Topic of the Fortnight Club - Trade

[Polycarp]

Welcome to the Topic of the Fortnight Club!

We will be starting off this particular fortnight with the topic of Trade.

[ic=Trade]"No nation was ever ruined by trade." - Benjamin Franklin

The exchange of goods is critical to civilization and society.  Exchange allows for specialization, as a person is freed to devote their time to something other than the production of food.  As humans grew more advanced and organized on Earth, they began to trade farther and farther from home, obtaining goods available only in foreign lands.  Trade and the pursuit of goods have started wars and made nations powerful.

Trade is likely to be of equal importance in your setting.  Though the routes of trade may be long or short depending on your level of technology, trade goes on nonetheless.  The trade interests of states and groups dictate their politics.  An urban city-state that must import most of its food, for instance, will feel the effects of a siege or blockade strongly, and will seek allies and new territories that can guarantee its food supply.  Lands rich in valuable trade goods may be fought over by the powers that be, while poor lands may languish as half-wild backwaters where bandits and monsters thrive in a power vacuum.

While a list of exports and imports may not seem relevant to everyday gaming, players too are likely to be affected by the availability of goods in the world.  Need a new set of plate?  That may require you to journey to lands with iron enough to be able commonly craft such things, or wealthy urban centers which import such resources from elsewhere.  Caravans, the focus of many an adventure, are supposedly carrying something to somewhere, and knowing who has it and who wants it (and who wants to take it from those two) is important to giving such an adventure depth and believability.

Like Organizations, this is a rather broad topic, and there are a few ways you could go with this.

Goods - What gets traded?  Who makes it?  Why should players care?*Trade Routes - How do goods get from one place to another?  Land, sea, and even air are all possibilities.*Threats to trade - Plenty of bandits, gangsters, and thieves want to get their hands on filthy lucre.  Who are they?  How are they involved in trade?  What steps do the authorities take against them?*Trade Groups - We talked about this a bit for the last topic, but there are likely to be guilds and other (non-criminal) groups interested in trade.*Black Marketeers - Not everything that's traded is legal, you know.*Magic in Trade - If magic exists in any material form in your world, from magic items to reagents, aether, or crystals, it's likely traded by someone.

Trade - well, it's important.  So what are you waiting for, a sale?[/ic]
[ic=Topic Wranglers]Nothing to add yet![/ic]
[spoiler=TFC FAQ]
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The next TFC thread will hopefully be posted on or around Sunday, September 20.[/spoiler]

[Nomadic]

Mare Eternus of course has trade. Within a single world you can find trade routes over both land and water (and even rarely air). The most common routes though are submersible ones connecting groups on different worlds. Because of the greater independence of groups and the general weakness of most governments trade is a very fluid thing. Governments do pull tariffs though not on near the scale of more conventional earth-like nations. Often trade is an agreement between two non-governing groups (such as a guild or a wealthy family) to supply each other with the agreed upon supplies (your family trades us so many barrels of your fine wine and in turn we offer your merchant vessels an escort of military vessels). In this sense its almost an elaborate form of bartering (though purchasing goods with more standard means of wealth happens often enough).

I think though the most curious aspect is the black market. The existence of artifacts and clockwork which can be used as powerful construction components (or even as capable items on their own) yet isn't something you can get at the local store has fueled a very powerful underground market. With it has come smuggling, theft, and outright piracy, all in an attempt to get rich off such items. Even the clockwork, which has an air of malice for many, has more than enough people looking to purchase it off anyone willing to sell such trinkets. Indeed the world of trade is incredibly complex and dynamic.

(note that I haven't done the section on trade in the wiki yet... so this is the sum of my written work on the subject so far)

[Ghostman]

Trade in Savage Age works very much like it did in pre-modern age. Things have to be hauled the hard way, either overland or by ship - going overland being by far slower and costlier, while going overseas is more lucrative but also more dangerous.

Caravans with armed escorts are common throughout much of the setting, since banditry is a major threat. Where good roads actually exist, merchandise can be loaded on carts for easier and faster transport, but most caravans of SA are based on pack animals.

Pirates can be found on most seas, as few states possess the means to do much about them. In fact, it is not uncommon for seafaring kingdoms to engage in acts of piracy themselves. Storms also take a major toll on ships, along with attacks by sea monsters. The people of SA do not have the means to dive deep, so treasure lost in a shipwreck may be impossible to retrieve.

