Mainly venting here a little I guess! Partially also getting my thoughts straight a little, though, too! (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_%28Jade_FATE%29)
Those hypothetical of you who've been monitoring the Jade FATE's development process far more closely than any human being actually has, you might have noticed that nothing has gone through half as many revisions as my magic system.
FATE is a system with many skills, each of which has a selection of stunts characters can learn; the stunts represent special tricks and techniques and areas of aptitude. I am doing my magic system entirely within the scope of the Mysteries skill and its related stunts (which I am having to write from scratch). Basically, if you have a decent Mysteries skill but no Mysteries stunts, you might have a working academic knowledge of magic or recognize it when you see it or have untapped natural potential, but you can't actually use magic. On the other hand, if you have one or more Mysteries stunts, you're a mage.
This means that the only things separating a mage from a non-mage in terms of game effects are Mysteries stunts (and aspects, but that's another thing). These stunts pretty much have to represent the whole of spellcasting by themselves. This is tricky because I'm trying to keep stunts down to a manageable number overall. Also, characters start play with only 3-5 stunts total, and advance slowly. I want players who spend all their stunts on Mysteries to be more powerful and versatile at magic than those who only grab one or two, but I don't want being a "proper" mage to require a huge stunt investment.
Each magic discipline (sorcery, Kudan Mysticism, hen-gan, etc.) has its own "stunt tree" of interrelated Mysteries stunts, that use each other as prerequisites. Current plan (seriously this is like Revision #8 or something) is for each stunt tree to have exactly one entry point stunt, that serves as a prerequisite for all the others. (So every sorceror has the Student of Sorcery stunt, etc.) Rather than being a single power, these entry point stunts have a small grab-bag of minor abilities that seem to have important flavor for that discipline of magic. Basically, I asked myself "what three things should every sorceror be known for?" and made stunts out of the answers.
The downside is that this is really quite challenging!
I don't want these to be three-for-the-price-of-one abilities in terms of power (one of my important guidelines is that magic-users shouldn't be, by their nature, more powerful than non-users), so there's that. Also, it turns out that taking a complicated concept like Kudan Mysticism or Farras and distilling it down to its most basic essence is not easy to do!
So, this is my current project. In case I get tricked into thinking I'm almost done with it, there are some nasty surprises in store for me later! For example, even once I get the five big magic disciplines ironed out (Farras, Kudan Mysticism, Irasi, sorcery, hen-gan), the humans need some kind of magic, even if it's died out now. It's established that the only reason they're in this world in the first place is because a powerful human mage discovered it and brought some colonists along, yet I still don't know much about traditionally human magic except that this one time, it brought several hundred people from one world to another. All the really obvious directions this suggests (teleportation, etc.) are things I really, really don't want to start messing with. Furthermore, there's aberrant traditions, Cardan hands, and various dead traditions that should probably be addressed more than they have been, whether or not they end up getting full game-mechanic treatment.
tl,dr; magic is hard and stupid and a lot of work and I am bad at writing. THE END
Correct me if I'm remembering FATE wrong, but couldn't you implement magic without having any magic stunts at all?
PC with a master architect aspect spends a Fate point:
"I want to use my knowledge of architecture to find a secret passageway that the villain overlooked."
PC with a such-and-such magic aspect spends a Fate point:
"I want to use my such-and-such magic to form a passageway through that wall."
Since magic is essentially just a PC taking narrative control, does it need to be defined any further than that?
LC,
I totally dig it. To create the proper historical feel/SEPERATE DISCIPLINES you need to get these right.
Just remember that this stuff is a process. I started the GS system with a 1979 PHB with spell point values scribbled in, then when I started my own spells, I only had 29 to begin with.
It's a process. going to be on IRC tonight?
Just wanted to say that I love your magic! Might have said it before, but it can be repeated without harm i guess :)
I think it's good you'e putting some work into keeping the disciplines distant and apart; different. Especially since these are really different types of magic and not just various elemental variations on the same theme.
Sadly I don't know much about FATE so i can't say much about the rules; I should probably look into the system again soon :)
Do all om-beh-ral possess "the Subtle Art" stunt? And is it possible to take training in more than one magical discipline?
Back to front we go!
Quote from: LVI totally dig it. To create the proper historical feel/SEPERATE DISCIPLINES you need to get these right.
There's a Science stunt-- I believe it's called "theory and practice"-- which lets you roll Science in place of any other skill, whenever you like. The catch is twofold: you have to be able to spout some pseudoscientific babble to explain what you're doing and how the principles of science aid you, and if the roll fails you take a consequence (Crestfallen, Shaken Confidence, etc.)
One
entire magic system I read involved a Mysteries version of this stunt. That's the whole thing. Shooting lightning out of your hands is Mysteries instead of Guns. A divination is Mysteries instead of Investigation. If you fail your roll, you get an "Arcane Backlash" (or whatever) consequence.
Works well, but it's not what I'm after.[/spoiler]
I guess the shortest way to answer you is that I disagree with your premise: "magic is essentially just a PC taking narrative control". In some worlds, that's absolutely the case. In this one, it's not. That said, solving magic by giving a player a degree of narrative control is a poor match.
Every time I write about Farras, it gets creepier and creepier. I think maybe I didn't recognize, at the outset, the whole depth of the implications of what I was playing with!
Quote from: Farras stunt ("Emptied") flavor quote"Life comes and goes like the tides, child. My life, yours... it is a process older than all things. Try and stop it if you will; I am beyond such foolishness. The difference between us? Dear child, when my spirit flows back into the Cauldron at last, I will be there to send it on its way."
You have survived the Ritual of Emptying, which prepares you to serve as a vessel for spirit energies. By sacrificing a portion of both your selfhood and your mortality, you have gained a measure of control over the Sea-- that is, the collective souls of all creatures living and dead, and the unending cycle of birth and death that connects them all. Taking this stunt indicates that you are a mage whose discipline is Farras. It is a prerequisite for all other Farras stunts, and you must accompany it with an aspect that indicates your mage status.
This stunt grants you a small suite of powers; further Farras stunts continue to develop and expand your mastery of magic. Your basic, fundamental abilities as an Purified Vessel are as follows:
*
Sea-Sustained -- Your understanding of the fluid nature of your own being has already freed you from many of mortality's shackles. The power of your spirit sustains you, and you sustain it in turn, without dependence on many mortal necessities. Simply put, you no longer need to eat or breathe in order to live (though you still need a lungful of air in order to speak). You must still drink to avoid dying of thirst, but seawater now satisfies you just as well as fresh water does. Additionally, whenever you ingest contaminants, poisons, or other disease-causing agents, you may roll Mysteries instead of Endurance to resist their effects.
