QuoteBad examples. Equipment dependent character classes like fighters and barbarians have golf bags of sticks they pick up from adventuring. They never buy equipment. Ever. The turnip and gold economies specifically rape characters that try to craft and sell magic swords, or buy them. The only thing you "purchase" is starting equipment, and wands of cure light wounds. Everything else is covered by having a well balanced team of PCs.
This is equipment, same as everything else. The crystals of an enemy spellcaster don't vaporize with his death.
QuoteThe thing is, every character class brings to the party a set of resources that they expend against any encounter's expenditure of resources in an effort to gain XP. You can say that some character's don't care much for monster slaying and XP grinding, they just want renown. But to acquire renown, you must perform tasks that require a certain level of power, and your level of power is based apon your XP total. You're sword must be this long to slay the dragon and your staff this long to lay the princess.
Forcing someone to spend XP to stay level apropriate is contradictory, and when done right can be abused as part of a difference engine. GP and wealth by level guidelines become irrelevant after level 11, and can even be circumvented as early as level 4.
Players and DMs should only have to be burdened with two types of resources:*Infinite resources of limited scope and circumstance: weapons strikes, sneak attack and wands of firebolt*Finite expendable resources that can be replenished: Followers/zombies/flying monkeys, spell slots/points, ammunition, HP
Acquirable resources that can be shuffled and mutated lead to imbalances like Fabrication factories and fighters not being able to contribute to combat after level 10.
I don't even understand this.
OK... I guess the skills I've acquired trying to come up with house rules and making my own games is muddling what I'm trying to communicate with jargon you're not familiar with.
There are two things that affect a character's power. Their level, and their equipment.
The wealth by level guidelines found in the DMG are both inaccurate and don't actually help you keep a PC's power at the apropriate level.
Consider a fighter with fifteen different magical swords. Quite likely, this character has enough gear to throw him well over the expected wealth for his level. But you may still notice that he is under performing. I've actually had a character like this, and the reason behind this phenomenon is that an item's power is based apon it's GP value, but you can only bring a limited number of these to use in a single action. I only have four arms, and having more than that many swords is redundant.
Also, consider what a character needs to perform properly at whatever level. Does the GP/lvl chart allow you aquire this? In most cases: No. Fighters need 4 times the expected GP in gear to perform properly at level 10, 5 times if there's no cleric donating buffs. This disparately increases with level.
Additionally, there is the possibility that characters will just exploit a set of rules then generate an unlimited amount of GP.
When it comes to trading XP, there are enough loopholes and bad rules that spending XP in an effort to prevent a character from being of the same level as another because he spent time and money on a booster item is a very bad concept. Also, this can backfire.
Consider the following: A spell caster spends XP to create an item that increases his saves. Why did he do it? Because he needed to bring his defences up to par with his enemies DCs. But he spent XP, which means he's going to level up a little later, then the party members that didn't spend XP will increase in level. At one point, the item crafter is going to be so far behind his comrades that he'll be in danger of encountering one of his friend's rivals, and will be defeated despite having spent all that XP on boosters 'cause their are certain bonuses that come with actually being a higher level. Level = power.
In the reverse, one could just wish for a Staff of Wishes. 'Nough said.
The problem with that entire line of reasoning is that it's not a setting specific issue. Short of throwing out the whole system and rebuilding, I've no way to fix that.
Second, you've got the crystals wrong. The crystals will actually pay for Xp costs of spellcasting, instead of the character.
Quote from: Stargate525The problem with that entire line of reasoning is that it's not a setting specific issue. Short of throwing out the whole system and rebuilding, I've no way to fix that.
Yeah you do. Understand the changes that need to be made, and make them. Or at the very least, start by finding stuff that other's have already done to fix the problems they find. There are many directions to take, because D&D as it stands assumes every level of power is being used. Just pick one.
QuoteSecond, you've got the crystals wrong. The crystals will actually pay for Xp costs of spellcasting, instead of the character.
Doesn't cost XP to make Crystals? If yes, then it follows the same problems I detect in [Item Creation] line.
Okay, I'm going to zoom right past mechanics.