Of particular importance is the trade of silk, which is by far the most lucrative substance in Savage Age. ALL of it is produced in one archipelago, generally referred to as the Silk Islands by outsiders. Because of the limited supply and the difficulties of transportation, the price of silk is extremely high and a great prestige is given to clothes made from it. In some places, only kings are able to afford (or allowed by law) to wear silk.

Demand for this vaunted fabric is very much the reason why an extensive and complex network of trade routes, radiating from the archipelago like branches of a tree to reach far corners of the world, has been formed in spite of the dangers and hardships that plague the merchants. As silk has to pass through several countries and kingdoms on it's way, each stop along the routes adds to the price and scarcity. Every time it exchanges hands, the new owner must sell at a higher price in order to strike a profit, while every market consumes a portion of the shipments, and every prince imposes his tolls and taxes on the merchants. Thus political divisions along the routes bear a major influence on the price and availability of silk, making merchants very interested in discovering alternative routes, and states very willing to fight over the control of these routes.

[Mason]

What kind of trade can exist in a dream world? Who would bother with such things when there is no evidence of any denizen actually 'needing' anything at all-besides the precious bloodstone and the still rarer magistone. Do people trade stones? Possibly, this is somthing I have been thinking about recently. And it is a tough question for this setting.

 The plyushkins are the only creatures who have a sort of neurosis for collecting and trading 'junk'. Odds and ends. Scraps of paper, forks, candlesticks, spectacles, strips of cloth, pots and pans, clay jars filled with dead flies. This sort of thing. All plyushkins have at least one piece of 'junk' that they are hard pressed to trade. These are usually the rarest of items in Pinnacle-somthing from the real world that happened to come with them when they were carried away into the dream. Maybe somthing from childhood, or whatever they were holding when they made the trip (either by choice or not). The plyushkins do trade between themselves, often swapping the same goods over and over for all eternity. The rarer items are usually bartered for stones, and sometimes they won't even trade away somthing held dear to them even for a bit more of the precious commodity.


It certainly is odd to look at the 'life-count' of the inhabitants of the setting as a commodity. Gives a new perspective on the subject. I had thought that maybe some low-lifes (literally) would possibly play dice or some sort of gambling game with their stones, but that does not seem to fit into this topic very well. It's not much, and it is my first shot at the topic of the fortnight, but there you are.

[LD]

Oops. Bump.
I was wondering when the next topic would appear, but it seems I myself neglected to respond to the most recent topic :o.

I will have to write something up for this...

[Gamer Printshop]

Like Japan throughout much of its history, Kaidan is a closed state, practicing extreme isolationism, yet trade still affects the economy there. Most trade occurs in country, from farms and fishermen to towns/cities. Artisans and craftsmen are found everywhere city and country, yet due to population centers manufacturing primarily occurs in urban areas. As previously mentioned Kaidan exists as a rice-based economy, with values in monetary systems based on rice exchange prices.

The entire first mini-campaign arc for Kaidan, called The Gift, is focused on players from an outsider place coming to Kaidan in a trade agreement. An emphasis on the Yakuza is made in this initial adventure arc as Trade in Kaidan is considered: dirty, even taboo. In the social caste system, merchants are equivalent to the Hinin (Eta) or Tainted caste, the lowest social order. According to Kaidan philosophy, those who produce goods have value. Those who only profit in the acquisition and delivery of produced goods (the merchants) are parasites earning incomes through exchange of goods, and not actually producing anything.

Trade is the fastest growing economic activity in Kaidan, and the Yakuza are at the top of earning a profit in this venture.

Trade goods from Kaidan are primarily: rice, green tea, mulberry and rice paper products, silk, silk manufacture (dying and tailoring of silk goods), quality steel and gold manufactured products. All other products are maintained in state, as trade goods between provinces and between the country and city. Most goods, especially fine crafted items are kept in country.

GP

[LD]

Bump. Hi Polycarp? Is it time to bring this back for another go-around?

In which thread did you have the list with all the topic ideas that we brainstormed?

[Polycarp]

this thread[/url], in which I proposed the original idea.  Jharviss posted a rather useful list that I picked the previous topics from.