*
Misfortune -- By exerting some of your influence over the soul-stuff of others, you can place a temporary curse of misfortune upon another living thing. This is a maneuver that pits your Mysteries against their Mysteries or Resolve. If successful, it places a temporary aspect representing the curse. Placing a curse requires one of the following: skin contact between you and your victim, your access to a bit of the victim's hair, blood, or non-trivial possession (any item represented by one of the victim's aspects is ideal), or the victim to drink some water or other liquid which you have specifically prepared for this purpose. Many victims never realize they have been cursed, even after the curse resolves itself in the form of disaster.
*
Intangible Gifts -- Your water-lore grants you staggering power over the spirits of others-- including the power to take fragments of others' souls, as long as they are freely given to you. By spending a fate point, you can extract a memory, a personality trait, an emotion, or some similar feature from a willing donor, distilling it into some small receptacle (often a tiny vial of water, but occasionally a hollow shell or other suitable container). This process creates two aspects: one on the donor representing what was lost (e.g., A Missing Fragment of Anger, or No Memory of the War), and one matching, opposite aspect that is applied to whoever is holding the talisman that contains the extracted trait (e.g., Little Vial of Anger, or A Soldier's Last Campaign). These aspects are permanent, unless the original donor obtains and reclaims the extracted part of his spirit. [/quote]Creeeeeeepy.
General entry-level stunts for the Big Five disciplines are done. (Okay, yes, Deep Listening and The Subtle Art still need flavor quotes.) They may get tweaked a little bit, but for now, I am pretty happy with how they've turned out.
I have not yet decided which I want to do first, regarding magic: continue fleshing out the more advanced techniques of these Living Traditions, or working on some of the more esoteric Aberrant Traditions and/or Dead Traditions. I have no idea how I want to handle those yet.
Mayhap a brainstorming post approacheth!
Ooo I want a little water vial of Vreeg's darkside
so I just read up on FATE, and did not know that it is a derivative of FUDGE, of which I'm making an Arga version, and just happen to be figuring out my magic system. I ashamedly don't know that much about your setting, but I do know FUDGE (if not as well as I know fate.) I'm also having trouble telling what your magic systems are, maybe a quick short list of the 5 (there are 5 right?) and the effects and flavor you're going for would help, as there is serious wall o' text going on and I'm ADHD. I would love to brainstorm about FUDGE/FATE magic in general.
ps. This is just personal opinion, and it's FATE's term, but "stunts" seems like a bad label for things. All I picture is a guy drinking a Monster jumping off his roof.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonPlacing a curse requires one of the following: skin contact between you and your victim, your access to a bit of the victim's hair, blood, or non-trivial possession (any item represented by one of the victim's aspects is ideal), or the victim to drink some water or other liquid which you have specifically prepared for this purpose.
What kind of actions are involved in preparing this kind of liquid? Mixing herbal components into it? Mumbling arcane words? Placing it in sympathetic conditions for some duration of time? Spitting on it?
Or is it something that purposely only ever takes place "off screen"?
Quote from: Luminous CrayonBy spending a fate point, you can extract a memory, a personality trait, an emotion, or some similar feature from a willing donor, distilling it into some small receptacle (often a tiny vial of water, but occasionally a hollow shell or other suitable container). This process creates two aspects: one on the donor representing what was lost (e.g., A Missing Fragment of Anger, or No Memory of the War), and one matching, opposite aspect that is applied to whoever is holding the talisman that contains the extracted trait (e.g., Little Vial of Anger, or A Soldier's Last Campaign). These aspects are permanent, unless the original donor obtains and reclaims the extracted part of his spirit.
So what happens if the container is broken and the contents splilled? Wouldn't it make more sense (flavour vise) that you'd have to drink the stuff in order to gain the memory or trait? Or perhaps they could be used in yet other ways. Imagine a smith quenching a freshly forged blade of a dagger in a bucket of water wherein was mixed the extracted expertise of a recently retired assassin...
Well, I've just been looking into it now and again; strikes me as original and different which are some of the aspects I look most for in settings. Been trying to make sense of your wiki, although I've never found out where you kept the rest of your material.
And a FATE walkthrough could be nice. Always a bit difficult to wrap your head around a completely new ruleset :)
I'm thinking, what do you imagine as the possible "top level" for each of these? The most powerful stunt and the peak of the magical discipline?
Sorcerers using Imbued Knifes to cut holes in reality? Hen-Gan Adepts convincing strong-willed subjects to commit suicide or become their humble slaves? Irasi transcending the mortal plane? I'm not saying you should take it this far; just wondering out loud at where you're taking all this eventually.
Once again, from back to front.
Quote from: GhostmanWhat kind of actions are involved in preparing this kind of liquid? Mixing herbal components into it? Mumbling arcane words? Placing it in sympathetic conditions for some duration of time? Spitting on it?
so I just read up on FATE, and did not know that it is a derivative of FUDGE, of which I'm making an Arga version, and just happen to be figuring out my magic system.... I would love to brainstorm about FUDGE/FATE magic in general. [/quote]
The Living Traditions - These are still in practice today, and can be learned and taught.-
Sorcery - Originally a dwarven thing, now mainstream: learn your magic from books, draw crazy runes and magic circles, know Forbidden Knowledge(tm)
-
Farras - Think goblin witchdoctors: they believe souls and water are the same substance, and can command fog/tides, place curses, take bits of your soul (with permission), and generally be incredibly creepy
-
Irasi - A liriss thing; they work for the Emperor: by meditating on the unity of mind and body, they gain incredible willpower and physical prowess, and some can even command wind and flame
-
Kudan Mysticism - A boru thing: powerful healers and tribal leaders who can "breathe life" into living or dead tissue
-
Hen-gan - Exclusively an om-beh-ral thing: don't trust the greenblood elven bastards
The Dead Traditions - Ancient magics lost to time (mainly cause we killed everybody that knew how to use them)-
Ork Magic - They wrecked you with fire, and also they made crazy-valuable swords and fortresses that are still around, even though all the orks are slaughtered (nobody liked them much)
-
Illas Mir - Literally, "this is"; a gnome thing regarding illusion, mostly for artistic/communicative purposes (some Illas Mir message stones survive, complete with stored illusion-messages for those who touch them, but all the Illas Mir artists were killed by the orks (jerks))
-
Human Magic - Somehow it transported humans to this world from their native world, but the mage responsible took his secrets with him to the grave because his kids were jingoistic/insane
Aberrant Traditions - These still crop up now and then, but seem hereditary/spontaneous rather than learned/taught; damned if I/you/anybody know(s) what they are, exactly-
She's a witch! Burrrn her! - um... okay I guess???[/spoiler]
Quote from: NomadicOoo I want a little water vial of Vreeg's darkside
I told you[/i] I type too many words.