Using alignment, eh? More power to you, and down with the naysayers I say!
Love the crystals. Connotes a sense that magic is a true natural force, being channeled through the precious stones that are the very symbolic lifeblood of the earth. You might want to explore that symbolic connection.
Humans
On "An elf on a Human city":
What a strange elf.
You've got an interesting distinction between human individuals and their nations. It seems a very enlightened mindset that the other nations possess, acknowledging that the people are not the same as their covetous, usurping leaders.
"Most humans are borrowers, plain and simple."
This, coupled with the succeeding sentences creates a rather full image. I see a race surrounded by multitudinous knick-knacks and dohickies, mistaking trash for treasure and treasure for trash, never entirely comprehending the value of the miscellany they accumulate. I see a lot of innocent, well-meaning pretension (if there is such a thing), and then the dangerous paradoxical arrogance that inevitably pervades any Imperialist state.
Elves
The dying-elf shtick (and its variations really bugs me, but it is more than made up for by the explanatiion provided for their xenophobia. Its like they looked out at the lands beyond the waters and just said "eww, we must do something about this mess."
Gnomes
This incarnation doesn't seem any more or less substantial than any other I've seen. Like always, they just seem too darn... nice. I really can't see myself adventuring amongst them, which I consider a definite requirement for any common race.
Halflings
They confuse me. At first it looks like they've got the honour-stick rammed good and hard up their backsides, which suggests some kind of badass tropical feudalist nation with little hobbit Daimyos and Samwise Samurais. But then you go and say they get along with almost everyone. Why?!? The idea of roving halfling ronin was - like - lickwid awsome!
Perhaps it just needs a little clarification. At the moment they seem a little contradictory.
Half-Orcs
I love the fact that they know their own weaknesses and limitations, and constrain their lives accordingly. Their fiery nature is given more large-scale implications.
Dwarves
Pretty standard fare, but a cool shift from Elves to Halflings as the focus of Dwarven ire. "I dunno, it's just, every time I see one of those buggers' puckered little faces, I just want to bash his head in!"
Hey Stargate, I love your gnomes and half-orcs. I think you need to know that. Your design methodology for gnomes is brilliant, combining intellectual geniuses but somewhat dropping that "gnomes equate technology" stereotype. That's exactly what gnomes should be.
The half-orcs are just cool. I would love to play one.
I really want to tell you to drop dwarves since they feel like an unnecessary race in Dilandri. And then you'd be down to five races - humans, elves, gnomes, halflings, and orcs. Their spot in the world could easily be filled with other races (gnomes, halflings, or "mountain men"). The issue would be that the drop would deviate you from the Player's Handbook, and your goal seems more to fix the races than to mess with them.
I suppose.
Well, it's been over a year since my last Dilandri review, so I'll start looking again from the beginning and comment as I go. Since you've got so much material (it appears), I probably won't finish a whole review at once. And I didn't want to read every comment so far, so forgive me if other posters have covered this.
For starters, I tend to agree with Jharviss about keeping only five races. Less is more where races are concerned, in my book. Especially if you're not planning on adapting your setting to 4e (which I would if it's a D&D setting).
HumansThe second most common race? Interesting choice. I wouldn't make it, but I appreciate your desire to differentiate your world.
Personality: blatant contradictions. Exactly what you'd expect ;)
Relations: Any particular reason humans think themselves superior to other races (that fact that you mention it makes me assume it goes beyond the expected levels of ethnocentrism)? Have they had some racial leader/religion that preached this and other races haven't?
This lead-in about grain is enticing. I'll be curious to see how this Drian Confederacy works.
Lands: Is the whole human race part of the Drian Confederacy? Are there not as many human cultures on Dilandri as we find on Earth?
GnomesPersonal pet peeve: you describe gnomes being what gnomes "SHOULD be." Unless you're making them mythologically accurate earth elementals, I'd prefer not to be told what a race should be, only what it is.
And secondly, it seems like any race where everyone is a Renaissance man would either redefine the standard of brilliance and conquer the world (or be enslaved by others to allow them to do so), or more likely collapse in on itself being unable to support that kind of lifestyle en mass. However, perhaps when I read them I will be convinced. I prepare for convincing now.
