So, having more time than I'm used to recently, I was thinking about how to change the somewhat "classic" fantasy setting into something new and interesting - flip it upside down. Then it hit me - flip it upside down!
So the premise would be as such. Some unknown event forced the standard motley fantasy troupe underground for good. This WOULD NOT be a "drow" campaign or an "Underdark" campaign. Here are a couple of images that stormed my head that I think describe the setting well.
1. The key city of human kind, build on, inside, and around massive stalagmites (the ones that go up), which would be a beacon of a thousand little lights blinking in the deep dark of a vast underground cavern. But the city would be a dangerous and shadowy place, only held together by the even more malicious threats that wait outside the city walls and in the labyrinthine caverns and tunnels of the setting.
2. This setting's version of the elf being even thinner, emaciated, and bleach pale with giant shining eyes as they hunt and stalk prey and trespassers in a forest of moss and mushroom.
3. A caravan of merchants, traveling on giant pack-beetles, lighting their way with pale-blue phosphorescent fungi as they wind their way through a pitch black cavern, as eye-less beasts sit in wait.
Themes could be survival and chiaroscuro and an exploration of the darker nature of things. This is just a basic premise, but I think this idea could grow into something really neat and original.
Quote from: Leetz1. The key city of human kind, build on, inside, and around massive stalagmites (the ones that go up), which would be a beacon of a thousand little lights blinking in the deep dark of a vast underground cavern. But the city would be a dangerous and shadowy place, only held together by the even more malicious threats that wait outside the city walls and in the labyrinthine caverns and tunnels of the setting.
3. A caravan of merchants, traveling on giant pack-beetles, lighting their way with pale-blue phosphorescent fungi as they wind their way through a pitch black cavern, as eye-less beasts sit in wait. [/quote]Themes could be survival and chiaroscuro and an exploration of the darker nature of things. This is just a basic premise, but I think this idea could grow into something really neat and original.
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Interesting, I would like to see what else you imagine for this setting.
@Llum, Well, the only thing it would have in common with the Underdark would be that it's underground. I really don't plan on using much if any of the material already used for the Underdark, which is kinda what I was getting at. And yes, no Drow, as they are the most over-rated and over-used fantasy troupe :) at least in my opinion
As for the rest, I really haven't thought that far into the setting into concerns on how populations are fed and what not (I like to use "magic" as a last, sometimes first, resort answer.) But yes, water would be a big issue. Maybe this city is built upon a group of rare fresh-water springs?
I made a Sphere like this for a Wake campaign and describing cities built into giant columns in an underground chamber was extremely fun. Food source wasn't a problem there because of Gates, but the Sphere was a vast underground sea and the only spots of dry land were these stalagmites and stalactites bearing settlements. What about fish? What about... bats? Creatures that can reach the surface quickly, like bats, and may not be as affected by a topside environs as playable races, etc..
along the lines of this setting, here would be some possibilities of how standard fantasy would fare underground.
the elf race - like I mentioned before - emaciated, pale, with giant lemur-like eyes. would live in fungal and moss forests. could be vicious hunters or reserved guardians.
the small/hobbit race - maybe they went totally feral and serve as the settings "goblin" race, preying on whatever it may be. like a million scuttling Golums, only less annoying.
the dwarf race - this would be tricky to make different, considering they're basically an underground race anyways. but maybe presenting them with a darker tone? like they're really pissed off that everyone else came down into their homes. Could be very militaristic and racially focused.
the human race - I think humans would be best used as a vessel to present social, cultural, and technological change that has happened as a result of being underground for so long.
I also thought that the concept of dungeons would basically work the same, just switched around. You go up instead of down and start and the bottom of a dungeon and work your way to the top.
I think this could be a really cool setting.
Maybe the dwarves are the only who still dare venture onto the surface (for whatever reason). They were always accustomed to the double life of above/below.
Anyway, sounds like a project with promise.
I think it would be interesting to take the stereotype of the grumpy dwarf even farther, making him down right evil and nasty.
Okay, may I just say that the idea of little gollum/smeagul things is awesome. It totally fits a darker, underground theme. I can just picture swarms of them crawling all over the walls.
This sounds interesting and I will be keeping up with it. But I do not see how you could make it drastically different from the Underdark, after all, the Underdark pretty much covers an underground setting.
You could make it relatively different from the Underdark by simply populating it with radically different creatures than usual, or by making large sections of the underground particularly unique. Like a huge section that's actually the petrified remains of a collosal god-beast, or something - an enormous fossil. Actualy that'd work well as an Underdarky section for the Cadaverous Earth...
The idea of the stalagmite city makes me think of this image (http://www.mystcommunity.com/storage/Riven:%20The%20Sequel%20to%20Myst/Wallpapers/Tay%201600x1200.png).