I love the Irasi "Unity of Mind and Body" ability, or at least the idea behind it as I don't yet get the implications of it.
But wouldn't that essentially leave you with half your original stress amount? If you had 10 physical stress tracks and 10 mental stress tracks you and received 5 checks in each then you would only be halfway down, but if you had unity and only one track with 10 points in it you would receive 5 stress from one type and 5 stress from the other type and then you'd be reduced to 0. Or what? I'm sure I'm missing something here :)
Also, what do the Boru look like? I can't find any description of their looks on the Boru page and somewhat difficult to visualize them without a basic description. :)
Also, with the mysticism, how much can they get from their "listening"? Sure, the focus seems to be on healing and control of Breath, but you also associate them with a sort of ability to listen to nature. Can this be taken to divinatory heights, or does it simply give access to some of nature's secrets like with the plant ability you mention?
Quote from: http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Boruwiki[/url] last night, but I got distracted by IRC. I did that this morning, though.
[spoiler=boru description copied from new wiki entry]Even the least boru stands taller than any human-- averaging eight feet in height-- and is three times as heavy. Boru are broad-shouldered, barrel-chested, and covered in bulky muscle. Due to their size and weight, city-dwelling boru frequently have trouble with architecture, struggling with doorways built to human or dwarven dimensions, and finding goblin or gnomish buildings impossible to fit into.
Boru have wide faces set into broad, round heads which rest directly on their shoulders; they lack the flexibility of a neck, gaining additional protection for the head, thanks to the thick layers of shoulder and back muscle that directly support and partially surround it. Boru hands and feet our outsized, with four fingers and toes. An average boru's handspan will cover most of a human's torso, and each of its three fingers and thumb are as wide as a human wrist. Their size and strength makes boru fearsome combatants, even unarmed; their fists are the size of melons. The soles of boru feet are covered in tough, cushioning pads of gelatinous material which spread underneath the weight of a standing boru, allowing them to stand tirelessly for long periods and walk over rough terrain without the need for shoes.
Boru are among the most thick-skinned of all Marebo's creatures, possessed of tough, wrinkled hides that are up to one inch thick over much of the body. Boru children are born with a thin coat of short, russet fuzz, most of which is lost during adolescence, revealing the hairless brown or grey hides of adults. [/spoiler]
[spoiler=also here is a sketch](http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/120/rocklingwithanaxe.jpg)
It's a really old sketch and I'm not particularly happy with it, but it's not a bad place to start.[/spoiler]QuoteAlso, with the mysticism, how much can they get from their "listening"? Sure, the focus seems to be on healing and control of Breath, but you also associate them with a sort of ability to listen to nature. Can this be taken to divinatory heights, or does it simply give access to some of nature's secrets like with the plant ability you mention?
really[/i] a true aural sensation, but it closely resembles one.
In a lot of situations, this is remarkably similar to blindsense, or highly-specialized 360-degree vision. A blind mystic could walk around in a forest or swamp without much problem with terrain; he can't sense the ground, or stone, or other nonliving matter, but by sensing grasses, roots, earthworms, etc; he can get a pretty good image of the land. For similar reasons, it's difficult to sneak up on a mystic in the dark.
Interesting how Boru, the largest of your races I assume, are apparently the best magical healers (and borderline necromancer-druids as well). A good way to shake things a bit and turn preconceived notions on their head.
And, yes, I can see what you were referring to with the listening now. Sounds cool.
Quote from: http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_%28Jade_FATE%29new Mysteries page[/url], which is a general skill overview and a brief note on the five magic traditions (with emphasis on what distinguishes them, and what kinds of people can join them). All the stunts have been/are being moved to a separate stunts page for each tradition.
I have started with the Farras stunts (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Vessels), which are complete (I think). Marvel with me at the total creepiness of these ritually-drowned mages who can reach into your soul, just like you'd reach a dipper into a jar of water!
Edit: Expect hen-gan next; it is basically completed in my li'l notebook, and all that remains is for me to polish it up a bit and type it up for the wiki.
Love how the Farras is shaping up. Definitely among the better magic systems that I've seen.
Quote from: http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Adeptshere's a succulent morsel to whet your appetite[/url].
Quote from: GhostmanLove how the Farras is shaping up. Definitely among the better magic systems that I've seen.
:heart: :heart: :heart:
The Heartsilk one is pretty clever. Remember I wanted my Moshrayah to have something similar, where certain objects of art would solely serve to call up certain emotions. But very nice scaling of it, going from noticeable to aspect to escalated aspect. I hadn't quite thought of employing escalated aspects directly.
Do you imagine some om-beh-ral might fashion Wrath Heartsilk objects for their own use? Or objects of composure/serenity?
What would happen if om-beh-ral wore Heartsilk objects weaved with empathy? Is that possible?
I really like the way this system is shaping up. The Farras system is really well developed. I've looked over FATE, and I think I understand it well enough to work with it. I think that the the ability to basically possess someone, and thus extend your life indefinitely, is absolutely insane for a mid-level skill. Seriously, that's like a suped up version of reincarnate.
Still, that could be a really interesting way to create a hero. He had his body stolen by a Farras mystic, and then managed to take over the mystic's body instead, and he's on a FMA-esque quest to get his original body back. Could be interesting if the mystic had some sort of disease, or the mystic ended up dying in the hero's body.
I second the idea that Heartsilk is neat. hen-gan mysticism is pretty scary, but not on par with Farras yet.
What might be cool is to set up something similar to your schools of magic for the armed/unarmed combat schools, obviously not the same sort of feel, but to give people an edge that they could stand up to the mages without magic themselves. Also, I have to say that really dislike the inability to 'multiclass' with other Mysteries. I couldn't actually find a fluff reason in the Jade Stage Wiki, am I just missing something?
Quote from: Endless_HelixI really like the way this system is shaping up. The Farras system is really well developed.
