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The Archives => Homebrews (Archived) => Topic started by: khyron1144 on January 21, 2007, 06:37:38 PM

Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on January 21, 2007, 06:37:38 PM
Tera (http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?24955)


I would like to know what folks think.  I can take any sort of criticism
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Hibou on January 21, 2007, 07:26:30 PM
Well, I haven't given it a good read over yet, but I like the looks of it and think the artifacts you've given are extremely cool.

Keep it up. :)
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: ~Kalin~ on January 21, 2007, 07:30:36 PM
you may want to place a link from your main page to this one.

I like how all creation is the fragments of The One, atleast from the halflings point of view.

What types of dragons are in your campaign setting? just the usual D&D ones or maybe something else.


From what ive read i gather that Tera is just a rather large continent, not an entire world am i correct? does anyone know what lies across the sea?
QuoteAproximately 70,000 Years ago
A planar portal opened spilling the Horde of the Great Halfling Khan onto the broad fields claimed by The Human Empire of Tera. Another war breaks out and then a peace is brokered allowing the Halflings to settle.

Do we know what caused the portal to open?

thats all the questions i have at the moment, nice start and i look forward to reading more.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on January 24, 2007, 04:03:09 PM
Quote from: Kalin1) you may want to place a link from your main page to this one.

2) I like how all creation is the fragments of The One, atleast from the halflings point of view.

3) What types of dragons are in your campaign setting? just the usual D&D ones or maybe something else.


4) From what ive read i gather that Tera is just a rather large continent, not an entire world am i correct? does anyone know what lies across the sea?

5) Do we know what caused the portal to open?

6) thats all the questions i have at the moment, nice start and i look forward to reading more.

1) Will do.

2) I borrowed the idea from certain real-world religions, especially the Hindu Dharma. Or at least what my westerner's mind understands of it from what I've read on it.

3) Probably all or most of what was in the 2e Monstrous Manual and maybe a few other things as well (I am taking Linmorns under consideration but haven't decided yet, as one for instance).

4) Yes Tera is actually one continent.  The humans probably have little or no memory of what their original home across the sea is like.  The Elves might know a little more, but the fact that none of them have taken a real interest in going back there may indicate something rather nasty lurks on the old place.

5) a) Lingering after-effects of The First God War, or b) some mad wizard's experiment (From a Teran perspective), or c) some mad Wu-Jen's experiment (from a halfling perspective), or d) the machinations of a God, Demon Lord, Arch-Devil, or other powerful being, or e) nobody really knows.

6) Thanks. I'll try to update more as soon as I can.


[Anybody who has been following this may wish to know that I have updated the main thread, including finishing the Ancient history]
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on January 28, 2007, 07:15:32 PM
Kalin,
Consider yourself the first official recipient of the Tera badge:

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and thank you so much.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: ~Kalin~ on January 28, 2007, 08:30:59 PM
thanks for the badge, dont forget to add it to the wiki here (http://thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Review_Badges)

that reminds me, ill have to take another look through your setting.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Stargate525 on February 07, 2007, 05:30:01 PM
Haha, review! I'm writing this as I'm reading, so forgive me if I ask stupid questions that are answered later... Onward.

The Very Beginning of Tera
I like the biblical connotations. About halfway through I was thinking to myself where I had read this before, and when I got to Satan it occurred to me. It allows me to remember what the history is, so that's good. I'm on the fence about using the actual names for the devils (Satan, Lucifer, whatever), but that might simply be a matter of preference. Is The One worshiped as a God, or simply the benevolent creator? Are the devils and demons still allowed to be worshiped and gain power from the third multitude, or did the arrangement change after the war? Is this story known by people in your world today? If so, how?

More Ancient History
I like history, carry on.
QuoteThe dragons were too divided among themselves and complacent to hang onto their empire when the elves invaded from across the Eastern Sea.
Humans were the next race to invade. The elves fought back hard, but had an additional problem when a faction of their own race turned to worshipping dark powers including Lolth the Spider Queen. Eventually the elves and humans came to an agreement to drive the newly christened Svartaelfs into the Dwarven Mountains.[/quote]27,000 Years Ago
In reaction to the peace and stability the humans and demihumans now have, the Shadow Pantheon creates its own alliance of mortal champions and servitors (with the exception of Yeenoghu and Lucifer; both get lumped in with the Shadow Pantheon because of their common history in The Fall, however both have different aims than the rest of the Shadow Gods; Yeenoghu wants to kill all the other Gods; Lucifer wants to try and lead the world away from power and influence, including the power and influence of the Gods).

Hasan the Slayer receives Old Man's Blade and The Black Armor (perfect tools for an assassin).

Martin Shadowen receives The Shadow Book and Staff of The Shadow Wizards (his subsequent actions in the northern lands may account for some of the superstitious dread barbarians have of wizardly magic).

Kruk recieved the Short Sword of Might, The Armor of Glory, and The War Drums of the Great War Chief (Hobgoblins respect functionality as much as dwarves do and war drums are the only way to get the lesser goblinoids all marching in the same direction at once).

In secret, Yeenoghu delivers to his champion The Flind Bar of Might, The Cape of Yeenoghu's Chosen, and Bonechewer, a most exceptional Hyenadon (Because of Yeenoghu's madness, gnolls and flinds are fanatical montheists who hate all other sentient races).

Lucifer, Ssendam, and Ygorl secretly collaborate on The Cosmic Joke, a unique spell/ disease/ non-corporeal entity that can accomplish much with the right corporeal host, yet which is not under anyone's control, particularly not the entities that created it; They believe that to be part of the punchline.[/quote]3,000 Years Ago
Age of Rust.
Iron Emperors become ruthless, decadent, mad, or combinations thereof. Empire starts losing territory, beginning with unofficial annexation of certain northern villages.[/quote]Recent History[/b]
I like this, giving a breakdown of how things got to what they are now is always a good thing. I do have some questions though. What did the people think about this war-hero simply killing the emperor and assuming the throne? Is this a common occurrence? Other than that act, Gladius seems to be a good, fair ruler. It might make more cohesive sense to have him inherit the throne, unless I'm completely misjudging his character. Does anyone know that Cestus is in the army? What alias is he using?

QuoteThe Human Empire...
Human Regalia of Rulership[/b]
Huh. I can say I wasn't expecting this. I was hoping to see some more detail about these artifacts, but not have them completely statted out. Do you intend these things to actually fall into the players' hands? If not, why have them statted in this way? I'd personally like to see it in more of a narrative sense; instead of 'IV; Yearning to be worshipped is uncontrollable; those failing to bow and scrape will be instantly attacked,' you might consider 'possession of these items bestows an almost maniacal obsession with worship.' It leaves the interpretation of exactly how that manifests up to the Dm, as I doubt having the king instantly attack someone would always be good form.

Although these bestow some impressive personal defensive and offensive powers, they really don't seem worth it, and almost preclude having a good king on the throne for more than a month or so before he turns into a complete psychopath. Why did the good Gods create such detrimental objects? Or have they been somehow perverted?

The God Pools
 :weirdo: These are... interesting to say the least. These things must be fought over like diamond mines. I don't understand the pool of time, do you mean that they age ten times slower than normal? The fact that there are fortresses built over each of these things seems dubious; that means that the locations are all known, and that bathing in all of them shouldn't be too hard. i'm not sure that I like these too much, they seem way too easy to abuse. What causes these, besides closeness of the Gods? Why are they in the specific locations?


