Kemujin: the Dying World [Discussion]

Soup Nazi · September 29, 2006, 05:56:47 PM

Quote from: HyveMyndthat's a fantastic mythology/creation story. there is just one thing tha bugs me about it though. maybe i'm being a bit too PC, but Auria really gets shafted in the story. i mean she gets raped by her dad/husband, blamed for his eye almost scorching the world to cinders, and then blown up to top it all off. i'm not saying change it. please don't it's a great story. just maybe change some of the wording so that Malach doesn't seem so righteous and holy and Auria so vile and evil. it DOES rather fit with the whole middle eastern flavor i felt before though. women pretty much 2nd class citizens or property. the thought that a woman who gets raped somehow brought it on herself and therefore deserves to die and all that. i know you said that you liked "the godtears" for the meteor showers, but how about linking them to Auria? you could call them "tears of Auria" instead. just a thought.

I'm honestly quite surprised you got the impression that Malach was righteous and holy. He's a terrible, cruel, and arrogant deity (though perhaps you meant self-righteous and holier-than-thou). Auria should come across as tragic, and perhaps even somewhat justified in her role in the mythology (much like the courts today that convict abused spouses of manslaughter instead of murder-one, when they kill their husbands in self-defense). Perhaps my written portrayal of them did come across quite as I had envisioned them in my head...

As for your middle-eastern interpretation, that was spot on (sort of). The attitude is very similar, however there is not an underlying tone of discrimination against women; there is instead and underlying tone of oppression in general. Those with the power to rule retain their power by strength of arm and force of will. Malach's attitude towards the world is indicative of the general attitude of the people of Kemujin, only the strong survive, and hestiation is seen as weakness. In world that is slowly dying, people gradually become desperate, bitter, and cynical, and morality itself often falls by the wayside. Strong tyrannical rulers are all that holds the city-states together, and fear of these dictators is all that keeps the people in line.

The gods themselves however, will be modelled more after the Hindu gods; namely they are almost always imperfect, with character flaws, and areas of influence that may at first seem contrary to one another (Siva for example, was the both the god of creation and the god of destruction in the Hindu pantheon). Malach in much the same way, is a creator and a destroyer. He is more like a primal force of nature, than he is an overseer. Those who worship Malach (or El'Amin as often they call him today), seek his mercy and wish to placate his anger; they would never expect his support and guidance.

The "Tears of Auria" fits very well, within the mythological origin of the silvery rings of Kemujin. I will most likely use that as the clerical terminology for the Ioun Showers (though the scanners will stick to their scientific name for the phenomenon). I would imagine to most normal commoners (and of course those of religious bent) would relate far better to the mythological interpretation of the meteor showers, than the astrological view-point of the scanners, which was established through education and study (a luxury few people actually have in the setting).

Thanks for checking in.

-Peace-

Endless_Helix · September 30, 2006, 11:02:30 AM

Love the Mythos, but did Malach cause the rift in the shadow plane or did Auria?

Soup Nazi · October 01, 2006, 02:26:40 AM

Quote from: Endless_HelixLove the Mythos, but did Malach cause the rift in the shadow plane or did Auria?

I'm honestly not certain yet. Kemujin itself might even be in the plane of shadows (a demiplane created by Malach). When I figure that out myself, I'll be certain to post something about it with a little more substance.

-Nasty-

Tybalt · October 04, 2006, 04:09:50 AM

I really liked reading this. It would certainly make a good setting for any number of tales. I don't agree that it is too narrowly focused, on the contrary I think that you have simply created a very interesting environment in which there could be any number of social responses. City states wouldn't have to be exactly like those in Dark Sun, for instance, they could be any number of things. Consider for instance that one Elric story in which he finds himself in a desert city in which jewels are so common that they are like copper pieces and a glass of water is more precious than diamonds...and he finds himself dying in a cheap inn, desperate for a cup of water.

The other fascinating idea is the magic stones of course, the meteor showers, the mythology, all of which speaks of an alien world that immediately gives exotic impressions. The very fact that a huge red sweltering sun is in the sky immediately captures the imagination.

Soup Nazi · October 04, 2006, 02:28:47 PM

Quote from: TybaltI really liked reading this. It would certainly make a good setting for any number of tales. I don't agree that it is too narrowly focused, on the contrary I think that you have simply created a very interesting environment in which there could be any number of social responses. City states wouldn't have to be exactly like those in Dark Sun, for instance, they could be any number of things. Consider for instance that one Elric story in which he finds himself in a desert city in which jewels are so common that they are like copper pieces and a glass of water is more precious than diamonds...and he finds himself dying in a cheap inn, desperate for a cup of water.