Au contraire, Monsieur![/url]
Quote from: Mysteries pageLearning Multiple Traditions
While it's technically possible for one person to learn magic from multiple traditions, it's a difficult road. It can be difficult for a mage to find a teacher for a second tradition, due to the demographic disparity between many of them, and the metaphysical conflicts between these systems of magic. Most teachers are simply unwilling to teach a new discipline to a mage who has so much to unlearn.
Characters who do manage to learn a second tradition take a -1 penalty to their Mysteries skill when using it. (That is, a character with Good (+3) Mysteries who learns Farras and then Sorcery treats his Mysteries as only Fair (+2) for the purposes of his Sorcery powers, including determining when Mysteries complements his other skills.) Furthermore, mixing incompatible magic techniques is practically begging for uncomfortable and complicated compels against your mage aspect. You've been warned.
feels[/i] is very important to a world.
What I am trying to say is that I am trying to avoid a system where players can, with total freedom, cherrypick magic powers from any tradition they like, because that kind of precedent starts eroding the boundaries that make each tradition what it is. Enough people have asked me "well, what about learning multiple traditions??" that I feel like I have to include it, but I feel totally justified in making such "multiclassing" reasonably difficult, problematic, and not especially advantageous.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonQuote from: Luminous CrayonIf you have any suggestions on how to tweak the power level of this ability a tad without throwing it out entirely, I'd love to pick your brain about that.
If I'm reading the ruleset right, the problem with the skill crunch-wise is how easy it is to pump up a Farras mage's mental abilities with the various servitors he can summon, coupled with the fact that I'm not entirely sure how common it is for your average fighter to have strong mental defenses. As it works right now, it's basically a save or die spell from half a world away. There is no limit to how many times you use this ability on someone either, maybe you get a shift for trying to use it on someone for you've targeted previously for each time you've targeted them? If I was in your game, I could think up a hundred ways to abuse this ability to the point you couldn't differentiate it from a red-headed stepchild (speaking of course, as a red-headed stepchild). I'd probably make it use the character's base mental stat and make it not work through the dream visitation (talk about instantaneous travel!). It might also be worth it to make it work only on someone you know.
Mechanically, the best target right now is small children, because they cannot fight back. I could see a Farras mage leading a tribal culture, and then with each generation, choosing a new vessel to be his body. It would allow him a lot of leeway, as long as he could convince the tribe that it's for the best (given how the Aztecs handled human sacrifice, one child every generation seems quite minimal by comparison). Or he could simply spend his unnaturally long life possessing children from neighboring tribes, and then setting them up to be conquered and subjugated by his tribe.
Quote from: Luminous Crayon
Au contraire, Monsieur![/url]
I think this is my male refrigerator blindness coming to the fore. Or possibly a failure on my to read check. Maybe a combination of both, which might soothe my bruised ego. ;)
Quote from: Luminous CrayonQuote from: Mysteries pageLearning Multiple Traditions
While it's technically possible for one person to learn magic from multiple traditions, it's a difficult road. It can be difficult for a mage to find a teacher for a second tradition, due to the demographic disparity between many of them, and the metaphysical conflicts between these systems of magic. Most teachers are simply unwilling to teach a new discipline to a mage who has so much to unlearn.
Characters who do manage to learn a second tradition take a -1 penalty to their Mysteries skill when using it. (That is, a character with Good (+3) Mysteries who learns Farras and then Sorcery treats his Mysteries as only Fair (+2) for the purposes of his Sorcery powers, including determining when Mysteries complements his other skills.) Furthermore, mixing incompatible magic techniques is practically begging for uncomfortable and complicated compels against your mage aspect. You've been warned.
Gotcha. It would kinda defeat the purpose having them called mysteries, I suppose. *Waves goodbye to idea of Farras/hen-gan mystic, that could convince people to want to be his vessel, with magic*
I was thinking, how easy is it for an om-beh-ral to use heartsilk against another om-beh-ral? Is it too commonly known and would be immediately discovered? Or can they use it for interracial intrigue? How do they identify it?
Quote from: E_HGotcha. It would kinda defeat the purpose having them called mysteries, I suppose. *Waves goodbye to idea of Farras/hen-gan mystic, that could convince people to want to be his vessel, with magic*
- make it clear that no Farras powers work while in a dream (being able to use your (presumably quite high) Mysteries skill to reshape the dream is already a powerful advantage for a Purified Vessel in someone else's dream)[/quote]- possibly some kind of limit to how many times you can do this, to prevent this stunt from being able to live indefinitely unless slain (by total lifespan? by number of transfers? by some other factor?)
- possibly some kind of further permanent disadvantage incurred when changing bodies (note that depending on implementation, this is probably a
de facto limit on how many times you can switch)[/quote]no fate points[/i], which means that you cannot resist compels against your aspects and consequences by spending fate points to buy out of them. (In FATE, being out of fate points is severe bad news.) In addition, every transfer will potentially get you a brand new hostile personality haunting your brain, and serial bodystealers are certain to accrue quite a collection. (Also keep in mind, of course, that if you try to
steal someone's body and fail, you'd better be ready for the pitchfork brigade. But that's one of the risks you sign up for, I guess.)
[spoiler=helpful irrelevancies]
QuoteIf I'm reading the ruleset right, the problem with the skill crunch-wise is how easy it is to pump up a Farras mage's mental abilities with the various servitors he can summon, coupled with the fact that I'm not entirely sure how common it is for your average fighter to have strong mental defenses.
everybody[/i] can do that, not just mages.
QuoteI'd probably make it use the character's base mental stat
Mechanically, the best target right now is small children, because they cannot fight back. I could see a Farras mage leading a tribal culture, and then with each generation, choosing a new vessel to be his body. It would allow him a lot of leeway, as long as he could convince the tribe that it's for the best (given how the Aztecs handled human sacrifice, one child every generation seems quite minimal by comparison). Or he could simply spend his unnaturally long life possessing children from neighboring tribes, and then setting them up to be conquered and subjugated by his tribe.[/quote]
Quote from: Luminous Crayon- possibly some kind of limit to how many times you can do this, to prevent this stunt from being able to live indefinitely unless slain (by total lifespan? by number of transfers? by some other factor?)
This seems kinda artificial, a tacked on limit. Unless there's a really good reason why, if you can do it once, you can't do it more often. Maybe 1/level of Mysteries (like, +1 will let you do it once, +2 will let you do it twice, etc). Even that seems somewhat tacked on.
