Recently I was trying to come up for a replacement or supplement to humans as the "variable/adaptable" species/race role, and it came to me that I could just make humans one part of a larger species and apply the v/a label to that species and my objection goes away.
I have a candidate in my files already: a species whose descent from shapeshifters causes offspring to occasionally/often/always (I'm not sure which to choose) have a different outer "skin" than their parents. Because anything else feels a little weird (and because the species was partially inspired by a furry webcomic) all the skins are anthropomophs with humans as an added choice. I tend to call them "tek" because that was the first name I assigned.
So recently I bought Fantasycraft, and it presents elves and orcs in such a way that their stereotypes actually feel interesting rather than as excuses. At some point in the past during meditation on the nature of near-human elves in RPGs I thought up the idea that elves were actually modified humans. The view presented by Fantasycraft of orcs as elves modified for war clicked in with the already existing idea of modified human-elves to suggest that the split between elves and orcs could be euogenically-based: the elves bred out "undesirable" traits into their lower class of orcs, and "desirable" traits into an upper class of elves.
Though I've moved away from exclusively human appearance I can keep that idea: one faction of tek attempted to breed themselves in order to recapture their powerful ancestry, discarding any failures -- possessing "primitive" traits -- into a collection of laborers and combatants. It didn't work, simply resulting in the "exemplars" becoming a different kind of primitive (more like animals) and limiting them mentally (Fantasycraft provides disincentives to going outside sterotypes in character creation). Obviously they can't hold on to their society and it crumbles as their "primitives" revolt. The two sides start on an "elf"/"orc" race war.
So what do people think? This is a piece of what I hope will become a setting.
Didn't Tolkien also base his orcs on modified elves?
Can't you just come up with another label for humans if you don't want them to have that one? Or did you want there to be a race with the v/a label, just not humans?
And elf/orc-war... honestly, hasn't that been seen before? Of course, if you feel like you have something to add it is a tried and true concept which you could probably get something out of.
Quote from: Cataclysmic CrowDidn't Tolkien also base his orcs on modified elves?
Yes, and Fantasycraft takes that angle for use in its orcs. It just wasn't until that presentation that it actually managed to click for me.
Quote from: Cataclysmic CrowCan't you just come up with another label for humans if you don't want them to have that one? Or did you want there to be a race with the v/a label, just not humans?
Yes, I could reassign the race-role of humans, I just figured this way I didn't actually change anything and thus also keep happy the people who like that label.
Quote from: Cataclysmic CrowAnd elf/orc-war... honestly, hasn't that been seen before? Of course, if you feel like you have something to add it is a tried and true concept which you could probably get something out of.
First thing to remember is that these wouldn't be elves and orcs but two variants of animal people (including humans in that category) each embodying a different side of "primitive" animal nature: the elegant and efficient predator and the brutish savage.
Truthfully I realized it was kind of silly post not long after finishing it, but since the CBG doesn't allow post deletion I decided to keep it up to find out what people would say.
Yah, Tolkien did, but it wasn't breeding it was corruption. I don't think fighting alot would give you green skin and tusks, so do I misunderstand what your saying about elves transforming into orcs through warfare?
In my setting all the races are essentialy very similiar biologically, and I see no problem with this, but it helps if you explain why they are so similiar, and it looks like you are trying to do that.
On a less related note, what is Fantasycraft? Do you have any links or anything?
Quote from: SurvivormanYah, Tolkien did, but it wasn't breeding it was corruption. I don't think fighting alot would give you green skin and tusks, so do I misunderstand what your saying about elves transforming into orcs through warfare?
The book says orcs were "bred by dark forces in a failed attempt to forge elves for war and conflict". Okay, so it's not exactly Tolkien, but the idea that orcs and elves were related hadn't clicked until then (probably because it doesn't get mentioned at all in D&D).
Quote from: SurvivormanIn my setting all the races are essentialy very similiar biologically, and I see no problem with this, but it helps if you explain why they are so similiar, and it looks like you are trying to do that.
Remember again I'm just using elves and orcs as a very convenient similarity, the final product won't be "elves" and "orcs" at all. It will be more subtle variations of an anthropomorphic species, something like breeding humans and ending up with two version of "cavemen".
Quote from: SurvivormanOn a less related note, what is Fantasycraft? Do you have any links or anything?
RPGnow page (http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=63884)
RPGnet forums with the tag "fantasycraft" (http://forum.rpg.net/tags.php?tag=fantasycraft)
a blog where examples of builds using the system are given (http://philgamer.wordpress.com/)
website of Crafty Games (http://www.crafty-games.com/)