The setting doesn't seem very far along yet, and that's fine. (Neither is mine). I see alot of potential for very cool things and concepts in this setting, and I will definitely re-review this sometime in the future. However, some of the things you do have might stand to be rethought; they don't seem to fit with the aspect of what they are as well as they could. I also see some pretty big holes in information, but that's to be expected for a setting of this size. I'm sure that most of the will be more than filled by the time it's finished. Again, I see a lot of potential, and look forward to seeing this setting develop.  
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 08, 2007, 12:23:30 AM
Quote from: Stargate525The God Pools
 :weirdo: 1) These are... interesting to say the least. 2) These things must be fought over like diamond mines.  3)I don't understand the pool of time, do you mean that they age ten times slower than normal?  

1) That is my intention, to always be, at the very least, interesting.
2) Yeah, kind of.  Whatever race has them wants to keep them, and when another race finds out about it, they want it.  That's only natural with natural resources.
3) That is my intent, yes.  I'll work on the wording to make it clearer.


You think when it's done, geography should go before history to make it clear why the places mentioned are important?



Quote from: Stargate525This initially confused me. I wasn't sure if you had lesser princes of demonic kingdoms getting these or what. It's the traditional 'beast' races though, right? Most of them would do well to have the race they were bequeathed to actually mentioned in the description. These need it especially, because these are harder to infer. I like the wry humor in the goblin and the cosmic joke portions. Whether intended or not, it made me laugh. Comic relief in what so far seems to be a rather serious setting can never go awry. What exactly IS the Cosmic Joke anyway?

I'll work on that wording.

I'll get to explaining it better later.  Right now, let's say it functions kind of like a disease or possessing entity in that it can hop from user to user and has no physical substance (although user might not be the right word since the user serves the joke's purpose as much as the other way around).  It does interesting, sometimes beneficial, things for the user but also has a dangerous side.  One probable effect is that it effectively turns magic-users of any sort into something like wild mages.


Quote from: Stargate525Human Regalia of Rulership
Huh. I can say I wasn't expecting this. I was hoping to see some more detail about these artifacts, but not have them completely statted out. Do you intend these things to actually fall into the players' hands? If not, why have them statted in this way? I'd personally like to see it in more of a narrative sense; instead of 'IV; Yearning to be worshipped is uncontrollable; those failing to bow and scrape will be instantly attacked,' you might consider 'possession of these items bestows an almost maniacal obsession with worship.' It leaves the interpretation of exactly how that manifests up to the Dm, as I doubt having the king instantly attack someone would always be good form.

Although these bestow some impressive personal defensive and offensive powers, they really don't seem worth it, and almost preclude having a good king on the throne for more than a month or so before he turns into a complete psychopath. Why did the good Gods create such detrimental objects? Or have they been somehow perverted?


Probably in the original post on wotc's boards where I started posting my world, I mentioned that I used the system for statting artifacts from the 1st edition Dungeon Master's Guide because that seemed to have the best format.  In that system, the great power of artifacts (unlimited charges, some powers usable at will with no per day limit) was balanced with drawbacks.  For the human set of artifacts, I was trying to choose drawbacks that would not cripple a warrior-king too quickly.

Looking at it again, the human artifacts are probably a bit underpowered compared to the ones in the DMG.  They need at least one or two more minor powers and major powers and I could probably have left out one or more of the drawbacks someplace and it would look right compared to The Rod of Seven Parts or the Hand of Vecna or similar.

Why stat them at all?  I do not intend for PCs to become kings, but PCs never do what is expected.  I'm the kind of DM that likes to have the hit points for every planned goblin in his dungeon to be rolled up ahead of time.  I like to know what spells my NPC wizards have in their spell books, not just spells memorized.  It's probably a bit too much, but I like to know what things in my world do and spell it out exactly even when I'm the one creating things.



Oh, and Stargate, thank you much. questions like these are very helpful at this stage.
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Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 08, 2007, 10:25:35 AM
Well, I spent some time updating and editing.


Does it flow any better or make more sense now?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Stargate525 on February 08, 2007, 11:41:48 AM
Quote from: khyron1144Oh, and Stargate, thank you much. questions like these are very helpful at this stage.
Consider yourself a recipient of the official Tera badge:
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My pleasure. I see you've updated, so I'll take a look later on (I'm currently sitting at school, not enough time.)
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 19, 2007, 10:20:14 AM
Rather major update.  History is finished.  Entirely.

Also have a current map.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Matt Larkin (author) on February 20, 2007, 03:54:14 PM
Out of curiousity, why use mostly mythological deities, then throw in Moradin?  It feels kind of odd.

The assassin's guild is cool.  Though the name looks a little too much like Rubber Sinister to be scary.  You got to fear that evil elastic...

While the map is basic, one thing I do like about it is that you have a scale.  By using hexes, you make it easy to see distance and scale.  Perhaps it is something I should have considered.  On the other hand, it means they have to be taken out for the final version (if you want the seemless look, anyway), so it's a trade-off.

As for the stats for that dragon, I take it you are not playing standard rules, if 27th level has 92hp.  Caused I'd :cry:
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Stargate525 on February 20, 2007, 04:06:37 PM
Quote from: Phoenix KnightThe assassin's guild is cool.  Though the name looks a little too much like Rubber Sinister to be scary.  You got to fear that evil elastic...
I get Rubber Sinatra from it... much weirder.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 20, 2007, 05:24:07 PM
Quote from: Phoenix KnightAs for the stats for that dragon, I take it you are not playing standard rules, if 27th level has 92hp.  Caused I'd :cry:
It's actually standard rules for 2e.  The maximum HP per level bonus for non-fighters is 2.  After 9th level, hit dice are no longer rolled only 2 HP are added a level.


Quote from: Phoenix KnightThe assassin's guild is cool.  Though the name looks a little too much like Rubber Sinister to be scary.  You got to fear that evil elastic...


It's Latin that someone gave me.  It sounds much cooler when pronounced with the "u" making an "ooh" and the "e" making an "ay" and the "i"s making "ee"s it sounds kind of cool.


Quote from: Phoenix KnightOut of curiousity, why use mostly mythological deities, then throw in Moradin?  It feels kind of odd.

Maybe it's an ill-considered choice, but I'm going with it for now.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Matt Larkin (author) on February 23, 2007, 01:41:25 PM
It's been a while since I've taken a thorough look.  In the spirit of reciprical reviews:

Quote from: kyronBy the way: a million bonus geek points to anyone who can tell me exactly why the number 124 appears at what was the bottom of the page until I tipped it sideways.
The Human Empire[/b]
I believe I have mentioned this in another thread, but I'd consider a different name.  It just doesn't impress.

I like the details about the emperor and him not being popular.  However, if this is the case, does he not have rivals to exploit this?  Whether it is a powerful senate, generals, or an aristocracy?  Speaking of which, I recommend adding a few details about the political structure.  It sounds like the emperorship is inherited, as some kind of imperial monarchy.  Is there an aristocracy or other government body?  Is it an autocratic regime?

Good details for the city.  I think you mean Halfingstown.  I have some reservations about the city being named the same as the planet, but it could work.  I would only say that makes it sound like it should be the Teran Empire.

QuoteFinishing school is Tera Prima slang for a house of ill-repute.
Arcanum
Arcanum is the wizardly country. It's bounded on all sides by The Human Empire because it actually used to be part of the Empire. An Emperor of The Iron Dynasty granted Arcanum its independance, with implications of a strong alliance between the two.[/quote]Goblin Lands[/b]
What is a norker?  I'm relatively familiar with 2nd ed, but I don't recall this monster.

What is the Shadow Pantheon (maybe you answer this later and I've forgotten)?