Quote from: LlumQuote from: Luminous Crayon- possibly some kind of limit to how many times you can do this, to prevent this stunt from being able to live indefinitely unless slain (by total lifespan? by number of transfers? by some other factor?)
I was thinking more along the lines of either "you can't exceed your original natural lifespan, no matter which body you're in", or perhaps "every time you change bodies, your fate point refresh rate goes down by one" (which, again, is a de facto limit, and (I believe) is the way Dresden Files RPG (which also uses FATE) handles loss of humanity/free will/etc.) Then again, slowly accumulating a collection of hostile haunting personalities (the original owners of all your stolen bodies) is a similar soft limit.
Quote from: L CIt really looks like the problem is twofold: "Filling New Vessels" needs to get reined in significantly, but so does "Dream Presence", because of the (implicit and explicit) way it extends the reach of other Farras powers potentially limitlessly.
Quote from: definite changes to Filling New Vessels- can't be used through a dream (duh, what the heck was I thinking?)
- more thoroughly flesh out the conflict involved to gain control of a body (prolonged skin contact should be required, so that breaking free of a hostile Vessel's grasp will stop him from possessing you-- essentially, the subject should be either willing, or restrained, knocked out, or otherwise helpless)
You're heading in the right direction, I think. For the limitations, I'd make the range on the Filling of the Vessel touch and have it require an elaborate ritual that takes a few hours to set up. It's still very useful (A spell that lets you become anyone? Sign me up!), but it requires significant planning to use successfully. For instance, a corrupt nobleman has failed to pay your group with two Farras mystics, one of which has this trick. You kidnap him, have your Farra possessor-mage possess the nobleman and your other mage drain the angry voice in the back of your head into a bottle, maybe feed it to one of your enemies to drive them insane. Profit abounds. There's another version of this where you possess his son, poison him, and then assume the throne all in one fell swoop.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonI was thinking more along the lines of either "you can't exceed your original natural lifespan, no matter which body you're in", or perhaps "every time you change bodies, your fate point refresh rate goes down by one"
I don't see anything overpowered about being able to extend lifespan indefinitely. All it really means is that you get some crazy old NPCs that have been around for a
very long time. They'll probably possess a great deal of knowledge but also suffer from boredom - there ought to be a point when they feel that they've "seen it all".
If you're worried that there might be too many of these characters around, then you just need to make the body swapping a bit more dangerous. If there is a chance, even a small one, of dying every time you steal someone's body, then you could hardly expect to keep on doing it forever. To put it in geeky math terms: as the number of repetitions approaches infinity, the probability of a failure approaches 100%.
Here's some other stuff: hen-gan is pretty much done (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Adepts) for now, and a couple of interesting new stunts have been added. I'm not sure whether I'm totally happy with how they've shaped up; they feel a little kludgy.
Furthermore, I've made a little bit of headway on sorcery stunts (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Sorcerors), which is apparently going to be what I tackle next. I have some more in my notes that should be added soon; this one is about 80% planned out, and should hopefully go pretty smoothly.
On the subject of Farras and stunt-balancing, I'm a little curious about whether or not we are all on the same page re: general game mechanics in FATE:
[spoiler]
Quote from: wiki stuffBy maintaining direct skin contact, you can engage another person in a brutal mental conflict, with the aim of forcing their spirit out of their body to make room for yours. With an appropriate taken out result or concession from your victim, you can permanently transfer your consciousness into a new body.
I really love the way hen-gan is set up, very balanced and very useful. Seriously, good work here. I love the whole idea of cloaking yourself in emotion to manipulate people. I don't have any other comments on this really.
The Sorcerer tricks are coming along nicely. If you keep most of those tricks, the Sorcerers are going to be very versatile, even if they won't have the depth the other paths have. Thought Grasp is very utilitarian. Thought Whip is cool, and the redirection ability is very well handled. I think you could actually make Thought Whip require Thought Grasp, have an increasing defense bonus against it, have repeated use create mental stress, and remove the once per scene limitation against non-mages. To be entirely honest, it feels a little arbitrary, even if you provided a fluff reason for it.
It's easy to see why sorcerers are one of the dominant forces on the continent, though. With abilities like the ones provided...
--
On the FATE scene mechanic, yeah I understood that. Each scene is like a combat in DND, not a round. The high number of opposed rolls are good indicator of this. Frankly, it makes more sense than DnD's magic system ever did. What on earth every possessed them to print Shapechange the way they did, I'll never know.
What is the actual use of confluence as it is just an aspect with less uses? Is it the fact that it is flexible one should pay attention to?
Also, their magic doesn't seem all that useful yet for situations where they aren't involved in dealings with other sorcerers. And if thought whip only deals mental stress, is it useless in combat?
Oh, and i agree that the Presence stunts of Hen-Gan are pretty cool. Although I'm surprised that they have no connection to heartsilk weaving considering the similarities.
More meat-and-potatoes for sorcerors (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Sorcerors). Probably still quite a few adjustments forthcoming, but I am liking this as a starting point. Since way before I started moving over to FATE, sorcery has been the anti-mage school, and the one where advance planning has been most strongly emphasized. That's a little clunky in this system, but I am pretty pleased with it so far.
Comments, now:
on hen-gan:
Quote from: EHI really love the way hen-gan is set up, very balanced and very useful. Seriously, good work here. I love the whole idea of cloaking yourself in emotion to manipulate people. I don't have any other comments on this really.
I think you could actually make Thought Whip require Thought Grasp, have an increasing defense bonus against it, have repeated use create mental stress, and remove the once per scene limitation against non-mages. To be entirely honest, it feels a little arbitrary, even if you provided a fluff reason for it.[/quote]The Sorcerer tricks are coming along nicely. If you keep most of those tricks, the Sorcerers are going to be very versatile, even if they won't have the depth the other paths have.... It's easy to see why sorcerers are one of the dominant forces on the continent, though. With abilities like the ones provided...[/quote]They're dominant in part because they're connected to a very popular religion, carried forward by a once-great empire (which exerted its cultural influence in a lot of ways, really.) Also, sorcerors treat their magic more like a science and less like a sacred mystery or trade secret, compared to the other traditions. It's the most widespread of the magical disciplines because sorcerors aren't as shy about teaching it to people.
As for their millieu, it is heavy into anti-magic countermeasures and research/information-gathering, but I think that clever players will be able to get a huge amount of mileage. I am curious to see how creative people will get with Imbued Tools (going beyond the standard knife/stylus/lens toolkit most sorcerors carry), and with the clever application of Runes and Sigils.
