Discussion: Psionics?

[Soup Nazi]

I don't really have an opinion one way or the other. I'm not a huge fan, but seriously, if I DM it, then I probably just won't use it, or I'll buy a damned book and learn to love it.  It's not a hate relationship with me, it's just a "Geez, a whole new rules' system to learn within an already existing rules' system??" feeling.

Join in the psionic love fest Ishy. The system is not only easy, but perfectly designed. It's in the SRD, so you can learn it before you buy it too.

Like Turin already mentioned, the question is not if we should include it, so much as if we should account for it within the setting. Psionics can be added to any setting as an afterthought, but it only really fits well when its taken into account before hand.

I would like to have a deffinative role for psionics in Cebegia predetermined ahead of time. I want to know who uses psionics, what people think of it, how it is taught, what role it played throughout the history of the setting, and so on...I (and most others) won't bother using it, if it doesn't have a precedent within the world. I hate taking a setting and changing the whole history and dynamic of the world, just to cram in another system, but if it's already there I'll embrace it and use it.

While the idea of an island nation of psionic people isn't exactly what I was looking for, it does work in a way that allows people to either use it or not, which is nice. If we put it in a sidebar with some other options people would have the choice.

Add in a few things about this nation like perhaps spies, diplomats, trade, and a couple secret societies, and presto it can be almost everywhere, or almost nowhere, depending upon the individual DM's personal decision. If the people of this island nation are primarily human, they can blend in seamlessly with the rest of the world, so it won't matter one way or the other, if they are psionic or not.

-Nasty-

[brainface]

couple psi-rationale brainstorms:

1: while most casters draw power from an external source, devoting faith to some totem or saint or belief, psions have learned to turn their devotion inward, drawing power from inner strength. Due to the personal nature of their magic, their powers vary widely from individual to individual--some bring forth fire with a thought, some manifest weaponry, some can change their form.

2. a single, rogueish totem (or saint?) powers all psions. it has no 'base' city-state, and worshippers are spread over the entire world. maybe it's some kinda incorporeal monster? Maybe it exists only in dreams? something like that.

[daggerhart]

2. a single, rogueish totem (or saint?) powers all psions. it has no 'base' city-state, and worshippers are spread over the entire world. maybe it's some kinda incorporeal monster? Maybe it exists only in dreams? something like that.

perfect[/i] way to handle it imo.

[Numinous]

I kinda think the two could be combined...  Maybe a totem who powers all psionics, manifests as a wraith, and appears in people's dreams.  Maybe it tricks people into believing they are drawing power from themselves to gain worship for a plot of orld domination?

[Xeviat]

If we are to put Psionics in our setting, I can only see two methods for doing it: 1) Psionics are as known as the other forms of magic, or 2) Psionics are extraordinarily new, and thus are very rare. I feel that the second option is ultimately the best in this case.

I really enjoy the psionic rules, but they aren't for everyone. Unless there is a very large Aberration influence in the setting, I don't think there should be Psionics in it. I'd much rather see a setting designed solely for Psionics, and not having it tacked in.

[brainface]

2) Psionics are extraordinarily new

i think we're trying to avoid this. we can make them OLD and rare, though ;)

[brainface]

Unless there is a very large Aberration influence in the setting,o

most psionic monsters are aberrations, sure. that doesnt matter much to pc/npcs, though. if we go with a hidden/rogue totem, we could brand incorporeal creatures/undead as 'psionic' instead of aberrations. i think that'd work well, particularly since dms could run shadows/wraiths as normal, and CALL them 'psionic'. i get the feeling you'd want actual rules backing this up, though  :)  

[Soup Nazi]

Eberron already does the psionics is tied to the realm of dreams and nightmares thing. I really don't want to copy that.

Also psionics and religion are different things, just like arcane magic and religion are different things. I have no problem with a totem-god for psionics with domains like mind, meditation, and shadow. Maybe the doctrines of the faith promote hiding within the shadow of humanity...

However not all psionic people will be followers of the same god. Some may not be followers of any god at all. Complete psionic will have pseudo-cleric and pseudo-paladin base classes, if you want to go down the psionics being tied to a god thing; I just don't really like that concept too much. Psionics come from within, they are not granted by higher powers any more than a wizard's spells are.

Perhaps in the past, before the collapse of the old empire, psions were hunted and murdered by some sort of extremist military group (like the S.S. of Nazi Germany). Maybe they were nearly wiped out, heck they may have been completely wiped out. Today only a few psionic people exist because they have no teachers, or sages, or mentors of psionic lore. Psions have to unlock their powers on thier own. Some revere the totem-god for just this reason. (maybe the totem god is something tied to the plane of shadow, or banished from Cebegia to the plane of shadow).

I would much rather have the potential for psionics to be everywhere, without it being well known. The DMs who don't use them simply don't bother populating their campaign with shadowy psionics; the god is banished, and psionics are rare after all. Those that do want psionics however, could have cults of psionic npcs trying to free their deity, and infiltraters in every city.

-Nasty-

[Túrin]

So is this getting anywhere or do we need a vote?

[brainface]

i think it needs more talky. i always think that though, so take it with a grain of salt :)

[brainface]

Perhaps in the past, before the collapse of the old empire, psions were hunted and murdered by some sort of extremist military group (like the S.S. of Nazi Germany).

x-men[/i].

banished from Cebegia to the plane of shadow

Maybe instead the god's physical form was destroyed, or it never had one to begin with? It exists only as a mental construct, and can only interact with the physical world by possessing things. (phrenic creatures, etc.) Some psions could get their powers as a 'minor possession' from the god? actually i guess it could do that if it were banished to the plane of shadow as well.

[Soup Nazi]

Suppose the psionic Totem God was destroyed. Without their god to grant psionic power, the religion, and subsequently all knowledge of psionics was simply lost...

Today there are cults of worshippers who pray to the dead god in secrecy, and psionics has begun to manifest in those who never even heard of the old totem.

Maybe psionics was never tied to the god of psionics at all, but simply to the philosophies of his followers, and the priesthood ensured the knowledge of psionics was wide spread. When the god died, so did the priesthood, and people assumed psionics was also dead, but they weren't.

Now cults have discovered knowledge of the dead god, and are beginning to recruit new followers (preferably within the new empire, rather than in the city-states). I think it would be great to have a totem cult in the heart of the empire, that nobody even knows about, and since their god is dead, there won't be any obvious physical sign of their presence.

Elsewhere people are beginning to develop psionic powers without the aid of the psionic Totem. Psions, Soulknives, Wilders, and what-have-you, could simply be found randomly throughout Cebegia, though they are self-instructed, and probably don't even know about the dead totem god. These people could even be persecuted by the Totem priests/druids for using the power of a god without his permission (blasphemy). I think out Totem Gods have too much good guy syndrome as it is, and this gives them some hypocritical feel.

How does that sound?

-Nasty-

[Xeviat]

Well, have we even narrowed down where the arcane and divine classes get their power from? I think that needs to be decided first and foremost.

But if we do introduce psionics, I vote to toss out the sorcerer and replace it with the psion.

[brainface]

But if we do introduce psionics, I vote to toss out the sorcerer and replace it with the psion.

why do you always want to toss out classes? :'( it's not like this is some zero-sum game. :)

[baalzamon999]

But if we do introduce psionics, I vote to toss out the sorcerer and replace it with the psion.

I think the psion would make an interesting replacement. They both fill generally the same role.