Side note: bugbears were traditionally goblins in folklore, not just D&D (because they were basically the same thing, they are equivalent to boggles in my setting).

Beast Lands
I think this idea can work well.  You've got a few names I don't recognize again.
What is a "Cay man"?  An Alaghi?
Do you mean Rakshasa by Rakasta?  Or is this some other monster.

Do the different inhabitants (that is the different species) get along with each other?  Do they constantly war?  Is mammals versus reptiles?

Dwarven Mountains
I like this section a lot.  My only suggestions right now would be to give an idea of the population numbers, and maybe a little more detail on the dwarven government.  Is it a monarchy?  Are their clans (and are they important)?  Is their an aristocracy?  Who is the king?

History
For now, just a brief glance at history.

QuoteApproximately 70,000 Years ago
A planar portal opened spilling the Horde of the Great Halfling Khan onto the broad fields claimed by The Human Empire of Tera. Another war breaks out and then a peace is brokered allowing the Halflings to settle.
70,000[/i] years?

Starting any civilization this far back raises some questions about why technology and science is not more advanced.  To some degree, I think you answer it with dark ages.  Though 30,000 years is an incredibly long time for something like that.

QuoteNow
Ragnarock prophecy begins to be fulfilled.
God Pools[/b]
What I like about this, is that it sets your setting apart from others.  It's a nice addition, without radically altering your setting.

Religion
I like that you pull your deities from mythology.  As I expressed, I have misgivings about throwing in a handful of random Greyhawk deities.  They feel out of place.  However, it is your setting, so if you like them, you are entitled.

Organizations
Your yakuza are halflings x. ?  Is halfling culture in general based on eastern culture?  I didn't get that impression so far, but this is a big sign in that direction.  Interesting choice.  I like the almost propaganda-like intro to them.

Another interesting guild: Children of the Star of the Morning.  I think you could do very well in adventures with these.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 23, 2007, 10:13:06 PM
Quote from: Phoenix Knight1) If I had to guess I'd say it has a page number from a book of hex sheets.  Not sure I'd want a million bonus geek points even if that is the case.

2) I believe I have mentioned this in another thread, but I'd consider a different name.  It just doesn't impress.

3) I like the details about the emperor and him not being popular.  However, if this is the case, does he not have rivals to exploit this?  Whether it is a powerful senate, generals, or an aristocracy?  Speaking of which, I recommend adding a few details about the political structure.  It sounds like the emperorship is inherited, as some kind of imperial monarchy.  Is there an aristocracy or other government body?  Is it an autocratic regime?

4)Good details for the city.  I think you mean Halfingstown.  I have some reservations about the city being named the same as the planet, but it could work.  I would only say that makes it sound like it should be the Teran Empire.

5) Uh, whoa.  Interesting.


6) Some details on why this happened might be good.  Empires rarely give up territory unless forced to, and if they were forced, it's unlikely they will ally with the territory for a while.  In time, they may develop an alliance, but if they were on good enough terms to have one to begin with, revolt was unlikely.  Without revolt, why grant independence?

7) It sounds like Arcanum is primed for some great adventures.  Particularly the Temporal Palace.  That sounds really fun or really annoying, depending on your mood at the time.


8 ) What is a norker?  I'm relatively familiar with 2nd ed, but I don't recall this monster.

9) What is the Shadow Pantheon (maybe you answer this later and I've forgotten)?

10) Side note: bugbears were traditionally goblins in folklore, not just D&D (because they were basically the same thing, they are equivalent to boggles in my setting).


11) I think this idea can work well.  You've got a few names I don't recognize again.
What is a "Cay man"?  An Alaghi?
Do you mean Rakshasa by Rakasta?  Or is this some other monster.

12) Do the different inhabitants (that is the different species) get along with each other?  Do they constantly war?  Is mammals versus reptiles?


13) I like this section a lot.  My only suggestions right now would be to give an idea of the population numbers, and maybe a little more detail on the dwarven government.  Is it a monarchy?  Are their clans (and are they important)?  Is their an aristocracy?  Who is the king?


14) Do you mean the lands where the Human Empire will be?  Or have they really been around for 70,000 years?

Starting any civilization this far back raises some questions about why technology and science is not more advanced.  To some degree, I think you answer it with dark ages.  Though 30,000 years is an incredibly long time for something like that.


15) This demands some expounding.  It sounds too cool to explain what you mean.  Is it a direct version of the Norse myth?  Or more adapted to your own needs?


16) What I like about this, is that it sets your setting apart from others.  It's a nice addition, without radically altering your setting.


17) I like that you pull your deities from mythology.  As I expressed, I have misgivings about throwing in a handful of random Greyhawk deities.  They feel out of place.  However, it is your setting, so if you like them, you are entitled.


18) Your yakuza are halflings ?  Is halfling culture in general based on eastern culture?  I didn't get that impression so far, but this is a big sign in that direction.  Interesting choice.  I like the almost propaganda-like intro to them.

19) Another interesting guild: Children of the Star of the Morning.  I think you could do very well in adventures with these.

1) That's okay.  Not everyone wants the geek label.  Anyway I'd only give partial credit for that answer because I'm looking for a specific book title.

2) Work in progress, but I'll agree it's kind of lame.

3) Another thing I'm working on.  I have no idea how any of these governments work.  I have vague image of an Emperor and a Senate and Magistrates and Watchmen and Sheriffs, but don't know who does what and how.

4) Teran Empire might be a good way to put.  In a major city of this world that has a strongly ethnic neighborhood composed of people of Chinese extraction outside of China, does one call it Chinastown? Chinesetown? Chinatown?

5) I try to be interesting.

6) It's kind of mentioned at least passingly in Ancient History.  It might need reworking.

7)  One aspect of my setting that I think is kind of different and smart is that I try to have all or most of the "dungeons" on the map at the start of the campaign.  It strikes me as highly improbable for the temple of the evil overlord pop up overnight.

8 ) Norkers may be found in the 1st edition Fiend Folio and were updated to 3.5 in a relatively recent issue of Dragon.  In 1e, they are in essence hobgoblins that get a bite attack in addition to weapon attacks.  In 3e, they're pretty much just another Humanoid (Goblinoid) monster.

9) I'll explain it more thoroughly, but it's a pantheon that includes things like the old Archdevils and Demon Princes and some monster deities Kurtulmak and some things from real world religion/ mythology to fill in some gaps, like my version of Lucifer.

10) I needed another Beastlander race, so decided to emphasize bear aspects.

11) Cay Men are from the D&D game/ Mystara setting.  They'r little Lizard Men, who are surprisingly tough.  The same size as Kobolds, but with 2 hit dice in 2e.
Alaghi are a sasquatch/ ape-like humanoid race.
Rakasta and Rakshasa are very likely related by real world mythological roots.  Both are tiger-like and of humanoid body-type, but Rakasta are regular humanoids native to the Prime Material Plane rather than powerful things similar to Devils from another plane.

12) It's a bit of a mix, but I'm assuming a few things, like that reptiles (Scalyfolk) get along well with each other and that naturally evil races, like Gnolls and Bug Bears are not usually friendly.

13) I'm still working on it.  I'm assuming some kind of monarchy.  There's probably some kind of clan system, where every place that has been cleared of enemies is a clan stronghold and defending the homeland is the first duty of a loyal clan member.

14) This might sound like a lame excuse, but I think the combination of Dark Ages to impede progress as necessary and the idea that magical technology replaces science technology enough to make life about as comfortable as it is in the modern era without quite going Eberron.

15) I will be expanding it later.  It's obviously drawn from Norse mythology, but my twist is that in my world it might be winnable.