Once again, thanks for reading along, and for the invaluable feedback.
Working on mystics (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Mystics).
It's tough to do healers in a system that, in many ways, downplays the importance of healers. I foresee myself having to go back and change mystics' powers eventually, after tweaking some variables re: combat, injury, death.
Of course "mystics are healers" is a pretty gross oversimplification, so maybe I just need to work more on playing up the other parts of their nature, the things that make them more interesting that regular ol' magic bandaids. So, tell me what you think.
Why do healers have to be magicians? Why not emphasize mundane healing instead? :P
Quote from: NomadicWhy do healers have to be magicians? Why not emphasize mundane healing instead? :P
Unless you happen to live in one of the low-population, nomadic tribes of boru, out in the wilderness, far from civilization, you are much more likely to be cut open and stitched back up by a surgeon (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Science_(Jade_FATE)) than to ever meet any patient of a mystic.
Maybe I'm using this thread to discuss magical healthcare because it's a thread about magic design! That would be pretty crazy though I guess
oooooh burn. *sizzle*
Quote from: Luminous CrayonQuote from: NomadicWhy do healers have to be magicians? Why not emphasize mundane healing instead? :P
Unless you happen to live in one of the low-population, nomadic tribes of boru, out in the wilderness, far from civilization, you are much more likely to be cut open and stitched back up by a surgeon (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Science_(Jade_FATE)) than to ever meet any patient of a mystic.
Maybe I'm using this thread to discuss magical healthcare because it's a thread about magic design! That would be pretty crazy though I guess
Almost as crazy as thinking you're a glowing crayon.
Quote from: Luminous CrayonWorking on mystics (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Mystics).
It's tough to do healers in a system that, in many ways, downplays the importance of healers. I foresee myself having to go back and change mystics' powers eventually, after tweaking some variables re: combat, injury, death.
Of course "mystics are healers" is a pretty gross oversimplification, so maybe I just need to work more on playing up the other parts of their nature, the things that make them more interesting that regular ol' magic bandaids. So, tell me what you think.
Other things need healing.
healing the mind, the emotions, crushed spirits, rejuvanating conduits,
a resistance to death and injury and the affectrs of the other traditions...
All right; stunts for Kudan Mystics are finished (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Mystics) and I think I am pretty pleased with them!
Irasi Sages will be the next magic-related topic to get my attention. As the last of the big five traditions, Irasi will push me up to "mostly done" status when it's completed: the only thing left after that are the Aberrant and the Dead traditions, which are so rare and random that it's probably safe (at least in the near term) to tell players and other Narrators to just make things up.
I would love to get some feedback on mysticism and sorcery, if any of you are up for it. I feel like they could really benefit from a little careful scrutiny at this point.
Thanks for reading; more stuff soon!
So, brainstorming about Irasi and the Sages who practice it.
Conceptually, this is Kudan Mysticism turned inside-out: instead of externally-directed harmony (oneness with the world, with nature, with other life), it is internally-directed harmony (the oneness of the self). Irasi unabashedly cribs elements from wuxia films, Jedi knights, and a bevy of related sources; they share a kinship with many fictional traditions of puissant, mysterious warriors fueled by a deep well of supernatural power.
It should be noted that there's some dispute about whether Irasi counts as "magic" or not. Powerful Sages can do obviously, overtly supernatural things, but most Irasi techniques are much more subtle and internal. Most Sages themselves do not consider Irasi to be magic: instead, it's just about being at the peak of your personal ability, unlocking your full potential through discipline and balance. By this view, a Sage is no more magical than, say, a champion duelist, who is mentally and physically acute, and who fully understands the use and capabilities of his weapon.
One serious thing I'm worried about is that with Irasi I might be breaking one of my own cardinal rules re: magic design in my setting. That is, magic should not supplant mundane skills and prowess. In plain language, a mage shouldn't be a better warrior than a non-magical warrior, a better negotiator than a non-magical negotiator, and so on-- magic shouldn't be a universal key that opens every lock.
Frankly, I'm not sure how to faithfully represent Irasi with game mechanics in a way that leaves room for viable, non-magical experts in the same abilities, or whether Irasi, even without game mechanics, is a concept even capable of playing by my own rules.
I think you can still have balance, provided you bend the rules a little, and look at it more like, "someone who uses magic will not be automatically better in all cases than someone who doesn't use magic." A warrior who is well-versed in Irasi is probably going to be a better fighter than one who is only versed in mundane techniques. This is just the nature of it, and to try to subvert this too much makes Irasi seem pointless. However, this harmony more than likely has its price. Perhaps Irasi followers can only gain their power after a lengthy meditation. Perhaps they must follow strict rules in their daily life. Perhaps the spiritual harmony is fleeting, and offset with occasional bouts of profound discord and spiritual chaos. My point is, if there's a price to pay outside of the battle, that a mundane warrior wouldn't have to pay, I think you can still hold true to the spirit of your rule, and let Irasi continue to exist in its current form.
I really love some of your abilities; very clever many of them.
I still have a problem with the Sorcerers though. I really love the concept, but I can't seem to figure out their place in the world. They have abilities that help them focus their magic/deplete magic and help them warn them of intruders coming to disturb their research. But what research do they do?? All their abilities seem to deal with magic itself or fighting other mages but not with anything they can do with that magic.
That said, I really do love your runes.
Mysticism is interesting. I especially like Aura of Vitality, Green Litany and Runes of Breath (surprise). Talking about Runes of Breath also reminds me that the sorcerers lack some kind of top-end power or secret power.
Reading your magic I'm always surprised how expensive the abilities are fate-point-wise. I always had the feeling that fate points were at least semi-rare while reading the FATE rules...
Quote from: Luminous CrayonSo, brainstorming about Irasi and the Sages who practice it.
Conceptually, this is Kudan Mysticism turned inside-out: instead of externally-directed harmony (oneness with the world, with nature, with other life), it is internally-directed harmony (the oneness of the self). Irasi unabashedly cribs elements from wuxia films, Jedi knights, and a bevy of related sources; they share a kinship with many fictional traditions of puissant, mysterious warriors fueled by a deep well of supernatural power.
It should be noted that there's some dispute about whether Irasi counts as "magic" or not. Powerful Sages can do obviously, overtly supernatural things, but most Irasi techniques are much more subtle and internal. Most Sages themselves do not consider Irasi to be magic: instead, it's just about being at the peak of your personal ability, unlocking your full potential through discipline and balance. By this view, a Sage is no more magical than, say, a champion duelist, who is mentally and physically acute, and who fully understands the use and capabilities of his weapon.