Quote from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trill_%28Star_Trek%29trill[/url]?
QuoteThey make for interesting conversationalists, but long-winded.
:D
I like that they have a sense of humor, here.
Knot stories. Cool. Elaborate?
Lands: Is it an island or a continent? I'm confused based on earlier text.
Religion: Isn't the Five a human religion? Why would xenophobic elves even know much about it?
So I'll try to review so more later.
I leave you with the most important question of all:
When is Dilandri going on the wiki?
Half-OrcsIntro: neat new take. I like them as pirate/crystal hunters.
Personality: Inner-strife is great for drama in play or stories. Way better than classic racial prejudice.
Relations: Dwarves are trying to shut down Crystal trade!? What! I suppose you're going to explain what crystals are later, why dwarves want to stop the trade, and why you capitalize "Crystals."
What about their relations to true orcs? Why does the entire culture want to emphasize human nature over orc nature?
Culture: The emphasis on law as humanity is good. Do half-orcs breed true like half-elves?
Lands: Are there dragons in the Dragon Lands? Do they mind the half-orcs?
DwarvesQuoteDwarves can be most easily described as intense, dedicated, and logical. Their emotions are passionate and deep, they always finish the task they are doing, and they have a cool, calculating outlook on life. They tend to keep to themselves and make smart comments, but are immensely loyal and trustworthy. They have a long but intense temper. And angry Dwarf is often a murderous dwarf.
An[/b] angry..." Typo help.
An angry dwarf is murderous? Doesn't sound like a race ruled by logic to me.
Relations: Okay, now I see why they don't like half-orc crystals.
Why do they constantly war with halflings?
Admittedly muddled logic. I suppose that answers that question.
QuoteTheomis and his Tools
Best name for a religion in a long time. :D
And that's it for races. But I think you should offer more info on orcs, since they seem important in your setting.
Quote from: PhoenixFor starters, I tend to agree with Jharviss about keeping only five races. Less is more where races are concerned, in my book. Especially if you're not planning on adapting your setting to 4e (which I would if it's a D&D setting).
Which two, then, should I cut? I've got the base seven, and since two of those are 'half' races, that leaves five.
Quote from: PhoenixRelations: Any particular reason humans think themselves superior to other races (that fact that you mention it makes me assume it goes beyond the expected levels of ethnocentrism)? Have they had some racial leader/religion that preached this and other races haven't?
It's basically Dria that's doing it. Think Pre-war Hitler-esque rhetoric stripped of the genocide and violence. Yeah
Quote from: PhoenixLands: Is the whole human race part of the Drian Confederacy? Are there not as many human cultures on Dilandri as we find on Earth?
There are eight. humans are Europe, so there are differences, but not very large ones. Dria dominates all of them, both in land size and culturally.
Quote from: PhoenixPersonal pet peeve: you describe gnomes being what gnomes "SHOULD be." Unless you're making them mythologically accurate earth elementals, I'd prefer not to be told what a race should be, only what it is.
Sorry, what I think they should be.
Quote from: PhoenixAnd secondly, it seems like any race where everyone is a Renaissance man would either redefine the standard of brilliance and conquer the world (or be enslaved by others to allow them to do so), or more likely collapse in on itself being unable to support that kind of lifestyle en mass. However, perhaps when I read them I will be convinced. I prepare for convincing now.
Shh... *force wave*
This isn't the realism your looking for...
Quote from: PhoenixQuote from: PhoenixQuote from: PhoenixI admit the idea of these clever toy makers appeals. There seems a contradiction in the way your write about earning a gnome's trust being difficult, and a few sentences later about making friends is easy (and that you mention friendliness specifically, a word which implies they are friendly towards those they meet). I see you're trying to clear it up with the sentence of acquaintances, but it all comes across a little muddled.
I've re-written the gnoes several times, and I've obviously missed references in every pass, so I've got a strange amixture of several re-writes. That will, of course, be fixed. I just DONT LIKE DOING IT. Small butt text boxes... the titles alone take up half the box with code.