16) Glad you like it.  Oddly enough, it's kind of part of the default assumption for older versions of D&D.  I just emphasized it more.

17) My feeling is that, while it makes sense for the Dwarves to include worship of Odin in their religion, it doesn't make sense for them not to have a deity like Moradin who is a god of Dwarven-kind specifically.

18)  Yes they are.  I'm sorry I haven't conveyed that clearly enough yet.  I'm still working on the write up for the Halfling Khanate.  But wasn't mention of the Halfling Khan and the Daisho as part of the Halfling's set of artifacts good enough clues?

19)  I try.  I thought it was a good idea.



Thank you for the good long list of comments and questions.  Help yourself to a Tera badge.
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Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Epic Meepo on February 24, 2007, 12:04:35 AM
Quote from: kyronBy the way: a million bonus geek points to anyone who can tell me exactly why the number 124 appears at what was the bottom of the page until I tipped it sideways.
I'm looking for a specific book title.[/quote]Wilderness Survival Guide[/i].

It's even scarier that I knew this as soon as I read that there was a hex grid taken from page 124 of a book; I hadn't even seen the hex grid in question when I arrived at that conclusion. (Not that I still have about a dozen old photocopies of that hex grid sitting around or anything.)
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 24, 2007, 12:41:11 AM
Quote from: Epic MeepoIt's a little bit scary that I know that hex grid is from the Wilderness Survival Guide.

It's even scarier that I knew this as soon as I read that there was a hex grid taken from page 124 of a book; I hadn't even seen the hex grid in question when I arrived at that conclusion. (Not that I still have about a dozen old photocopies of that hex grid sitting around or anything.)



Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner!  The 1,000,000 Geek Points are yours if you want them.


I just got my copy of Wilderness Survival Guide last year.  I haven't read it all the way through yet, but I had copies of the hex grids made the first week I had it and that's the first one I've really used.


Quote from: Phoenix KnightWhile the map is basic, one thing I do like about it is that you have a scale.  By using hexes, you make it easy to see distance and scale.  Perhaps it is something I should have considered.  On the other hand, it means they have to be taken out for the final version (if you want the seemless look, anyway), so it's a trade-off.

I only trust maps I draw myself, but I am weak in areas like handwriting, manual dexterity, fine motor skills, and any actual aptitude in the visual arts.  That makes some kind of grid a necessity when I make my map.  Hex grids are also kind of traditional for world mapping too.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Epic Meepo on February 24, 2007, 12:52:17 AM
I'm just going to write a quick review covering some odds and ends, since it appears that Pheonix is has already made many of the points I would have made.

Firstly, I'm glad you mentioned gnomes. I had been wondering about them right up until I came across the gnome-related appendix. On a similar note, what about half-orcs? Do they exist? How are they treated by humans and orcs? Would they count as goblinoids?

Secondly, what have the (non-drow) elves been up to? The history of Tera seems to revolve around humans, usually humans fighting against someone. Dwarves and halflings are also mentioned fairly regularly. But what is the recent history of the elves and how are they involved in current events?

Thirdly, what religious organizations exist and how are they related to one another? Domains and specialty priests aside, are their any religious entities analogous to the various assassins' and theives' guilds you have described? Any orders of paladins? Any conniving high priests plotting to secretly control the Empire? Any cults of thugs murdering nonbelievers?

Also, what is the history of the God Pools? When did they form and how have they been used throughout history? Are they related to specific gods and pantheons? Are they stationary, or do they relocate from time to time just to be mysterious? Can the gods themselves make use of their namesake pools? Do the pools have any special significance to clerics or druids?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Epic Meepo on February 24, 2007, 01:03:57 AM
Quote from: Epic MeepoLet's see, at a 10 Geek Points to 1 eXperience Point exchange rate, that should put me at 14th-level gamer. Well on my way to earning my epic title. That's also more than enough levels of gamer to qualify me for the Craft Weighted Dice feat, which I will take. I'll then spend my remaining XP crafting a +1 d20 so I never have to see a natural "1" again.[/ic]
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 24, 2007, 01:15:43 AM
Quote from: Epic Meepo1) On a similar note, what about half-orcs? Do they exist? How are they treated by humans and orcs? Would they count as goblinoids?

2) Secondly, what have the (non-drow) elves been up to? The history of Tera seems to revolve around humans, usually humans fighting against someone. Dwarves and halflings are also mentioned fairly regularly. But what is the recent history of the elves and how are they involved in current events?

3) Thirdly, what religious organizations exist and how are they related to one another? Domains and specialty priests aside, are their any religious entities analogous to the various assassins' and theives' guilds you have described? Any orders of paladins? Any conniving high priests plotting to secretly control the Empire? Any cults of thugs murdering nonbelievers?

4) Also, what is the history of the God Pools? When did they form and how have they been used throughout history? Are they related to specific gods and pantheons? Are they stationary, or do they relocate from time to time just to be mysterious? Can the gods themselves make use of their namesake pools? 5) Do the pools have any special significance to clerics or druids?

Wow thanks.
1) Half-orcs and Half-ogres both exist and are relatively common.  One of the barbarian tribes in that J area of the map is actually a mix of orcs, ogres, humans, half-orcs, half-ogres, and ogrillons.  I've only just started my pencil draft on the barbarian lands write-up.  Half-orcs count as both goblinoids and humans.

2) I noticed that the history is a bit too centered on humans and the Empire specifically.

3) The Children of The Star of The Morning is intended to be primarily a religious group, albeit a very nonstandard one that probably engages in a good bit of "personnel removal" and "selective redistribution of property".  There are more conventional Temples, but the entries would read something like:  
Temple of Hecate: Worshippers of Hecate.  High Priestess is seeking to increase the temple's influence over The Empire.
Temple of Athena:  Worshippers of Athena.  High Priestess is seeking to increase the temple's influence over The Empire.
Temple of Zeus: Worshippers of Zeus.  High Priest is seeking to increase the temple's influence over The Empire.

4) All material in this area is something I'll have to give consideration to.  I really haven't developed any of these things.  It's currently an excuse for buffs that aren't possible under the actual rules.

5) I hadn't thought of this, but some kind of guardian order seems like a good idea.

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Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Matt Larkin (author) on February 24, 2007, 10:00:34 AM
I'm not sure if it was a question or not, but, IRL, rakshasa are from Indian mythology.  I've never heard of "raksta" before you mentioned them.

Quote4) Teran Empire might be a good way to put. In a major city of this world that has a strongly ethnic neighborhood composed of people of Chinese extraction outside of China, does one call it Chinastown? Chinesetown? Chinatown?
Chinatown.  What I meant was to point out a spelling mistake.

Given the feel you are going for with halflings, you might give the race a new name for themselves (maybe humans call them halflings).  Much like Tolkien called them hobbits, and some, like JC have separate names for what races call themselves.  It would serve to set them apart more.

Also, such a name might sound more natual than Halflingtown.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on February 24, 2007, 02:43:45 PM
Quote from: Phoenix KnightChinatown.  What I meant was to point out a spelling mistake.

Given the feel you are going for with halflings, you might give the race a new name for themselves (maybe humans call them halflings).  Much like Tolkien called them hobbits, and some, like JC have separate names for what races call themselves.  It would serve to set them apart more.

Sorry.  I hope I didn't give offense.  I thought you were pointing out a different percieved spelling error.  More specifically, I didn't notice that I had spelled halfling wrong in the word halflingtown.  I edited to fix that just now, but my current term is halflingtown and not halflingstown.