One serious thing I'm worried about is that with Irasi I might be breaking one of my own cardinal rules re: magic design in my setting. That is, magic should not supplant mundane skills and prowess. In plain language, a mage shouldn't be a better warrior than a non-magical warrior, a better negotiator than a non-magical negotiator, and so on-- magic shouldn't be a universal key that opens every lock.
Frankly, I'm not sure how to faithfully represent Irasi with game mechanics in a way that leaves room for viable, non-magical experts in the same abilities, or whether Irasi, even without game mechanics, is a concept even capable of playing by my own rules.
an issue all games grapple with, and that most games solve by limits on duration, sustainability, resource management, possible consequences or uncertain success of magic. It's OK to have a magically enhanced warrior that exceeds other warriors...for 60 seconds and that is it for the day for all magic use. It's fine to have a magically enhanced negotiator being fantastic...if it has limits or can be seen through and the user will be vilified for it.
Well, you could have magic be another suit of tools in the Sages arsenal. He can't kill with his magic; it only allows him to do extraordinary feats. A sword to the gut will still kill him, and his martial art skills will only ever be on par with any ordinary warrior.
Old stuff first, new stuff next.
Quote from: CCI still have a problem with the Sorcerers though. I really love the concept, but I can't seem to figure out their place in the world. They have abilities that help them focus their magic/deplete magic and help them warn them of intruders coming to disturb their research. But what research do they do?? All their abilities seem to deal with magic itself or fighting other mages but not with anything they can do with that magic.
The first sorcerors, the Cold Spring Drinkers, developed sorcery as part of a search for
immortality-- they literally wanted their physical bodies to live forever-- which they failed to achieve. As an unintended consequence of their efforts, they stumbled upon many sorcerous techniques that remain in practice to the present day, and some that were lost-- such as a very peculiar
ability to see the future (which the Cold Spring Drinkers had, but no other sorceror has ever achieved).
Unable to affect the far future directly (by being immortal and living to experience/rule it), these ur-sorcerors wrote a bunch of very specific letters to not-yet-born individuals, giving very specific instructions and advice to strangers in the future. They founded their order or sorcerors, in part, to safeguard these letters through the generations and make sure they reach their addressees.
Crunch-wise, this is unsatisfying as a power (and I don't think it needs to be a stunt at all), but the principal order of sorcerors acts as stewards for a storehouse full of mysterious letters. They'll take one, keep it safe for three hundred years, and then give it to a trusted courier, who will travel the world to give it to some far-flung nobody, who will open it and read: "Dear Steve, hope you're having a good century, don't eat the tuna salad today. Cordially, the Cold Spring Drinkers." (This is a flippant example, but still.)
Now, if I end up adding a bunch of additional powers for sorcerors, they'll probably trend toward these two failed goals: immortality and precognition. In earlier drafts, sorcerors had impossibly sensitive hearing, sight, that sort of thing-- making them well-suited to be spies, guards, etc. (With a Sorceror's Eye Sigil, they still are.) I'm not going to give sorcerors the powers their founders failed to achieve (or kept deadly secret), but those'll probably be a thematic guide for any further expansion.[/spoiler]Now, this is not to say that the problem you point out doesn't need fixing (it does), or even that my reasons are particularly good ones (they probably aren't.)
I do think you're absolutely right, at any rate: sorcerors need something else to do when they're not on counter-magic duty.
Quote from: CCMysticism is interesting. I especially like Aura of Vitality, Green Litany and Runes of Breath (surprise).
Reading your magic I'm always surprised how expensive the abilities are fate-point-wise. I always had the feeling that fate points were at least semi-rare while reading the FATE rules...[/quote]need[/i] "bad" aspects. People who think they're powergaming by only choosing aspects with no real downsides or drawbacks are starving themselves of fate points (and also, they are probably making pretty dull characters.))
I will go back through my magic stunts and try to figure out whether I've been overcharging them re: fate points, though. Many other stunts require fate point expenditure, but it usually goes along with some kind of very potent effect; I may well have been relying far too much on "spend a fate point" to keep magic on its leash, when other controlling factors might work just as well or better.
As for Irasi Sages, as a result of excellent advice given in this thread and in IRC, I have some new ideas about how to approach this tradition-- I am pretty excited about them! I want to grapple with the concept a little bit more before posting specifics, but I am pleased to be incorporating a variety of suggestions into (what I believe will probably be) the final solution.
Wow, I liked the name Cold Spring Drinker from the first time I saw it on the wiki, but that institution sounds like one of the coolest ideas I've heard for a while :)
And I reckon that some of the weaker spells might not be worth a fate point expenditure just as you say yourself.
Loving the idea of the cold spring drinker letters
The Cold Spring Drinkers and their curious correspondences date back a while (http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?36327). Most of that thread is about the various Cardan gods, but the Cold Spring Drinkers (and sorcery) have their roots in that Olde Tyme Religion.
On a
newer note, here's something interesting (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Sages).
QuoteMeditations on Balance
"The self you recognize is not your true Self. The name you understand is not your true Name."
By practicing the teachings of the dragon Ira, you have begun to deny the false boundaries between the mind and the body and to unlock your full potential. Taking this stunt indicates that you are a mage whose discipline is Irasi. It is a prerequisite for all other Irasi stunts, and you must accompany it with an aspect that indicates your mage status.
This stunt grants you a small suite of powers; further Irasi stunts continue to develop and expand your mastery of magic. Your basic, fundamental abilities as an Irasi Sage are as follows:
* Unity of Mind and Body -- Instead of having two separate stress tracks for physical stress (health) and social/mental stress (composure), you have only a single stress track, which records stress of all kinds. Its length is determined by either your Endurance or your Resolve, whichever is better. Any other stunts which affect your health or composure stress tracks now apply their benefits to this unified stress track.
* Rapid Recovery -- You recover from all consequences two time intervals faster than normal. (Your consequences still last, at minimum, until the end of the scene; they don't vanish mid-scene.)
* The Enemy of Discord -- Your actions dealing with Irasi stunts or the Mysteries skill can always be hindered by aspects and consequences dealing with doubt, disharmony, fear, confusion, hesitation, and weakened resolve, no matter the circumstances. In addition, the Narrator can compel any of these aspects or consequences, causing you to lose your focus (see "The Sage's Focus", below) if you accept the compel.