Well the point I was trying to get at by saying it wasn't an Underdark setting was 2 fold.
the first was to disassociate some of the stereotypes and expectations people may have of an underground world - like drow, duergar, aboleths, and underground version of above ground races.
the second was to reinforce the fact that this setting is not the dark twin of a world in the light, but in fact THE world, as there is no world of light to compare it to. so while ive been brainstorming in my head, I'm trying to describe this world without referring to things that would not exist in it - dawn, dusk, sun, stars, storms - things like that.
and yeah Steerpike, there could be some really neat areas. I was thinking a mushroom forest (kinda cliche but still cool) would be neat to use, but haven't thought too far beyond that.
I have thought that a single large city would make a great hub to the setting - something weird and Sigil-esque.
Leetz- perhaps identify what it is about the "underdark", write down those themes, then avoid and subvert them in your design philosophy. (Edit: I see you seem to have answered part of my question while I was typing- oops.)
I also like the idea of the stalagmite city. :)
Don't forget the fish and insects of the tunnels. What if there were blind flying carp in the tunnels that hunt by the feel of vibrations (like bats)? (A dwarf fortress player's worst nightmare.)
idea: at the heart of the setting would be a kingdom of humans based in large cavern focused around this key stalagmite city, with a bunch of feudal fungus farms surrounding the city. maybe all the lights from the human settlements, some crystals in the rock, and phosphorescent fungus gives the cavern a subtle, twilit glow so there is someplace that's not in total darkness?
[edit] the Dusk-Lit Kingdom? the Twilit Kingdom? Lantern Kingdom?
There are some animals that can emit light, such as fireflies, glow worms and anglerfish. Perhaps the undeground humans have started breeding such animals to light their lanterns? You'd have to come up with a species that can produce fairly bright light for this to be practical, though.
Some fungus or moss might also emit light- but what if there is a drawback to the emissions, like the light makes creatures woozy and sleepy. So the light is used sparingly.
or light would attract things that eat you once outside the safety of a settlement. :)
which also begs another question - what would make a more interesting setting, a world in perpetual night or a world totally underground?
Perpetual night is just so hard to sustain that my vote is for underground.
yeah, that's what I was leaning too as well.
here's some fluff about the tentative central city's market.
The Bazaar A spherical natural cavern more than a mile across, the bazaar sits within the base of the Spire [nickname for the city, as it's yet unnamed.] Held aloft by twelve natural pillars of stone, the great expanse of the bazaar is the proverbial heart of [City], pumping lifeblood throughout the city and the surrounding Dusk-Lit Kingdoms.
A cacophony of sights, smells, and sounds, many an caver has been stopped in their tracks by the sheer wave of sensations that bombard it's threshold. The fragrance of decadent spices, fried fish, sharpened metal, and woodsmoke mingle with a thousand other scents. Flickering light from countless candles, glimmer-moss, and ember-slugs lamps fill the thick air with a warm glow, illuminating a myriad of colored tents, fabrics, wears, and peoples. Hawkers and vendors shout over the pounding of anvils, the hissing of oils and coals, the songs and poems of street performers. Pickpockets rub shoulders with cheap fortune tellers, weary traders, and flirty courtesans. The bladed buildings of the bazaar loom over narrow streets that are constantly crowded with the traffic of customers, merchants, steed-spiders and pack-beetles.
Above the city of canvas stalls, crowded buildings, and narrow alleys rise the great merchant houses of the Twelve Pillars as soft light of multiple hues shine from hundreds of carved windows. The lords of gold and greed watch the movements of the bazaar from their great carved pillar-towers as they scheme and plot the rise and fall of allies and enemies. Thieves of skill and luck race across the razored roofs while agents of ill motives sulk in the shadows. From the roof the of the cavern, the delicate pleasure houses of silk and rope sway and rustle, suspended like giant paper lanterns. Blind birds and bats flutter in the smoky haze, barely discernible over the quite roar of the markets.
Within the bazaar, one can find anything if they look hard enough. Slaves, weapons, poisons, and other debaucheries are tolerated and thrive along side more domestic and docile services and goods. Many a fool has fallen victim to a silent shiv within the warrens of alleys. A meeting place far all things of the deep places, the Spires bazaar is it's own creature - living, breathing, and feeding.
I like where this is going. A bit of nitpicking, though, if I may?
Where are you getting wood? Or fuel for fire? You can't refine metal without fire.
Where's the oxygen coming from? Living things AND fungus both consume oxygen -- if you're connected to the above ground, clearly it can't be all that endemic to life, could it? Also, you would have to have a LOT of moss to make up for even 100 breathing things.
Other than that, it sounds enticing. I once considered an underground campaign, but it was decidedly more tribal than feudal.
M.
yeah, I've thought about all that stuff too - food supply, ventilation, vitamin D, etc., and frankly, I have no logical explanations for all those - enter magic. Maybe magic fungus that just spews out oxygen or tree-sized mushrooms that for all intensive purposes are trees sans leaves? Coal or some kind of magic rock could be used for smelting.