This is a little tangential, but one reason I haven't done my write up on Aelfheim yet is that I know that Aelfheim is a human name for it.  I decided that my elves speak Tolkien's Quenya Elvish Language and I don't have my copy of The Silmarillion handy to translate.  There could very well be a similar thing going on with the halflings, although I haven't decided on the language yet for them.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Wensleydale on March 06, 2007, 04:33:56 PM
All righty.

I've read through this now, and several things come to mind.

Uno: The halflings. I love the idea of the Yazuka, but as far as I can tell there is no information on the Khanate. I'm interested - they seem like a fusion of asian cultures at the moment.

Du... somethingo: the dwarves. I like the ideas you have for them, and it seems like an... interesting environment. Do the dwarves carve and dig out their own homes, or do they live in natural caves, or in caverns within which structures are built? How do they defend themselves, other than through war? How are they ruled?

French... is easier. Trois: Lucifer. His servants are interesting... they band together in chaotic groups with no organisation or hierarchy to, essentially, 'Stick it to the man'? That's great. :D Want to hear more about this.

La Fin: The Great University - is this a literal building, or just an organisation, or a meeting hall, or a group of separate colleges, or what? Also, who is the current 'headmaster'?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on March 06, 2007, 09:37:43 PM
Sorry I've taken a bit of a vacation from these forums.  I recently went back to my dad's house after spending a whole week at my mom's.  She's got a cable modem; he's got a dial-up connection, so I try to limit my internet usage at my dad's.  I have got some more stuff in my idea notebook, though, which I'll type up and then post.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on March 13, 2007, 07:55:27 PM
Quote from: GolemAll righty.

I've read through this now, and several things come to mind.

1) Uno: The halflings. I love the idea of the Yazuka, but as far as I can tell there is no information on the Khanate. I'm interested - they seem like a fusion of asian cultures at the moment.

2) Du... somethingo: the dwarves. I like the ideas you have for them, and it seems like an... interesting environment. Do the dwarves carve and dig out their own homes, or do they live in natural caves, or in caverns within which structures are built? How do they defend themselves, other than through war? How are they ruled?

3) French... is easier. Trois: Lucifer. His servants are interesting... they band together in chaotic groups with no organisation or hierarchy to, essentially, 'Stick it to the man'? That's great. :D Want to hear more about this.

4) La Fin: The Great University - is this a literal building, or just an organisation, or a meeting hall, or a group of separate colleges, or what? Also, who is the current 'headmaster'?
1) I'm working on it right now.  I have a lot of good ideas, but getting them translated into a readable format is a challenge.
2) I'll work out that later.  Much of it is what I would consider finer details.  Right now I'm going for broad strokes so that the flavor of each nation and culture is known.
3) Glad you liked it.
4) One literal college with one literal campus with however may buildings are needed.  The current head of the college is Euclid Euler Pythagoras e pi i.  My terminiology may have been inconsistent, but he is the arch-chancellor for The University and the head of state for Arcanum as a whole.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on June 17, 2007, 11:25:53 PM
I posted a few updates and would be delighted to hear comments.

I have decided to rename the Human Empire, the Teran Empire, but editing things that are already up will take time.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Tybalt on June 17, 2007, 11:39:16 PM
A few comments:

1. Generally a good solid adventure beginning. I like that you have different possible paths depending on the type of character is there or what their inclinations of the moment might be. It is also very descriptive and is incidentally a nice introduction to your setting.

2. I'd like to know a little more about the barbarians. Do they look norse? Do the spirit connections affect more than just spellcasters? What kind of weapons do they use?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Tybalt on July 18, 2007, 09:06:26 AM
Khyron: I think it's really neat that your pantheon is made up of published deities that you've put together in a sort of spiritual stew that nevertheless has versimilitude. So are your devils and demons 'devils and demons' in the proper sense or are they genuine deities?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on July 18, 2007, 06:59:16 PM
Quote from: TybaltKhyron: I think it's really neat that your pantheon is made up of published deities that you've put together in a sort of spiritual stew that nevertheless has versimilitude. So are your devils and demons 'devils and demons' in the proper sense or are they genuine deities?



Thanks.

The answer to the question is kinda both.  It's hard to distinguish between one kind of extremely powerful, immortal planar being and another.  To put it another way, there is no functional difference in Tera between the type of being that, say, Asmodeus is and the kind of being that, say, Odin is other than alignment of the deity and the race of typical worshippers.

I don't know if that's a useful answer or not.


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And again, thanks.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on July 18, 2007, 07:04:49 PM
Quote from: TybaltA few comments:

1. Generally a good solid adventure beginning. I like that you have different possible paths depending on the type of character is there or what their inclinations of the moment might be. It is also very descriptive and is incidentally a nice introduction to your setting.

2. I'd like to know a little more about the barbarians. Do they look norse? Do the spirit connections affect more than just spellcasters? What kind of weapons do they use?


1. Thanks.
2.  Most tribes look pretty Norse, except the Tribe of The Ram, which are more Scottish.  Maybe I missed something, but what spirit connections?  Most of the fighting men of the barbarian tribes prefer big two-handed weapons, especially axes.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Lmns Crn on November 08, 2007, 10:20:37 AM
The names are really interesting here. You have some really clear Norse and Roman influence, and a lot of very pulpy sort of feel to all of this. In a lot of cases, I'd consider that sort of thing to be something of a flaw, but you've really made it work, and turned it into a style. As a player, I could definitely get a sense of the style of a world where people with names like "Stylus Steel" and "Gladius" are the movers and shakers. Same issue with the tarot themes. The way you've put this together, it works much better than I would have thought.

I guess I mainly want to see more big-picture detail before we jump right to individual taverns. I guess I'm a little at a loss as to what the King of Coins is telling me about Tera itself; though it's a nice, well-designed tavern (and no doubt a popular spot for your regular gaming group, if you have one), it seems that replacing it with a different tavern entirely would have minimal impact on the world as a whole. It almost seems like a digression.

I really like the Temporal/Spatial Palace. It's a cool idea, and I'd like to hear more information about that (and Arcanum in general.)

The information about barbarians is interesting. I guess I have a permanent soft spot for "savage" cultures that are, in their own ways, more enlightened than their "civilized" neighbors.

Your other races and cultures, from dwarves all the way through goblins, seem a little skimpy. If they're going to be viable origin-places for players' characters, shouldn't they ideally be as richly detailed as Tera or anywhere else? There are definitely good ideas in here, and I'd like to see them get a little more development.

Honestly, I think religion might be a little cluttered. There is an awful lot of deific stuff going on, much of it overlapping in function and role. Although I suppose that makes Ragnarock all the more interesting (nice choice, setting "now" at the onset of the end times, by the way), it's still going to be a huge amount to keep up with.

I think you could benefit the most by smoothing out both your maps and your prose. Even on the hex grid, your maps look pretty mechanical, and I'd like to see them spruced up a bit. Particularly in terms of history, I think prose might be a little more useful than timelines. Have you tried simply telling the story of the Steel emperors, rather than just listing which events happen in which years?

There really is a ton of interesting stuff here, and a lot of it seems really amazingly "classic," if that makes any sense. I like it.

Edit: What are some of your influences?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on November 08, 2007, 11:01:55 PM
Frist off, thanks.  It was really helpful.  Please take a Tera badge, if you like:
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To answer your last question first, I consider my main influences to be Terry Pratchett, Robert E. Howard, and Joseph Campbell.

The King of Coins actually originated from my desire to participate in a CBG contest, and then I x-posted my submission to the Tera thread.

