-)- Dystopia (Discussion)

[SA]

[ooc] This is the discussion thread for Dystopia Revisited.[/ooc]

[Matt Larkin (author)]

It's been a while since I've looked at Dystopia.  I look forward to seeing your revisiting of it.  I feel I may need to something similar with some of my projects.

May favorite part of the new thread so far is the "Destiny" speech the guy being tortured gives.  I might suggest not breaking his speach until the very end, rather than splitting it with the torture, have the torture be the end.

The only other thing I can suggest so far is also technical (it's hard to give weighty content suggestions this early, since you're working on presentation right now):

This is a world caught between many things. Between slumber and wakefulness, agony and bliss, ignorance and unbearable enlightenment.

is a world caught between slumber and wakefulness, between agony and bliss, between ignorance and unbearable enlightenment."  

As always, disregard any suggestion if you like the original better.

You have a fantastic creative mind, so I look forward to seeing more.

[Numinous]

Wow.

Just as a note, I have never before read Dystopia, so this revisiting is incredibly convenient for me.

On another note, your introduction is awesome.  I now have to find my jaw, as it hit the floor and went right on through a while ago...

[Epic Meepo]

A nice, concise intro. I think it does a better job than the original thread of portraying the diversity of Dystopia right from the outset. In particular, the early emphasis on aquatic life makes the undersea regions seem a part of Dystopia as a whole instead of a seperate (if nearby) setting all their own.

Regarding that last point, perhaps consider a passing reference to methods or realms through which interaction between air-breathing and water-breathing races are possible.

[Varning]

I primarily lurk on the CBG, but I had to post just to say: I LOVE Dystopia!  At the risk of sounding like a sycophantic fanboy, Dystopia is the kewlest.  I've read the old Dystopia thread a few times, and I love the flavor of the setting.  Your writing definately captures the feeling of utter doom and the madness required to ignore it.  The sheer magnifience of this setting is awe-inspiring. (Oops, there I go being sycophantic.)

I want to hear about the conquering of Heaven, the IoValde (they rock), and the aquatic races (you have done an excellent job of portraying their alienness)!  Your new intro is awesome, definately supports the dark tone of the setting.  I am looking forward to more.

[SA]

This is a world caught between many things. Between slumber and wakefulness, agony and bliss, ignorance and unbearable enlightenment.

is a world caught between slumber and wakefulness, between agony and bliss, between ignorance and unbearable enlightenment."[/quote]Wow.[/quote]A nice, concise intro. I think it does a better job than the original thread of portraying the diversity of Dystopia right from the outset. In particular, the early emphasis on aquatic life makes the undersea regions seem a part of Dystopia as a whole instead of a seperate (if nearby) setting all their own.[/quote]I primarily lurk on the CBG, but I had to post just to say: I LOVE Dystopia! At the risk of sounding like a sycophantic fanboy, Dystopia is the kewlest. I've read the old Dystopia thread a few times, and I love the flavor of the setting. Your writing definately captures the feeling of utter doom and the madness required to ignore it. The sheer magnifience of this setting is awe-inspiring. (Oops, there I go being sycophantic.)[/quote]doom[/b] and madness elements are clearly evoked.

I want to hear about the conquering of Heaven, the IoValde (they rock), and the aquatic races (you have done an excellent job of portraying their alienness)! Your new intro is awesome, definately supports the dark tone of the setting. I am looking forward to more.

Heaven's fate has been altered slightly: it didn't seem feasible to me (even within the improbable nature of the setting) that humanity could conquer the angels without assistance from the Angels themselves.  So Heaven's still conquered, but the specifics of its fall are more treacherous in nature.  The IoValde will be back in terrifying form, with a slightly more insidious background.  The aquatic races have, though usually mentioned in passing, somehow become the poster boys for Dystopia.  They will be given their dues.

More to come, folks!

[Matt Larkin (author)]

I read through your new post.  Some interesting ideas.  I like how you work out the mental/physical dualism as found in some esoteric cosmologies.

[beejazz]

Anathema.... mmmmmmmmm....

