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Language [Xiluh]

Started by SDragon, April 14, 2010, 09:12:37 PM

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limetom

Quote from: Rorschach FritosI'm not so sure I want to deal with such a case system yet; I might eventually, but not yet.
You don't need one for either option, mind.

SDragon

Bump. I realized that I can make the word "man" with this. So far, I've been using -i for pluralization, which would make more than one man be "mani". I wonder, should I "Xiluh-ize" the spellings of the various races? That would give me something like "eleve" for elf, and something like "drave" for dwarf. Not sure what I would do for halflings, though. Maybe "havulenke"? "Habete"? Of course, I'm not even sure if I really do want to do this, but it is an interesting thought.


Edit-- of course, if I do this, I'll have to come up with some way to make adjectives. That way I can have a way to say "elven", or "dwarven". Near as I can tell, I can use either particles for this, or suffixes. I wonder which would be better...
[spoiler=My Projects]
Xiluh
Fiendspawn
Opening The Dark SRD
Diceless Universal Game System (DUGS)
[/spoiler][spoiler=Merits I Have Earned]
divine power
last poster in the dragons den for over 24 hours award
Commandant-General of the Honor Guard in Service of Nonsensical Awards.
operating system
stealer of limetom's sanity
top of the tavern award


[/spoiler][spoiler=Books I Own]
D&D/d20:
PHB 3.5
DMG 3.5
MM 3.5
MM2
MM5
Ebberon Campaign Setting
Legends of the Samurai
Aztecs: Empire of the Dying Sun
Encyclopaedia Divine: Shamans
D20 Modern

GURPS:

GURPS Lite 3e

Other Systems:

Marvel Universe RPG
MURPG Guide to the X-Men
MURPG Guide to the Hulk and the Avengers
Battle-Scarred Veterans Go Hiking
Champions Worldwide

MISC:

Dungeon Master for Dummies
Dragon Magazine, issues #340, #341, and #343[/spoiler][spoiler=The Ninth Cabbage]  \@/
[/spoiler][spoiler=AKA]
SDragon1984
SDragon1984- the S is for Penguin
Ona'Envalya
Corn
Eggplant
Walrus
SpaceCowboy
Elfy
LizardKing
LK
Halfling Fritos
Rorschach Fritos
[/spoiler]

Before you accept advice from this post, remember that the poster has 0 ranks in knowledge (the hell I'm talking about)

SDragon

"nother bump, related to the last one. I'm finding that the syllabary is already doing wonders for flavor. I've (inconsistently) transliterated a couple English loanwords, and they've come out sounding quite exotic. The most recent, for example, is my word for yuan-ti: sunakaman, which was transliterated from "snake-man".

Should I just stick with this? What do you guys think?
[spoiler=My Projects]
Xiluh
Fiendspawn
Opening The Dark SRD
Diceless Universal Game System (DUGS)
[/spoiler][spoiler=Merits I Have Earned]
divine power
last poster in the dragons den for over 24 hours award
Commandant-General of the Honor Guard in Service of Nonsensical Awards.
operating system
stealer of limetom's sanity
top of the tavern award


[/spoiler][spoiler=Books I Own]
D&D/d20:
PHB 3.5
DMG 3.5
MM 3.5
MM2
MM5
Ebberon Campaign Setting
Legends of the Samurai
Aztecs: Empire of the Dying Sun
Encyclopaedia Divine: Shamans
D20 Modern

GURPS:

GURPS Lite 3e

Other Systems:

Marvel Universe RPG
MURPG Guide to the X-Men
MURPG Guide to the Hulk and the Avengers
Battle-Scarred Veterans Go Hiking
Champions Worldwide

MISC:

Dungeon Master for Dummies
Dragon Magazine, issues #340, #341, and #343[/spoiler][spoiler=The Ninth Cabbage]  \@/
[/spoiler][spoiler=AKA]
SDragon1984
SDragon1984- the S is for Penguin
Ona'Envalya
Corn
Eggplant
Walrus
SpaceCowboy
Elfy
LizardKing
LK
Halfling Fritos
Rorschach Fritos
[/spoiler]

Before you accept advice from this post, remember that the poster has 0 ranks in knowledge (the hell I'm talking about)

LordVreeg

Quote from: limetomNot really.  I don't know of any language that has both.  Generally, you have one or the other.