Your question of whether it would be better to use an actual narrative than a timeline to convey the information regarding the rise of the Steel Emperors:  I'm kinda working on that.  I'm working on a campaign set in that era.  That's what that Castle Granite adventure is going to be for.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Ghost on April 20, 2008, 01:10:21 AM
(I apologize if you did not want further discussion on an old thread, but I did not see a disclaimer.)

So far, I am liking what you've done. I'm not personally a fan of using so many real-world deities, but it looks like it could fit well here.

The on major incongruity that I have found concerns the Teran Empire. 'Adventurers' are described as a significant export, but then there is very little exploration being done.

Similarly, there is no description of the level of ship or aircraft technology almost anywhere. How do the Teran people get around - horse (or other animal) and carriage, boat on a river, blimp, winged animals, magic, or just by walking?

I will be reading it through again to get to understand it better. But, from what I have read, it has some definite potential.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on April 20, 2008, 10:56:13 PM
Thanks.  Please take a Tera badge, if you like:
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It is still a going concern kinda.  I've just been too drained, time-crunched, or lazy to post lately.


Interesting point regarding adventurers as a major export of the Teran Empire versus a lack of modern exploration.  I hadn't thought of it like that.

As for the transportation question, you are correct that I failed to adress it so far.  As far as possibile methodologies, I'm figuring kind of all of the above.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Ninja D! on August 29, 2008, 11:50:13 PM
I'm going to try to go through your setting, a little bit at a time.  I'll start with your maps.

Your maps are functional.  I'd say they're more along the lines of crunch, when most maps are like fluff.  I can look for a number and find what I'm looking for without having to scan a massive page deciphering a difficult font.  I like that.

That said, they are not too pretty.  Mostly because the bottom one is apparently unfinished and that always takes away from things.  I would not feel happy with them (that said, I have NEVER felt happy with ANY maps I have made and probably never will) but as long as they serve their purpose and a little unfinished spot doesn't bother you, you are right to move on to the more important parts!

Also, the page number is because that page came from the World Builder's Guidebook (or a similar name, I'm tired) that TSR put out, right?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on August 30, 2008, 11:18:56 PM
Quote from: Ninja D!I'm going to try to go through your setting, a little bit at a time.  I'll start with your maps.

Your maps are functional.  I'd say they're more along the lines of crunch, when most maps are like fluff.  I can look for a number and find what I'm looking for without having to scan a massive page deciphering a difficult font.  I like that.

That said, they are not too pretty.  Mostly because the bottom one is apparently unfinished and that always takes away from things.  I would not feel happy with them (that said, I have NEVER felt happy with ANY maps I have made and probably never will) but as long as they serve their purpose and a little unfinished spot doesn't bother you, you are right to move on to the more important parts!

Also, the page number is because that page came from the World Builder's Guidebook (or a similar name, I'm tired) that TSR put out, right?

First off:
Thanks.  Please take a Tera badge, if you like:
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The maps are kind of at a good enough to start play point, which is most of what I was going for at the time.  I'm working on refining them, but it's kind of like at number 97 on my top 100 pet projects to work on in my free time list.


That's a pretty close answer: it was the Wilderness Survival Guide.  You at least got close on the era of the company, TSR rather than WotC.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Nomadic on August 31, 2008, 12:50:20 AM
Quote from: khyron11442. Most tribes look pretty Norse, except the Tribe of The Ram, which are more Scottish.

There's a difference? :P

Good work though, I will give things a full look through.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Ninja D! on November 26, 2008, 09:39:19 AM
I had spaced this off.  Your badge is in my sig and I will be back here for more.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Ninja D! on November 26, 2008, 11:20:54 AM
The Terran Empire
QuoteThis is probably the most important land of Terra. Terra's greatest power militarily and economically. Home to the most legendary of adventurers.
The current Emperor, Stylus Steel, is considered by many to be a letdown to his family's legacy.[/quote]The greatest military hero of the modern Empire is General Sigismund Odinson of the Bear Tribe.[/quote]The major export of the Empire is adventurers.[/quote]Terra Prima - Will there be more about this city?  I want to hear more. How is lawlessness legal and where is the line?  Is there authority or official leadership of any kind here?[/list]Halflings - What makes it hard for the halflings to hold onto their own ways? How do they feel about the dwarves and how they live here?[/list]Dwarves - Why do the dwarves forsake their own culture for a foreign one here?  How do humans feel about dwarves?  Halflings?[/list]Technology - I am a bit uncertain about the level of technology in the bigger cities of this setting.  Could you clarify?[/list]
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: sparkletwist on November 26, 2008, 03:09:56 PM
The dominant mental image that I got when I was reading through this setting was one of people playing D&D. That may come across as something of an idiotic statement at first-- I mean, that's the whole point, right? What I mean, though, is that's not just the image I got when thinking about the setting, but when I actually tried to envision what it would be like to be in the setting. It still felt like a game to me.

Part of this has to be the fact that it's about as standard a D&D world as they come. Pretty much all of the tropes are there-- though I did find your reworking of halflings a plus. The only complaint I'd have there is the "monolithic racial culture" motif, which seems to pervade a lot of standard (and even not-so-standard) D&D worlds. Humans would be just as capable of creating this "Asian" culture, too, wouldn't they?

However, what really hit me was the names. Oh, the names in this setting. I'm not sure what you were trying to do, but I do know I almost spat out my drink bursting out laughing a couple of times. The names you've used in this setting are... well, they're either genre-savvy, or they've gone and decided to sneak up behind verisimilitude and bash its skull in with a giant stick. Somehow, it feels like a little of both.

This started at the very beginning. Stylus Steel. Seriously... Stylus Steel? He is a letdown to his family's legacy. Does this happen to be because he pursued a career as a pornstar? He's far from the only one. Terra Prima sounds like a Star Trek planet, the Great University is a pretty pompous name, and the biggest questionable thing about Questionable Milton is his name. Humans got some freedom, so they call their land... Freeland. Ok then. I won't beat a dead horse, but... oh, the names.

On that topic, your description of Free Town is another aspect of this setting that just leaves me confused. It's either dry wit or a facepalm waiting to happen... and, again, I somehow get the idea that it's a little of both.

Essentially, the feeling I get from this setting is that it's probably pretty good for a group of friends sitting around playing D&D, as long as they don't try to immerse themselves too much or roleplay too deeply. I don't like settings that take themselves too seriously, mind you, but at the same time, it's hard for me to feel any enthusiasm whatsoever about roleplaying in this world. There is a lot that explains why this is this and that is that, and how certain things work, but none of it is really all that immersive or compelling. In some ways, it feels more like a parody of a D&D setting.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on November 28, 2008, 01:10:06 AM
Thank you both, for you have given me much to think on.


As Terra stands, it's very much a gamer's setting designed to facilitate gaming without real ambitionsto be the kind of setting that peoplecould wirte a nove set in.

Thanks again.  Please take a Tera badge, if you like:
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Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on November 28, 2008, 01:34:01 AM
A few comments on recent comments in no particular order:

Quote from: Ninja D!The Terran Empire
Quote from: sparkletwistOn that topic, your description of Free Town is another aspect of this setting that just leaves me confused. It's either dry wit or a facepalm waiting to happen... and, again, I somehow get the idea that it's a little of both.



Believe it or not, it is intended to be a place to actually try to use RPGs as a vehicle to explore what an anarchist community might be like, assuming that the term anarchist community is not an oxymoron.  There may be some humor to the write-up, but it is not intended to be entirely a joke.


Quote from: Ninja D!
Quote from: Ninja D!
QuoteThe greatest military hero of the modern Empire is General Sigismund Odinson of the Bear Tribe.