Quote from: PhoenixLands: Great description of the continent. I'd be interested to hear more about this (with a map!)
maps, maps, maps, that's all you care about, isn't it? :P
Quote from: PhoenixMagology. Cool.
Names: Well, bizarre naming rules makes them exotic, if that's what you're going for. But the sample names are simple enough that they don't become a burden on your players. So that's good.
Languages: Are these names derived from names of countries?
the languages are based on the name of the nation in which it began. Some of them no longer exist, so...
Quote from: PhoenixHalflings
:-p we need a rofl smiley.
Ok. These are awesome. I have no real suggestions. I liked it all. And I don't really like halflings (unless you're Tolkien they feel out of place--actually for that reason this might make a nice completely original race).
Actually, I did think of one thing. If these are so militant, and the most populous race, why haven't they taken over the Drian Confederacy?
Because they're stuck fighting each other and the dwarves, and they like having cheap wheat brought to them; more time to fight.
And why do people always laugh at my halflings?
Quote from: PhoenixWhere's the halfling quotation?
In my head, waiting to be typed and brought to the front of my consciousness (hopefully not in that order).
Quote from: PhoenixElves
Quote from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trill_%28Star_Trek%29trill[/url]?
shh!
Now where did I put that Neuralyzer...?
Quote from: PhoenixKnot stories. Cool. Elaborate?
No. I refuse to build mechanics for storing complex stories into complex knots. If you want to, feel free. For now, the idea is all you get.
Unless you meant something else?
Quote from: PhoenixLands: Is it an island or a continent? I'm confused based on earlier text.
Religion: Isn't the Five a human religion? Why would xenophobic elves even know much about it?
It's both. It's like Australia. And the elves know of the five becuase some of them are xenophillic. It's confusing, and mostly a remnant of my numerous re-writes. I've edited it.
Quote from: PhoenixWhen is Dilandri going on the wiki?
NEVAH! I despise wikis with the burning anger of a thousand suns...
In reality, when it gets closer to finished/polished, and with the all important MAPS.
The idea of a world's core races and player races are different things. You have six races in your world: humans, dwarves, elves, gnomes, halflings, and orcs. Orcs are not playable, but half-orcs and half-elves are. Regardless, those are still unnatural races, even if they are treated as being full-fledged races. I would cut the dwarves, which would drop you to humans, elves, gnomes, halflings, and orcs - five races. That would therefore drop you to six playable "races," which includes the two intermixed races.
Make sense?
Better yet, ditch the halflings and the give the halfling flavor to dwarves!
My review of dwarves and half-orcs got buried (post while you were typing).
I'll tackle the next section in a moment.
ArcanistNot too much info in this section, so I'll look more in magic when I get there.
QuoteArcanists worship Mineva, God of magic, above all others. However, some do still hold to their racial god after their training.
Serona[/b]
Gorgeous pic. Did you take/make that? Is it public domain :yumm: ?
And the map is...
I feel cheated.
Instead of primary race, second race, and tertiary races (which seems a little overkill), maybe you could just list races with % like:
Races: halfling (60%), dwarf (25%), human (10%), gnome (10%), other (5%)
Big, big trees. Sweet.
QuoteDespite this trade, the Dwarves and the Halflings have not always been peaceful neighbors.
To the East and North lies the ancestral land
or the Half-elf.[/quote]Dragonlands[/b]
:whoa: :whoa: :whoa: Where are you getting these pictures?
"Very little is known" only works if you don't make the race from there playable. Even then, I'd only use it if this is written solely for players, rather than for other designers to critique or other DMs to use.
Sunken HillsI love archipelagos. Random question: do you have merfolk or other aquatic races?
Like orcs as pirates roaming the isles.
QuoteThey are divided into hundreds, some clans with no more than a single ship and a sandbar island to their name.
Typo.
So I'll do so more later, or maybe tomorrow.
VarthmikThis is a little confusing. Is Varthmik the island continent labeled "Gnome Lands" on the map?
Why 3 pics when everywhere else has one? I like the bridge most, though it kind of looks like something I'd expected to see in Britain.