[LD]

Well, I can try to pick it up if you would prefer- I can understand some disappointment given that the last one fortnightly topic generated only a few responses- but the two before were quite successful. You did an excellent job with your initial posts, however. That level of quality would be difficult to live up to.

Considering that summer is coming up and those of the CBGers who have school are seeing it end, would others potentially respond to this project? (what are others' views? Is this a worthwhile endeavour?)


Brainstorming Thread
Festivals
Organizations
Trade (this thread).

[Nomadic]

I'd join in this summer. Don't have time for it right now.

[Endless_Helix]

In Orrery, trade is the lifeblood of the setting. Merchants sail through the sky, bringing good from the exotic and war-torn Dawnland, from the mysterious Idjkun, and many other strange and far away places. Most countries have a Merchant-marine corporation or two, who export the nation's products (sometimes by force), and who spend much of their time searching for new markets. For instance, Belsarius recently began negotiations with Pax Phaethusa for ammonia, sulphur, and several other fertilizing materials as their shard has begun to run a little dry on those particular elements. Phaethusa needs food, which Belsarius can produce quite a lot of in a short amount of time.

Most trade outside of nations is by barter system, simply because there isn't a connected banking system, making currency exchange a little tricky. This creates a number of problems, however among most stripes of merchants, the Phaethusan Aurum can be seen changing hands. It is the steadiest currency available, and its value is exactly equal to the amount of gold in the coin. However, while many of the 'international citizens' prefer this coinage, they will use most of any the Six Major Powers' currency. Some minor powers, like Purity City, have no coin of their own, and use someone else's

Purity City is an orbital entirely based around the idea of free trade taken to its most ridiculous extreme. Everything is for sale, including the 'law'. Merchants, Smugglers, and 'Entrepreneurs' of various shades can be found with goods both legitimate and somewhat... questionable.

Pirates and smuggling is a major career for people who live on the outside edges of the laws set up by the Powers. Many times, tensions between the powers prevent free trade from being as free as it could be. Where there is tension, there is opportunity. The international black market is thriving, pulsating entity, and likewise, pirates came in to prey on it. They also prey on more legitimate merchant vessels, but tend to find smugglers more convenient targets when they can catch them.  After all, taking a smuggler means that they won't have to worry about the various Navies. In particular, the entire nation of Idjkun is the pirate haven, since they have little, just enough to eke out a survival, they take what they need from others. This has led to a number of altercations between the clans and other nations, most notably Kun pirates were responsible for the Concordat of Dalengard's unification and accidentally leaking skycraft technology to the Daleni alliance during the Kun's ill-fated and bloody invasion attempt.

Dalengard is practically a world unto itself, given the size of it, and has enough internal problems to keep it from using the brute force of its burgeoning industrial complex, plentiful natural resources, and huge population to out-produce every other nation. Likewise, there are several currencies and economic systems used within the COD, even two hundred years after the fact, however the most widespread is by far the Daleni lucre. However, they also have the Sylvan kendi, the dwarven bar, and the Ulaki gul in common circulation. This has become a problem, because most outsiders don't recognize the secondary and tertiary currencies, which makes international trade very difficult with the COD, even though they would love more contact with the outside world.

[LD]

How does Purity City handle conversions considering that they take "other people's" coinage?

[Endless_Helix]

How does Purity City handle conversions considering that they take "other people's" coinage?

Oddly enough, it doesn't really. The Merchant's Guild usually just melts down the coin for the metal if they don't officially recognize it, which actually gives them a large boost in wealth given some metals are common on one shard, and stupidly rare on others; for instance, copper is practically unknown on Belsarius, and is worth more per pound than platinum, but is so common in Idjkun that it's cut into just about all of their coins. Given a half-decent smelter and a pile Idjkun currency, a merchant could make a killing or two selling copper to Belsarius. For the more common currencies, they just store them until such a time that they need it. They keep a weather eye on what the prices for each commodity on each orbital are, and consequently just use those as a rough starting point. They don't 'exchange' currency. There are no standardized exchange rates. The only country with the beginnings of an 'exchange rate' is the pirate nation of Idjkun, since they steal everybody's currency they are trying to figure out what each currency is worth of each other. Most countries just use foreign currency for the worth of the metal, much like in medieval Europe.