Yes, the general intention was for General Sigismund Odinson to be an outlander barbarain from the uncivilized north.  You know, I think I might have to start fleshing him out some to explain his status in the Terran Empire and his rise to power.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Ninja D! on November 28, 2008, 12:00:26 PM
QuoteYes, the general intention was for General Sigismund Odinson to be an outlander barbarain from the uncivilized north. You know, I think I might have to start fleshing him out some to explain his status in the Terran Empire and his rise to power.
Yes, I think you should. That particular character is one of the things that has interested me the most so far about your setting.

And now I shall dig deeper still into the world of Tera...

Is it Terra or Tera?  I think I've seen it both ways in these threads.

Why did you choose to make the tarot deck significant? Was that part of what started and inspired the setting or did it come later?

Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on November 28, 2008, 08:14:00 PM
Quote from: Ninja D!And now I shall dig deeper still into the world of Tera...

Is it Terra or Tera?  I think I've seen it both ways in these threads.

Why did you choose to make the tarot deck significant? Was that part of what started and inspired the setting or did it come later?




Now, it is supposed to be Terra.  It used to be Tera, but someone pionted out the proper spelling for the Latin word my setting takes its name from.  I have not corrected all the past instances of the usage of tera on my part, especially in this thread.

The Tarot elements are just one of those ideas I had.  I kind of know my way around a Tarot deck, and I thought it'd be cool to incorporate soem of that into the world I was building.  I think I started adding in the Tarot elements later.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Ninja D! on November 29, 2008, 12:24:58 PM
To me, the tarot elements seemed like something that would seem like a good idea at one time and I would get bored with later on. You are obviously more focused than I. I have not seen yet (though it looks like I am about to) what impact this has on your setting but I think it has the potential to be very interesting and the setting a certain feel. If nothing else, it would probably be something that people would remember about the setting, regardless of their like or dislike of it.

And now I move on...
QuoteOn the Street of Coins, in between the Wily Alchemist's Shoppe and Trader Robard's Domicile of Weaponry, is a tavern called the King of Coins. This would be the North Side of the street on the block between Primus and Secundus.
The front room is the common room. There's a bar along the north wall and tables in the middle of the room.[/quote]tarot poker[/quote]Tarot poker? Have you created this game?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on November 29, 2008, 12:41:12 PM
Quote from: Ninja D!1) Based on this description, it seems that you have a very detailed idea of the layout of this city. Is there a map of it?
2) Again, fine details. Any rough map?
3) Tarot poker? Have you created this game?

1) There have been a few over the years.  I just resumed work on the latest incarnation.  I'll try to scan and post what I've got sometime.

2) No map.  I actualy haven't had to use this place tactically yet.  It was originally created to enter a contest here.

3) Not in any fine detail, but some vague ideas.  There's generally two major variants:
1) Major Arcana stripped out.  This makes it work mostly like a standard poker deck, although the pages add an extra four cards to the deck and change the details of how certain straights would work.
2) Major Arcana left in and wild.  There are some subtle variations, some make an all wild hand the lowest possible and others make it the highest possible.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: SilvercatMoonpaw on December 06, 2008, 12:21:58 PM
Sylus Steel, Bear clan, legal lawlessness, exports adventurers.  Very macho-sounding place.  Do the Terrans consider bar brawls a national sport?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Steerpike on December 06, 2008, 01:29:51 PM
I'm working through Terra piece by piece (and was paying particular attention to Fall/demonic references).  One thing I was struck by was your use of mythology.

[blockquote=khryon1144]Everyone agrees that everything started with The One. Everyone also agrees that The One grew lonely.[/blockquote]

I find this a potentially problematic considering your approach to religion. The different sets of gods you've selected for various races/peoples suggests competing or mutually exclusive religious viewpoints.  Unless you substantially alter the backstory to say, the Greek mythology (and therefore by extension modify the gods themselves, since their personal backgrounds and attributes are tied to their cosmology's history), then the Greek mythological creation story (Uranus and Gaia create the earth and the gods) will run against the grain of the Norse one (Ymir gets slaughtered and his body parts and blood become the world), and both run against the grain of your apparently widely agreed-upon genesis (the One etc).

This is a problem I've had with some other cosmologies.  It's all well and good to say "all the gods are present, they all just coexist," but that starts to break down when subjected to a deeper inspection.  Who's the war god, Ares or Tyr?  The Romans identified the Norse gods with their own: they didn't recognize their veracity as genuine independent deities.  If both Ares and Tyr actually exist, what do they really govern?  Only wars where their people are involved?  If so, you've just radically changed the nature of the gods.  Ares and Tyr no longer resemble Ares and Tyr as we know them.  It's like having multiple sea gods... who then rules the sea?  Or do the various sea gods compete for it?  If they do, they are no longer the same gods - the struggle would affect they way they run things.  Some of the old DnD cosmologies never really addressed this sort of thing.

A few settings (notably the cosmology of Sandman) manage to pull off a pan-cosmological world in which various real entities interact, but they do so by modifying the way deities work.  The other route to go (and the one I'm inclined to, generally) is to make all the deities ambiguously real - maybe they are, maybe they aren't, as in the real world.  What that means is that various religions won't accept each others' versions of creation, which of course leads to conflict and turmoil.
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on December 06, 2008, 03:52:24 PM
Quote from: SilvercatMoonpawSylus Steel, Bear clan, legal lawlessness, exports adventurers.  Very macho-sounding place.  Do the Terrans consider bar brawls a national sport?


Yes, indeed they do.


Quote from: SteerpikeI find this a potentially problematic considering your approach to religion. The different sets of gods you've selected for various races/peoples suggests competing or mutually exclusive religious viewpoints.
[snip]
A few settings (notably the cosmology of Sandman) manage to pull off a pan-cosmological world in which various real entities interact, but they do so by modifying the way deities work.  The other route to go (and the one I'm inclined to, generally) is to make all the deities ambiguously real - maybe they are, maybe they aren't, as in the real world.  What that means is that various religions won't accept each others' versions of creation, which of course leads to conflict and turmoil.

Thank you.  You have given me a lot to think about.

There's a brief interview with George Lucas tacked onto the front of the Special Edition VHS version of the original film trilogy where he says:  "Films are never really completed, they just get abandoned at some point."  
I'm beggining to believe this applies to campaign settigns as well.  I liked what I wrote at the time, but I now think it's sorta weak.


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Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Llum on December 06, 2008, 05:01:40 PM
My first question is what exactly is a Geometer?

If Dwarves have to import a lot of food, has this ever caused problems for them? Like if one of the other races started raiding the food caravans? Also, how long could Dwarves survive without a new shipment of food?

Serfs technically have no rights when dealing with the samurai or Khan, including the right to expect to be still living when the conversation ends. I get the feeling that this applies to anyone who talks to the Khan. Now just curious, but are you mixing the mongolian Khan and the japanese Samurai on purpose instead of calling the Khan the Shogun as they did in japan?

Are Jotuns giants?

For the people who lost the War against the One and were banished to the Hell Planes, are they still stuck in the hierarchy of the One, needing worship? Or are indifferent to worship? Why did the Good and Chaos beings not rebel along with them? Seems like the entire concept of Hierarchy would rub them the wrong way from the start. Why didn't most of the First multitude rebel because the One made himself immune to the worship of the third multitude? Did they accept him being a hypocrite? Finally, why would the One want to create the Third Multitude anyway?
Title: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on December 06, 2008, 08:27:33 PM
Quote from: Llum1) My first question is what exactly is a Geometer?

