The Campaign Builder's Guild

QuoteI think races should be offered as a series of benefits, as mentioned earlier, and should cost proportionate points when addign them to a character.

I think I like this.
All races start out statted the same, but you pay for racial traits you want.
Not every gnome's backstory fits the speak with animals schtick, for example.  Not every dwarf is a mining engineer.

@Silvercat: Those stats look roughly like my suggestion (minus luck). Whether or not we include luck, it's a pretty comprehensive physical we have here.
@Snake (and any other magic questions). Spells should just plain recharge. I can cast magic missile every 1dx rounds. Period. I can cast polymorph every 1dx rounds. None of this overlap. None of this pool. None of these slots.
@Nat (and races): Races should be buyable and customizable. There may be discounts on certain features depending on race.
@Whoever (tech and updates): Once we have the system down, we could update periodically in the Campaign Builder's Guide, with a description of how we wrote the stuff. We'd have more freedom than with d20. Also, let's just have money to start sufficient for basic equipment, with earnings just sufficient for survival. Magic items (and, on that note, hi-tech) could be bought with character points.

I don't know if buying magic items with character points is a good idea. It's a far step from most methods, including the D&D one which has always seemed fine to me. I think we could definitely design items with points based on what powers they have and determine their costs with the amount of points it took to make them, but character points shouldn't buy items.

At the very least, you should get options on your racial and cultural benefits. Just because you are a particular race, doesn't mean you'll want all the benefits.

However, I'm not sure you need to have characteristic benefits to a race/culture. If you are already paying points to buy your characteristics, what is the point of paying points in a different way to get an additional +2 DEX from your race? Will they be cheaper this way? Or what? Why not just make 'em pay to buy the extra +2 DEX if they want it?

Racial/cultural benefits would include special abilities like infravision, etc. Special cultural benefits like bonus levels in certain skills, or a reduced cost to buy certain features when starting out, etc. are also possible.

@beejazz: So if I learn 4 different blaster spells, I can just alternate them ad infinitum? That isn't really much of a limitation, unless it is just plain hard to learn that many spells. (Not to mention that keeping track of the last time I cast each of my spells isn't necessarily any easier than keeping track of a pool.)

I've played a lot of systems that made it so hard to learn magic, that all casters were effectively hedgehogs. That's not a lot of fun to me.

@witchhunt... I'm thinking of *unique* things. You don't just go out and *buy* a sapient and/or flying mount or the Lance of Longinus or what have you. Guns, swords, or whatever just cost money and can be picked up at your local drug store (so to speak). The economy wouldn't support the buying and selling of so many items of mystic import. Besides, it moves magic items, etc. into being the realm of roleplaying. Only certain people have these things, and how or why the character got this thing is a nice roleplaying hook... rather than some standard fare shiz.
@snakefing: I see your point. Perhaps every 1dx rounds for a *school* of magic as opposed to individual spells or having spell levels.

Just a note, I would like to see luck added on to the stats we have already.  We can use it for saves or something...  Or magic.  I just like luck as a stat.  any other idea for possible uses?

Seems like the obvious application for luck would be some kind of Action Point or Hero Point mechanic. That's kind of fun as long as it doesn't come to dominate the game.

That's what I was thinking of mainly.  crits seem like a good thing to tie into them as well, if we don't tie them to their respective weapons.

Regarding the items beejazz, if you're referring having to pay a few points in order to properly wield an artifact, then I can see reason in it. Regardless, D&D has it right where treasure and artifacts are usually found in secret lairs and stashes of the rich and powerful, or in forgotten places where someone hoped no one would ever find them.

Reading the recent thoughts about spellcasting, I think perhaps a recharging mana system is the best idea. Have so many mana points and have them recharge over time. Perhaps even base the standard recharge rate off of how much of your mana is left. You could spend character points to increase mana or mana regeneration. If we do this and use a percentage remaining recharge rate, it should probably be low enough so that there's not a huge change in natural recharge.

@Witch: I want a game that doesn't *need* progressive items. A character can have Catholic Relics or Norse magic swords or whatever, but even most characters don't. To make it cost to use properly diminishes the item itself. To roleplay to get it at all I guess makes sense (the lair bit).
As for magic, recharge. Straight recharge. I can only use necromancy so often, can only use blasting so often, can only use enchantments so often. Remember my stuff on tech trees? A character can work in all of the above, but sacrifices higher-powered spells in doing so (the tech tree) preventing abusive rotation. The rate could even be 1d20-x, where x is your "spell power". Built in. Simple. No points.

QuoteReading the recent thoughts about spellcasting, I think perhaps a recharging mana system is the best idea. Have so many mana points and have them recharge over time. Perhaps even base the standard recharge rate off of how much of your mana is left. You could spend character points to increase mana or mana regeneration. If we do this and use a percentage remaining recharge rate, it should probably be low enough so that there's not a huge change in natural recharge.

Sounds unwieldy to me.
Has anyone tried a system like this, where you track recharge times?

For example, I can buy NECROMANCY I.
This means I can achieve several "1st-level" necromancy effects, and use them every 1d20-1 rounds.
NECROMANCY II would give me "2nd-level" necromancy effects once every 1d20-2 rounds.
NECROMANCY III would give me "3rd-level" necromancy effects every 1d20-3 rounds.

A character must have I to get to II and II to get to III.
OR he could halve mixed NECRO I with EVOC I with ILLUS I.
Rotation and versatility, yes.
But less focus.

@ CYRMO: Recharge times are easier than recharge mana.
Believe me, I know.
You can just set a dice on the number of remaining rounds to count down. Simple.

@beejazz: I can see your point, and I think it could work. But I'd still argue in favor of a pool/recharge approach that has the following properties:

1. Recharge is slow enough that, in essence, you won't recharge, or not much, during a single encounter.
2. Recharge is fast enough that, typically, you'll recharge fully between encounters unless they are essentially back-to-back.
3. The total pool size is typically in the single digits to low double digits, so the numbers here aren't that hard to keep track of.
4. You can't do too much to augment a spell by spending extra points. If you want to do lots of damage, you need a higher power spell.

The effect is that you usually only need to track your pool for the duration of a single encounter. You can defeat even a powerful spell caster by keeping after them for long enough to exhaust their power. But they'll regain their power shortly, so you have to take advantage of it while you can. If casters use only low power magic, they can keep it up for quite a while, but if they start slinging their highest level spells, they can find themselves exhausted in only a couple of rounds.

Anyway, that's the case and general flavor I'm putting forth. I'll probably shut up about it now, unless people have questions.

On the items thing:
I agree, I prefer a game in which magic items are not bought and sold, and only the weakest of items, like potions or temporary charms, can be regularly made, etc. But I'd be wary of building too much of this into game mechanics, since some GM's might prefer to run a different sort of game.