Rakiin: Dune meets Fantasy - need general advice on implications and plausibility

[Raven Bloodmoon]

Hello everyone!  Sorry about the absence, but I really wasn't doing much RPing at all for a while.  I'm back, now, though, and working on a setting for an upcoming PbP on another site.  I'm mostly looking for advice, suggestions, and criticism.  I think I have enough to swing a game, but there's no depth yet.

The PbP takes place on a desert world called Rakiin (Ruh - Keen), which is pretty much a cross between Dune and 1,001 Arabian Nights with a healthy dose of middle estern politics heaped on top of everything.

In a little more detail - Rakiin is its own plane of existance and not the only one.  There are plenty, and the difference between a plane and a planet remain blurred.  I can see where some planes might have multiple planets or entire universes in them, but for now (and for simplicity's sake), Rakiin is merely a flat, sprawling desert as far as anyone has ever explored.  As technology is medieval at best and magic is not of any epic earth-shaking types, no one has really don't truly extensive exploring on a Magellanic scale.

The existance of other planes is important in that humans did not originate on Rakiin, but rather explorers found the desert plane somewhere around 7,000 years ago.  Since then, settlers have populated the world and grown enough as a people to spawn a laberynthine web of politics I'm not going to go into, but if you would like a nice example, look up the history of Palestine sometime.  I'm using that to a large extent as a basis.  Now, the other planes are also important in that for a while, the existance of Rakiin was not particularly important, but after it had been invaded a couple times from other planes and some of its popuilation spread to the "offworlder" planes, it got messed up in some weird situations.  Now, a fanatical group of former rakiin residents have managed to convince other planes to back them in claiming and conquering a portion of Rakiin, oppressing its people, and bulling its neighbors.  No, this is not original, and I'm not repainting it yet.  That's the extent of the current political setup.

The ecological / geographic setup is another end I am working on.  As Rael was kind enough to point out, Rakiin needs some anual precipitation, and it would make for a nice holiday to have a three or four day season of water falling from the sky.  That being so, I see other sources of moisture being underground caves where it is cool enough for water to form dew on cave walls and such, deep wells, and morning dew.  This does not include plants, of course.  Now from this, I have yet to really extrapolate just what there is in terms of an ecology, but it seems that it'd be pretty odd and rugged.  No idea about native wildlife, either.

In terms of society adn culture, I see religion playing a huge roll, especially in the lives of the oppressed.  Probably some sort of water or earth worship with animistic overtones.  The Sun seems to be an enemy at present, as the winds sometimes are, as well, when they blow up horrendous sandstorms.

This is what I'm working with at present.  Any suggestions, comments or criticisms would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks, guys!

[Superfluous Crow]

Why did anybody settle there in the first place? It sounds like those that settled were already fairly civilized when they encountered the desert.

[Ghostman]

The ecological / geographic setup is another end I am working on. As Rael was kind enough to point out, Rakiin needs some anual precipitation, and it would make for a nice holiday to have a three or four day season of water falling from the sky.  That being so, I see other sources of moisture being underground caves where it is cool enough for water to form dew on cave walls and such, deep wells, and morning dew.  This does not include plants, of course.  Now from this, I have yet to really extrapolate just what there is in terms of an ecology, but it seems that it'd be pretty odd and rugged.  No idea about native wildlife, either.

3-4 days of rain is extremely little. The rainfall would have to be very heavy (not something you'd expect in a desert) to result in enough precipitation to make even irrigation-supported agriculture possible (they'd need to build dams to create man-made reservoirs where the water is collected). There probably wouldn't be any native plant species that could be used for agricultural purposes. Should a dam collapse it would be the guaranteed death of a whole population, unless they can escape to another plane.

Wildlife in such a world would be very scarse. Prolly no big animal species at all, except some domestic ones brought from other planes.

If you want the setting to actually resemble arid regions on Earth, you should have a much longer rainy season (maybe a month or two) where some days are rainy but most aren't. And to have some specific areas be much more humid, so that they generate rivers which then flow through the more arid places, enabling agriculture (and thus the existence of towns) there.