2) If Dwarves have to import a lot of food, has this ever caused problems for them? 3) Like if one of the other races started raiding the food caravans? 4) Also, how long could Dwarves survive without a new shipment of food?

Serfs technically have no rights when dealing with the samurai or Khan, including the right to expect to be still living when the conversation ends. 5) I get the feeling that this applies to anyone who talks to the Khan. 6) Now just curious, but are you mixing the mongolian Khan and the japanese Samurai on purpose instead of calling the Khan the Shogun as they did in japan?

7) Are Jotuns giants?

8 ) For the people who lost the War against the One and were banished to the Hell Planes, are they still stuck in the hierarchy of the One, needing worship? Or are indifferent to worship? Why did the Good and Chaos beings not rebel along with them? Seems like the entire concept of Hierarchy would rub them the wrong way from the start. Why didn't most of the First multitude rebel because the One made himself immune to the worship of the third multitude? Did they accept him being a hypocrite? Finally, why would the One want to create the Third Multitude anyway?

Thank you.

1) A wizard specialist class from the late days of 2e (introduced in Player's Option: Skills & Powersand expanded on in Player's Option: Spells & Magic).  Wizards that deal a lot with writing and symbols.  Somatic gestures are so important to their spells that they can actually treat spells as if they had only Somatic and Material components and cast while silenced.  They could also create scrolls quicker and easier than other spellcasters could create other magic items.
2) Yes.
3) Probably has happened more than once.
4) Indefinitely but the quality of grub would go downhill quickly: fried rot grubs, black pudding pudding, and aboleth sushi.
5) True.
6) It was deliberate, but I don't know my exact reason why.
7) Yes.
8 ) This whole thing is a complicated mess that needs more work.

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Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on April 18, 2012, 08:12:04 PM
Resumed work on the actual campaign world (http://www.thecbg.org/index.php/topic,24955.0.html).

I like to hear things.
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Seraph on September 26, 2012, 01:33:05 PM
Quote from: khyron1144
House Rules:

Paladins's Detect Evil ability is usable at will, not always on. Detect Evil (and Detect Good)is also somewhat restricted in what is Evil (or Good). Sentient living humanoids native to the Prime Material never detect as Evil or Good, unless currently engaged in clearly Good or Evil activities. Violence is Evil. Kindness is Good. An Orc giving alms at a temple of Gruumsh detects as Good. A Paladin fighting a Demon detects as Evil.
I like this take on the ability.  I like seeing that, aside from presumably demons and the like, it is only actions that register as "evil" or "good." It complicates things, so you can't simplify everything to "The Pally could tell he was evil, so let's kill him!"
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Rhamnousia on September 26, 2012, 03:39:31 PM
Quote from: khyron1144House Rules:

Paladins's Detect Evil ability is usable at will, not always on. Detect Evil (and Detect Good)is also somewhat restricted in what is Evil (or Good). Sentient living humanoids native to the Prime Material never detect as Evil or Good, unless currently engaged in clearly Good or Evil activities. Violence is Evil. Kindness is Good. An Orc giving alms at a temple of Gruumsh detects as Good. A Paladin fighting a Demon detects as Evil.

Would the demon also detect as Evil? And what about non-sentient creatures? Can animals be read as Good or Evil, which I suppose would indicate their likelihood to attack without provocation?
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Seraph on September 26, 2012, 03:44:24 PM
My understand was it was the action that read as evil, so animals that were ATTACKING might register as evil, but the ability would not reveal their LIKELIHOOD to attack.  And I just assumed that a demon, being a non-humanoid evil outsider would have enough essence of evil to always detect as evil.

Though now I have another question: if Violence is evil, do you read as evil if you are fighting off someone who is attacking you? Or do you read as "Good" when on the defensive?
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on September 26, 2012, 05:56:26 PM
Quote from: SuperbrightAnd what about non-sentient creatures? Can animals be read as Good or Evil, which I suppose would indicate their likelihood to attack without provocation?

Most animals are True Neutral, and thus unlikely to detect as Good, Evil, Lawful, or Chaotic.  Being an aggressive predatory animal species or a proactively defending herbivore is not in and of itself Evil, either, unless the actual fight/attack is already in progress.

Quote from: Seraphine_Harmonium
My understand was it was the action that read as evil, so animals that were ATTACKING might register as evil, but the ability would not reveal their LIKELIHOOD to attack.

Sounds about right.

Quote from: Seraphine_HarmoniumAnd I just assumed that a demon, being a non-humanoid evil outsider would have enough essence of evil to always detect as evil.

Yeah, Demons, Angels, Modrons, and Slaad being so much concentrated the stuff of their alignments will always trip the correct alignment detection spell.

Quote from: Seraphine_HarmoniumThough now I have another question: if Violence is evil, do you read as evil if you are fighting off someone who is attacking you? Or do you read as "Good" when on the defensive?

The forces of the cosmos, and me the DM, tend to regard violence, even in self defense, as less Good than bearing what one must.  However, I think alignment detection spells allow for determining degree as well as kind, and in such a situation the attacker would show up as more Evil than the defender.
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Rhamnousia on September 26, 2012, 06:02:07 PM
Quote from: khyron1144
The forces of the cosmos, and me the DM, tend to regard violence, even in self defense, as less Good than bearing what one must.  However, I think alignment detection spells allow for determining degree as well as kind, and in such a situation the attacker would show up as more Evil than the defender.

This is such a niggling little detail, but I always obsess about alignment systems in D&D so I guess it makes sense. Why not just have a general 'Detect Alignment' spell that works for everyone? It'd make sense, at least in my mind, that a Paladin would be able to detect a paragon of good just as easily as an embodiment of evil.
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: Seraph on September 26, 2012, 06:08:40 PM
Quote from: khyron1144The forces of the cosmos, and me the DM, tend to regard violence, even in self defense, as less Good than bearing what one must.  
Wow.  That's an astounding level of complacency the gods (I saw lists of gods, and am assuming they are what "forces of the cosmos" refers to.  I could be mistaken) want from their followers.  Is that purely an "ideal response," to attack, or are people actually expected to just let people beat them up and/or kill them without defending themselves?
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: SA on September 26, 2012, 08:09:53 PM
Quote from: Seraphine_HarmoniumWow.  That's an astounding level of complacency the gods (I saw lists of gods, and am assuming they are what "forces of the cosmos" refers to.  I could be mistaken) want from their followers.  Is that purely an "ideal response," to attack, or are people actually expected to just let people beat them up and/or kill them without defending themselves?
On some level, maybe the deities simply cannot comprehend how fragile mortals are in flesh and spirit. Perhaps they think: "why don't you just, you know, switch off your pain sensors or something", or "don't be like that, you can always get a new family".
Title: Re: Tera Discussion thread
Post by: khyron1144 on September 27, 2012, 12:42:43 AM
Quote from: Seraphine_HarmoniumWow.  That's an astounding level of complacency the gods (I saw lists of gods, and am assuming they are what "forces of the cosmos" refers to.  I could be mistaken) want from their followers.  Is that purely an "ideal response," to attack, or are people actually expected to just let people beat them up and/or kill them without defending themselves?

I had not given this that much thought before posting my initial response.  I will now have to think on it some more.

I think that the cosmic forces referenced above are not so much the gods themselves so much as whatever it is that even gods must obey.

Quote from: Exegesis
On some level, maybe the deities simply cannot comprehend how fragile mortals are in flesh and spirit. Perhaps they think: "why don't you just, you know, switch off your pain sensors or something", or "don't be like that, you can always get a new family".

It's an interesting idea.


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