Schizophrenic weather patterns, while an amusing choice of words, doesn't actually make sense. I know what you mean, but I'd only use that kind of phrase if your setting is supposed to be comical, rather than taken seriously (and it seems serious).
Interesting about the gnome countries working as a single country. Wouldn't it then make more sense for them to be a single kingdom with many states? Are they democracies, monarchies? I know from the racial page they are meritocratic, so how are governors chosen? Is it the same for all three? What are the names of these countries? Does gnomish standoffishness not apply to other gnomes at all?
Quoteand the Gnome Culture is in a constant zenith with the influx and collision of new ideas, arts, and sciences.
Dragth Gruht[/b]
Another pic I love.
Again, I wouldn't use the "little is known" motif. Don't the elves know something? How about the DM? Plus any place with that awesome a pic deserves some description.
Prestige ClassesThese rock. Best PrC I've seen. It's like the invisible blade, only the whole class is invisible. And invincible.
Though if you plan on going 4e...
ArcanistsEr, didn't we already have an arcanists page?
Quotebreak off and resume the
Windships[/b]
Cool. Do gnomes sell windships to others? Sounds like it'd be big business.
Lightning Harvesters? Reminds me of
Stardust.
Heated gas ships...oooo zeppelins? Explosive?
If you go back to the first post, I've posted the rough line drawing of the entire planet. Be warned, it's friggin HUGE.
Quote from: Stargate525If you go back to the first post, I've posted the rough line drawing of the entire planet. Be warned, it's friggin HUGE.
It helps. Seeing how everything fits together makes a big difference.
ReligionI saw some of this before, but I still like the 5 and 25 motif. I don't recall the gnome/halfling split story from before--that's sweet whether true or not.
I think the list of gods is pretty thorough, so not much to add really.
I was going to say Micas seemed out of place by his portfolio, but his back story makes sense.
It's a little confusing how a clergyman can be both a deacon and a bishop (I see how they can be either and a priest). Is that meant to imply they report to one bishop while other deacons report to them? Why is it set up that way?
I like the Music a lot, though I don't recall hearing about it much in your region or race write-ups. Is it most popular in certain nations?
Some of your spoilers misspell "deities."
If other religions spread from the Four Virtues, why the jump to 5 in so many other religions (5/25 and dragon saints). Or is the idea it's call four virtues, but it always counted the Divine Creator as one?
Wait, now I see this thing on the Fifths. Maybe they spawned the other religions?
Kudos on detailing the holy book. Maybe I should do that for texts in my setting...You've got me thinking.
Continuing the review a bit.
LanguagesHaving language families is a good thing and relates your cultures. That said, I won't read about fictional languages 'cause it's not an area that interests me as much as it does some of the others (that could give you more advice on the subject anyway).
Commerce and TradeShouldn't this be worked into the page for each nation?
Transportation and TravelYou've already covered windships. What did you intend to put here?
MythsQuoteI decided awhile ago that instead of having a generic timeline going back to the dawn of civilization, then trying to figure out how these people would actually know all of this, I'm going to play to my strengths and tell most of the world's history using myths and legends, with actual history making up the last thousand years or so. That, and I have essentially unlimited space to do it, haha!
Origin stories[/i]
I like your Book of Five excerpt. Suitably Biblical in language.
Will it ever matter which of these tales (if any) is true? Can you imagine running a campaign where ancient history played a real role?
Who were the Emerald Ones again? The orcs?
Quotemany starspins ago
starspins? Is that like many moons ago? Do your stars spin? Are they talking about the apparent celestial progress over the course of a year?
As I mentioned before, I like the gnome/halfling creation myth split.
I think the sin/creation myth of man works well. You missed capitalizing Lilnith in one place. :o
Sadly the Book of 5 version of elven creation is more interesting the elves own tale, which is very plain. This is good if you want elven storytelling to be limited and creative potential to seem less than that of humans. But if not, maybe you could spice it up a bit? Perhaps something about betrayal and so forth to explain the xenophobia?
On the other hand, the weather/elemental story is far more vibrant. It's interesting that you comment on the veracity of each story afterwards. Perhaps it might be even better to do this in-character (or was it supposed to be in the words of some historian/mythographer?)
So more later.