In terms of society adn culture, I see religion playing a huge roll, especially in the lives of the oppressed.  Probably some sort of water or earth worship with animistic overtones.  The Sun seems to be an enemy at present, as the winds sometimes are, as well, when they blow up horrendous sandstorms.

Night in a desert can be just as harsh as the day, since it tends to get very cold. The Egyptians certainly didn't see the Sun as an enemy despite living in a very hot place. Just some things to think about. :)

[LordVreeg]

Oasis=power.

What system are you going to use?

who would adventure and why?

scorpions, bugs, snakes, birds, right?

Any other races?

to really get a middle east situation, you need intertwined religions that share certain holy areas/relics but with differfent stories and slants.

Also, to get Palestine, you need much larger countries/orgs using it and it's neighbors as pawns.  It has to be a weak backwater to get the kind of backhanded crap that Palestine got.

[Llum]

Lots of deserts have large underground rivers.

One desert on earth has a big enough underwater river that people are thinking of tapping it for hydro energy, it would produce a stupid large amount, nevermind all the water they could draw from it as well.

It courses under the entire desert I believe, oasis are just bits that come to surface.

[Raven Bloodmoon]

Thanks for the response, everyone.

Cataclysmic Cow:
People settled here for one of three reasons I haven't decided yet:

1) They were driven/dumped here by offworlders to get rid of them
2) They fled here to escape persecution
3) There was some useful resource here at one point (either it's gone or not used anymore)

Ghostman:
I'm thinking rainfall will be pretty torrential and result in temporary surface rivers until they seep into the ground or otherwise evaporate.

As the daytime climate is hot enough to kill most people attempting to exert themselves in it (heatstroke/dehydration), I thought an evil sun deity would be appropriate.  Also figured that people would be more nocturnal as a result (just like most animals and plants will be).  Aside from that, I'm tired of sun gods always being beneficial.

Vreeg's Bordeaux:
I'm using Gurps to run this.  People don't make a career of adventuring; adventures kind of happen to people in any number of ways, including war, terrorism, drought, exploration, trading, travel, pilgrammages, etc.  There are only humans in this corner of the multiverse, and as xenophobic as they are about even other humans, I don't see any other races creeping in, adn consequently have not bothered to give them any thought.  Other planes sort of fill in the niche of foreign countries screwing around with local affairs, though it is worth noting that palestine didn't really become a pawn until after ww1.  As for religions, I'm still sorting that out.  I'm thinking one possibility might be differeing sects of the same faith.

Llum:
I had already planned on subterranean water, as I figured if nothign else, where the air is cooler, water will condense on cave walls and form puddles, lakes, and apparently rivers.  Kind of cool idea, too, thanks.  On a side note, it would seem that underground would be the best place to store water, as well.

Something else, I just thought of that might need consideration is that at higher altitudes, it is colder, and thus water would be more likely to remain.  If nothing else, I'd expect that higher up in mountains, there are grasses and shrubs and such.  This could support larger wildlife that are adapted to obtain their water from their food, like the barbary sheep and addax.

[Ninja D!]

First off, I like the general idea. I'm doing something similar myself.

About the name: The name sounds almost like it was ripped from a Dune book. That is probably your intention but are you sure you want it that way? Are you fine with the idea of people not being able to look at your setting without thinking of Dune? If you're just creating this setting for a single campaign, that probably isn't an issue. If you want it to go further than that, it may be.

Now about planets and planes...I kind of like the idea of the distinction being blurred but I do have a question about that. Are you leaving it that way so that you're free to make things however you want later on? Is it this way because the low-technology people of the setting don't know any better and this is just how it seems to them? Or is the reasoning something else entirely?

Since there is obviously travel between "planes" or "planets", how is that travel done? I would think that the traveling would make a distinction. People are either using a space shit or some kind of magic, probably. I suppose some kind of generic teleportation, either through magical means such as a circle or via some kind of device could easily leave that line blurred.

Do you want the flora and fauna of the world to be entirely realistic / believable, magical and over the top, or somewhere in between?