As for ventilation, I thought an old, rusty system of magically operated man-sized fans and air shafts would weave themselves throughout the carved-stalagmite city.
overall, it will be a magically infused setting - giving me leeway to do impossible and implausible things (read - I'm lazy ;))
If the cavern is high enough, maybe some magicians maintain some kind of cloud arrangement, allowing pollutants to be collected, re-earthed and wind to take place?
M.
hmmm, I feel like that may take away some of the "undergroundness" of the setting, but having a magical gardeners guild or something along those lines, now that would be neat.
I was thinking of having a Dead-Collector Guild which would buy corpses for cheap and use them for all sorts of things - candles, fertilizer, velum, etc. Waste not right?
Irza, the Spire City
At the heart of the deep realms sits the city of Irza - more commonly known as the Spire. An immense stalagmite that rises from the dark depths of a great lake, the Spire's base is more than two miles across and it rises nearly a mile, high into the reaches of a vast cavern. Even at the edge of this cavern the Spire can be seen, a shimmering tower of a thousand points of light.
A mile-long bridge connects the city to the lake's shore. The span ends in a foreboding fortress-gate that has become the hub of a small town in it's own right. The town is called Pike, and is a mess of ramshackle huts and travelers tents huddled against the iron and stone fortress called the Cage. Nearly everything that goes in or out of the city crosses the bridge - also called the Arm - as the waters of the lake, while fresh and clean, are home to dangerous beasts of the deep.
The Spire was once a natural stalagmite, but now after countless centuries of habitation, no unworked stone remains. The entire length of the Spire has been carved into the city it is today. The architecture of Irza is unique. The city was made with height in mind, and as such, buildings, streets, everything really, are made higher than what would seem necessary and not quite wide enough. Window slits, doors, and archways are tall and narrow. Long, subtle curves punctuated by sudden angles mark the style of the carvings. Motifs of spiders, fish, and strange designs are common throughout the Spire. Many functional parts of the city - columns, pillars, stairs, doors - have been artfully carved into gargoyles and statues.
Iron is also common throughout the Spire as buttresses, fences, grates, doors, and shutters. Those buildings exposed to the open cavern are topped with large graceful blades and razors - as an attack from above is just as likely as one through the front gates. These roof-blades are often forged to resemble birds and other winged beasts.The entirety of the city is lit in a hazy warm light, provided by candles, magic lanterns, and the ubiquitous ember-slug, a slow moving creature, roughly the size of ones thumb, that dot the roofs and ceiling of the city and emit a pale orange glow. This light also allows for the growth of various mosses and lichens within the city that are used for a multitude of things.
The Spire is divided vertically into seven districts or wards, like coins stacked into a column. In ascending order, there is the dark and maze-like Warrens, the diverse Pilgrim's Ward, the bustling and crowded Bazaar, the foundries and iron-works of the Cinder Ward, the administration and libraries of the Magister's Ward, the affluent Arcade, and lastly the mysterious and guarded Mother's Ward. A wide, paved boulevard - the Promenade - winds it's way around the outside of the city, connecting all the wards. In addition to the Promenade, countless stairways, alleys, tunnels, and air shafts connect the parts of the city from inside.
The Warrens By far the largest and most populous ward, the Warrens is the bottommost of the city's wards. A maze of half-lit slums, corridors, pitfalls, and tenements, the Warrens are home to the Spire's poor, destitute, criminal, and mad. A lawless and dirty place, criminal syndicates, dark cabals, slaver rings, and dark cults all vie for power in a never ending vendetta of deceit and violence.
The Warrens are also the home of the Dead-Collectors Guild - more commonly referred to as the Bone-Buyers - who headquarter themselves in a great mortuary-factory in a section of ward referred to as the Skull. The Bone-Buyers travel across the Spire, offering to buy off the recently deceased for a small price. It is also common for them to buy corpses en mass, often with no questions asked. This has created quite the niche for opportunistic and amoral denizens of the Warrens. The Bone-Buyers then take the corpses to their mortuary-factory and turn the bodies into all sorts of mundane items - candles, velum, fertilizer. This practice is accepted in the city, and while not considered tasteful, is a necessity, as it both keeps the city clean and keeps "resources" within the Spire. Their are rumors whispered that they also sell human meat to the less reputable pubs and bars of the Spire.
Important areas within the Warrens include the aforementioned Skull, the gathering-courtyard of Gallows Square, the seedy "pleasure houses" of Red-Wine Way, the shops of Pock Street, and the trash pits of Rag-Pickers Pit.
Pilgrim's Ward A dynamic ward of temples and taverns, the Pilgrim's Ward is popular amongst travelers and the faithful of the deep realms. The vibe of this ward is one of openness and movement, as roughly half the people found at anytime are merely on their way through. Those who make this ward their permanent residence often work for the myriad of inns and taverns or for the dozens of temples that share the high arched streets. At the center of ward is the God's Square, a red-paved arcade with a carved ceiling depicting numerous gods. The inns that surround the square are among the most popular, and inn-hawkers compete with prophets and missionaries in a contest of voices. Other important areas include the grand House of Echoes, the churches of Temple Way, and shady alleys of Zealots Run.
More to come.