* The Sage's Focus -- Similar to the way you inhale and exhale, you can gather, hold, and release a potent spiritual focus. Gathering your focus is a full action which requires a successful Mysteries roll against a target of Mediocre (+0), with increased difficulties in situations of stress or distraction. Once you have this focus, you may sustain it for as long as you like; while you remain focused, your Mysteries skill complements your Athletics, Resolve, and Might, but any stress you suffer is increased by one. You release (or involuntarily lose) your focus in any of the following circumstances:
--- voluntarily, as a free action (taken only on your turn, if during a conflict)
--- whenever you speak
--- whenever you make any physical attack or aggressive maneuver (though your Mysteries skill complements the skill you use for the attack)
--- when you suffer any consequence (in this case, you may immediately roll Mysteries as a free action to avoid losing your focus; use the same difficulty as if you were gathering your focus in the first place: Mediocre (+0), but increased in the situations of stress or distraction)
--- when you accept certain compels aspect or consequence compels (see "The Enemy of Discord", above)
--- when you release your focus to activate another Irasi stunt
Many other Irasi stunts provide additional powers that last while you maintain your focus, or that can be activated by releasing your focus.
uber alles[/i], I guess), but as "The Enemy of Discord" is a special
hindrance rather than a
power, it can stay for now.
(I really don't know whether it is necessary at all; it's easy to argue that it doesn't actually add any new drawbacks or benefits, but it's just a reminder of things that'd be true anyway, just because of the way the basic game mechanics work. "Hey, in case it hadn't occurred to you already, these guys rely on intense concentration-- maybe things that interfere with concentration are problematic for them? Just sayin'.")
The big deal here is
The Sage's Focus, which is going to be the "it" thing for Irasi-- the tradition defining quirk, as well as the solution to some of my previous misgivings. It's going to take some more fine-tuning, but I think the premise is sound.
Further Irasi stunts are going to build on this, either by being active only while you've got your focus, or by requiring you to release your focus to activate. (Note to Cataclysmic Crow: that's a convenient "activation cost" other than a fate point, also.)
Anything that hooks into this framework essentially takes a full turn to set up, and since getting your focus requires you to spend a turn doing nothing else (and possibly failing the attempt anyway), any power beefy enough to require you to spend your focus has a powerful limit on it.
As it stands (i.e., if you only have that stunt), releasing your focus to land a physical attack is worth it only if you had the focus already. If you check the numbers, regaining your focus after every attack and spending it on the next one is a terrible way to try combat-- and would remain so, even if I changed the bonus from a Mysteries complement to a straight-up +2.
hmm, yeah, a complement is only +1 right? But it's pretty clever, exactly because it's a cost without draining your ability to use ordinary aspects. Can't wait to see what else you can use the focus on :)
Sages are done (http://www.thecbg.org/wiki/index.php?title=Mysteries_Stunts_for_Sages) for the time being. There will almost certainly be alterations later-- for a start, I'm concerned that there are probably too many stunts here, used to describe a given amount of actual power, and that some should perhaps be combined-- but for now, I am willing to leave it alone.
Quote from: CChmm, yeah, a complement is only +1 right?
Yes, and you'd only get the +1 if the complementing skill is greater than the skill being complemented. (I have changed it from a complement to a regular +1, for the Irasi dabblers and rare warlike Sages whose Weapons or Fists are not less than their Mysteries.)
I like how with Harmonious Step you have to choose between keeping your focus but taking the consequences of a lesser fall, or try to save yourself and then take the full brunt if you fail.
If you use fate points to delay fire with the Spirit of Fire stunt, and then regain your focus before you suffer the effects, can you then negate all the delayed consequences as a focussed Spirit of Fire sage is immune to fire?
Can you use Long-armed Strike to disarm?
It seems you have achieved your goal of not having the sages outdo non-magical opponents at every skill. If you can get close to them, their martial art skill is probably not much better than any ordinary practitioner. Their skill lies in moving around past all possible barriers, be they flame, wall, or steel, and to effect melee manuevers at a distance. And controlling fire, but that seems to be mostly for show :)
For combat, Strength of the Sage seems somewhat weak in power, while the Sage as War sounds like it could give them an useful upper hand.
On another note, how many mystical stunts would it be natural for a mysticist to have in his chosen discipline?
Quote from: CCI like how with Harmonious Step you have to choose between keeping your focus but taking the consequences of a lesser fall, or try to save yourself and then take the full brunt if you fail.
Yeah, if you also have "Unlocking the Power Within", you can pretty much leap all over the place like Spiderman.
I really like many of your "quotes" by the way.
And check whether you replied to my entire post, or to some unfinished edition of it :)
Quote from: CCIt seems you have achieved your goal of not having the sages outdo non-magical opponents at every skill. If you can get close to them, their martial art skill is probably not much better than any ordinary practitioner. Their skill lies in moving around past all possible barriers, be they flame, wall, or steel, and to effect melee manuevers at a distance.
And controlling fire, but that seems to be mostly for show[/quote]or combat, Strength of the Sage seems somewhat weak in power,[/quote]while the Sage as War sounds like it could give them an useful upper hand.[/quote]spend[/i] your focus (currently it doesn't require this, but I may change my mind I guess).
That is definitely an idea I want to keep in mind, though, for when I go back and flesh out some Weapons and Fists stunts. I know I've got a little bit of a general combat overhaul in my future, and I really think that "use spin to place a temporary aspect on your attacker" is likely to show up as some Weapons or Fists stunt eventually-- it's too neat not to.
QuoteOn another note, how many mystical stunts would it be natural for a mysticist to have in his chosen discipline?
I really like many of your "quotes" by the way.[/quote]By far.[/i]
Some of them I like pretty well, myself, though. :yumm:
I'm thinking that since Spirit of Fire builds on mysticism and not endurance, delaying fire damage does not represent pain tolerance but rather supernatural control of fire and your own body. Thus, the fire will not harm you as long as you delay it, and if you manage to find your focus you can extinguish your flesh and emerge unharmed.
This seems to be the most sensible, if not balanced, solution. Having to pay fate points just to have time to regain your focus should be a heavy enough price for it to be balanced though.
Yeah; it would a lot more powerful in that respect than Last Leg, but it's also a lot more limited in scope (Last Leg works on fire-related injuries, as well as everything else). It's probably not the least bit unreasonable to have it work exactly as you describe!