I can understand water being an important part of religion in a world like this. It makes perfect sense. After all, it is rare but needed for life. Searching for new sources of water could probably be considered a holy mission by the common people and that would also make sense. I'm not sure, however, how water worship would work. The idea just seems strange to me. I am also not sure how well the idea of earth worship would fit, unless people commonly live in caves. Then it would make a lot of sense to me, too. As for the animistic overtones...well, you'd have to decide what kinds of animals there are going to be before you go much further with that.

Out of curiosity, what game system will you be using?

[Ghostman]

Something else, I just thought of that might need consideration is that at higher altitudes, it is colder, and thus water would be more likely to remain.  If nothing else, I'd expect that higher up in mountains, there are grasses and shrubs and such.  This could support larger wildlife that are adapted to obtain their water from their food, like the barbary sheep and addax.

Mountains also tend to experience much more rainfall than flatlands. So when you get your seasonal torrential rainstorms, they're going to be *very* intense at the mountains. Of corse, water runs downhill which creates streams that tend to gather into rivers. Thus the presense of mountains also provides some water for the lowlands. The same source could also feed into any underground lakes and rivers you may have.

I am also not sure how well the idea of earth worship would fit, unless people commonly live in caves. Then it would make a lot of sense to me, too.

Or they could build their houses so that most of them are below the ground level. I could see a very low wall, lined with low, wide windows, supporting a flat roof with trapdoors. Enter the house by descending a stairway dug on it's side - or alternatively, use a trapdoor on the roof and a ladder. The windows and the trapdoors provide light when it's needed but can be sealed when the Sun is high. Add some air circulation shafts and it should be comfortably cool through the day.

[Raven Bloodmoon]

Now about planets and planes...I kind of like the idea of the distinction being blurred but I do have a question about that. Are you leaving it that way so that you're free to make things however you want later on? Is it this way because the low-technology people of the setting don't know any better and this is just how it seems to them? Or is the reasoning something else entirely?

Do you want the flora and fauna of the world to be entirely realistic / believable, magical and over the top, or somewhere in between?[/quote] Mountains also tend to experience much more rainfall than flatlands. So when you get your seasonal torrential rainstorms, they're going to be *very* intense at the mountains. Of corse, water runs downhill which creates streams that tend to gather into rivers. Thus the presense of mountains also provides some water for the lowlands. The same source could also feed into any underground lakes and rivers you may have.[/quote]

I had read about that and thought that the mountains would actually make nicer homes, provided that the sun's rays aren't lethal in other ways (i.e. radiation at higher altitudes can have adverse effects).  Don't know that I'd really go there, though.  For sure, though, mountains seem like a good source of water for lowland areas.

[Ghostman]

I found something that might be useful for you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qanat

[Superfluous Crow]

Some ideas that might be a bit too fantasy-ish for you:
No idea whether you could use this, but a city idea for a former desert of mine involved a sort of inverted cone with a road spiraling down and ending in a small well/lake/oasis at the bottom level. Additional elements would involve walls to protect from the sand and a sort of heavy textile canopy to protect from the sun.
Also considered a secret network of underground river that was also used for transportation.
Still think dark sun gods would be cool (they are always good...). Maybe not evil, but more of a callous punisher (perhaps with a lot of rules).
Sunburn might be a stigma. You are required to be fully clothed.
again, just ideas for when i was myself making a desert nation for a setting. But that was a previous incarnation so i don't really have a use for these ideas.  

[Raven Bloodmoon]

Nice one, Ghostman.  Thanks>  Definitely good to incorporate.

Crow, I like that city.  I can really picture it in my head.  Pleasantly exotic and not the least bit too fantasyish.  If anything, this setting has been sort of getting too realistic for my taste, lately, in my mind, at least.  (That's one hell of a bad example of comma usage...yikes!)

At the least, the Sun would be a callous punisher.  I was thinking of it being an adversary, since the sun is such a deadly entity in the world.  Either way, sunburn could be a stigma easily enough, if nothing else, as a sign of your class.  The wealthy never have need to go in the sun--that's what servants and slaves are for.  =)