[SA]

Deceptively enough, Dystopia doesn't deal in dualism.  It deals in the illusion of dualism; the erroneous distinction between things which should not be distinguished.  The dichotomy is like the ouroboros: two entities ostensibly containing their counterpart within themselves, but truly being a singular, self-referencing entity.  Reality is essentially infinity observing infinity.

I have The Eternal Golden Braid to thank, in part, for this inspiration.

The second and third posts have now been merged.  More to come.

[Epic Meepo]

The dichotomy is like the ouroboros: two entities ostensibly containing their counterpart within themselves, but truly being a singular, self-referencing entity.  Reality is essentially infinity observing infinity.

That sounds more like Yin-Yang than the ouroboros.

I like the flavor of the cosmology section as an intro. From the perspective of a campaign setting as art, it works very well. I'm curious to see related material that will actually come in play in game. How easy is it to move between different spheres? How to travellers percieve the journey? How often does such travel happen, and what effect do the resulting interactions have on Dystopian life? What can sentient beings do in a given sphere as compared to what they can and cannot do in others (game mechanics, perhaps)?

[SA]

Sorry, that should probably have read: "Ostensibly, it is two entities, each containing its counterpart within itself, but it is more accurately expressed in the imagery of the ouroboros; a singular entity containing itself within itself."

Coming next: Iounennion, The Merchant Cities of Draum, The City of Eternal Rain and the... League of Prostitutes?  Oh dear.

[Epic Meepo]

a singular entity containing itself within itself."

Like I said. Yin-Yang. (In Taoism, the yin-yang symbol represents one singular whole that is sometimes mistakenly described as two halves, even though no such division actually exists. The supposed dichotomy of yin and yang is a false one; both are exactly the same thing.)

[Raelifin]

[spoiler Spoilerized for convenience][ic Dystopia for Dummies]

"As Muer became Mýr over time, so too did Muer Saell become Myrshal, which in later incarnations of Phaelassi (particularly at the height of the Omellud Theocracy) came to represent not only the planet itself (which for them extended no farther west than the Iounennion Sea), but also the Counterfeit Realities, which were only beginning to be understood."[/color] to be a bit dense. I understand you write from the perspective of an intelectual addressing fellow intelectuals, but perhaps it would be better to choose a different perspective and/or subject for the initial content. After all, is the verbose section on etymology actually relevant to the reader?

I'm making good headway (despite the prose) in your work. Expect more review soon (After this headache goes away :P).[/spoiler]

[SA]

That was genuinely laugh-out-loud funny.

I think I will make that an official part of the setting, Rael.  I like my style, and will stick with it, but this idea could prove very useful as a sidenote.  Don't worry, though: the other quotes I'll be employing don't feature nearly the same quantity of circumnavigatory prose as that of Eirqart anâ,¬,,¢Melluk (and as Dystopia is fleshed out, you'll see why it opens how it opens).

Part of the problem might be that a lot of folks are reading this as a campagin setting (it doesn't help that it's in the Campaign Builder's Guild).  Technically, it is, but I'm aiming for a more literary than utilitarian presentation: to be read more like a discordant novel than a setting rulebook.  It's all "good reading", but not all of it is useful to a prospective Dystopia DM.  If you want to use it as a campaign setting, skip straight to "The World", or even "Iounennion".

Which doesn't exist yet...

It will be up in a few days.

[Tybalt]

Wow, I actually don't know where to start save to say that. It really has the feel of a book written in another age for another place. There is an immediate sense of it being a dark, living world that has different rules than our own. It is also one of those rare settings that makes me wish I had a setting handbookf for it on my shelf.

To begin with: the names are very good. The Book of Yawd is evocative sounding for instance. The phrase "The Overreach, The Inverted Tower, a Prison of Kings" makes you want to know more. It is as poetic and wild and strange sounding as any place in Michael Moorcock's Multiverse.

There is a bigness to your proposed world that I find fascinating. It makes me think of one of those paintings from the 60s that showed buildings and vessels huge and overwhelming and people around and on them tiny as ants.

I would like simply to encourage more from you. I want to know more about the Carrion Lords, more about the conceits of antiquity that endure in gross fashion, more about the city of eternal rain.

All in all most intriguing.