In isolating languages, that is, languages where the ideal is one morpheme-per-word, you don't have a case system, so you generally don't have a noun class system.  Isolating languages are generally the ones that have classifiers.

In synthetic languages, where the ideal is typically more than one morpheme-per-word, you often have a case system, so you often have a noun class system as well.

These two, however, are not set in stone.  Chinese is regarded as a very isolating language, yet has a ton of compounds, which are two words put together to make a new word (e.g. ç"Ÿæ—¥ / shÄ"ngri 'birthday' < ç"Ÿ+æ—¥ / shÄ"ng 'birth; life' + ri 'day').  Middle Japanese is much more synthetic than modern Japanese, but still has monomorphemic words (e.g. æˆ / tuki 'moon'; cf. うã'たまはã,‰ãšã,‰ã,' / uketamafar-az-ar-am-u 'wouldn't one listen [to something someone of higher status says]').


Definitions for Stuff I Mentioned:
Morphemes, remember, are the smallest unit of meaning in language.  Words are composed of one or more morphemes.  So by some of the words I've used in this sentence and the last, we can see that English isn't an isolating language (i.e. morpheme-s, small-est, compose-d, etc.).

A case system adds a morpheme to words to indicate some grammatical relation.  Old English had cases, but for the most part, modern English doesn't.  This can still in English pronouns (like how you can't switch 'he' and 'him').  In a very simple sentence, you have a subject, verb, and object (abbreviated S, V, and O, respectively).  The order of these three varies from language to language.  For example:
[note]For full completeness sake, the meaning of the above sentences is not exactly the same.  The English verb kick and the Japanese verb ke-ru, both mean, simply, 'to hit with the foot'.  The Irish verb, ciceáil, means specifically 'to kick a ball (as in soccer)'.  The Latin verb, calcitrare means specifically 'to kick with the heel'.  Remember that the Romans wore open-toed sandals, so kicking with any other part of the foot was dangerous.[/note]
[th]English[/th][th]Japanese[/th][th]Irish[/th][th]Latin[/th]
Jean (S) kicked (V) the ball (O).
Jiin-ga (S) booru-wo (O) ke-tta. (V)
Chiceáil (V) Síne (S) an peil (O).
Ioann-a (S) calcitr-at (V) pil-am (O).
These three variations in word order, SOV (Japanese), SVO (English and Latin), and VSO (Irish) - in that order - are the most common in languages.  

Here, both English as well as (to a lesser extent) Irish have lost case marking.  Japanese and Latin still have it.  Subjects in Japanese are marked with -ga, and objects with -wo.  Latin has multiple noun classes (masculine, feminine, and neuter), as well as several structural varieties (declensions).  Here, we see subject marking in the first declension is -a, and object marking in the first declension is -am.  Case marking is obligatory in Classical Latin, while you can, in spoken Japanese, leave out case marking a lot of the time.

This...made me very happy...I don't know why...i think it is my love of Latin.  And bringing it to gaming makes me pleased.
VerkonenVreeg, The Nice.Celtricia, World of Factions

Steel Island Online gaming thread
The Collegium Arcana Online Game
Old, evil, twisted, damaged, and afflicted.  Orbis non sufficit.Thread Murderer Extraordinaire, and supposedly pragmatic...\"That is my interpretation. That the same rules designed to reduce the role of the GM and to empower the player also destroyed the autonomy to create a consistent setting. And more importantly, these rules reduce the Roleplaying component of what is supposed to be a \'Fantasy Roleplaying game\' to something else\"-Vreeg