I generally don't worry too much about a narrow focus. There is plenty of role-play/adventure opportunity in narrowly focused settings (Ravenloft for example). I do see how someone could get the impression that there isn't much here though; I simply haven't written enough material to encourage a wide range of adventure ideas yet. I took no offense to earlier statements pointing this out.

As for the city-states, many people automatically assume Dark Sun, when they see the terminology thrown about, but I don't. Elric, like you mentioned is but one example, there are also historical city-states like Ur, Babylon, Athens, Sparta, Troy, Shiba, and so forth each of which has its own feel, atmosphere, and culture. The city-states will of course share a handful of common elements, but they will be drastically different from one another in other ways.

Quote from: TybaltThe other fascinating idea is the magic stones of course, the meteor showers, the mythology, all of which speaks of an alien world that immediately gives exotic impressions. The very fact that a huge red sweltering sun is in the sky immediately captures the imagination.

Thank you. I am in the process of cleaning these up to present a more precise starting point, which will be placed in the Campaign Setting Forum. I will then edit this thread, and change it into a discussion topic to explore various options, pros and cons, and potential directions of the setting. Hopefully by this weekend this will start to look more like the beginning of setting, rather than just a collection of interesting ideas (as I currently perceive it).

-Peace-

Epic Meepo · October 05, 2006, 04:44:34 PM

About the campaign setting in general:

How does the mythology in the main thread relate to the mythology present in this discussion thread? Are the stories of the moon goddess and her betrayal meant to compliment the stories about the battle between Malach and the Consumption? As it is, the main thread seems to be playing down the role of the moon goddess, though I guess it doesn't contradict anything, so her story may still be true.

I've also noticed that there are several pararaphs worth of hype about rugged terrain, but the main focus of the world - political strife - only gets mentioned in passing. I would recommend reversing the emphasis, as in something like the following: [One-or-two-sentence description of harsh terrain], and that devastation forces the survivors to seek shelter in crowded city-states. [Several-paragraph description of living conditions in city-states and the ensuing conflicts between various factions.]

Because the dying world trope is a popular one, you could probably get by fine without relying on so vivid and lengthy a description of the terrain right at the outset. A more detailed description of the terrain could then wait for a geography section later in the world's description, freeing up the introductory text to do a better job of setting the real tone by hyping political intrigue.

@nastynate specifically:

On an amusing side note, you may notice bits and pieces of my own post-apocalyptic campaign world scattered about in old threads. True to form, my dying world is almost the exact opposite of yours. I'm starting to think you might be my goatee-having evil twin from a mirror universe. :) :)

Soup Nazi · October 05, 2006, 08:18:29 PM

QuoteHow does the mythology in the main thread relate to the mythology present in this discussion thread? Are the stories of the moon goddess and her betrayal meant to compliment the stories about the battle between Malach and the Consumption? As it is, the main thread seems to be playing down the role of the moon goddess, though I guess it doesn't contradict anything, so her story may still be true.

I think there will end up being several points of emphasis (mythologically speaking) as I get things organized. I'm not yet certain if I want the moon goddess to be a prominent figure in the beliefs of the prophets (which is the perspective from which the main thread tale is told. I will however, feature her more in the beliefs of the Pilgrims (to whom she is the central figure of worship). I know as things are (in their current form) haphazardly thrown together, there is a bit of confusion; give me a little more time to put the puzzle pieces together. I'm working on it.

QuoteI've also noticed that there are several pararaphs worth of hype about rugged terrain, but the main focus of the world - political strife - only gets mentioned in passing. I would recommend reversing the emphasis, as in something like the following: [One-or-two-sentence description of harsh terrain], and that devastation forces the survivors to seek shelter in crowded city-states. [Several-paragraph description of living conditions in city-states and the ensuing conflicts between various factions.]

Yeah, but the political factions require a world to place them in, and my physical description of the terrain helps me visualize things better. There will be far more on politics and religion as I work on this. I just posted what I had so far. No need to reverse the emphasis yet. I simply haven't written the other half yet. I will most likely write up the city-states as if they are entire nations, with as much attention to detail as I have used in the past.

QuoteBecause the dying world trope is a popular one, you could probably get by fine without relying on so vivid and lengthy a description of the terrain right at the outset. A more detailed description of the terrain could then wait for a geography section later in the world's description, freeing up the introductory text to do a better job of setting the real tone by hyping political intrigue.

This is wise advice. I should consult with you more often. I wish my ideas came in logical order so that things composed themselves naturally as well. I need structure, flavor, and tone that puts emphasis on the direction I want to go in (you hit that on the head). But then I get terrain images in my head, some mythology concepts, an interesting piece of magical machinery, jot them down, and you have this thread. Think of this as brainstorming. Perhaps posted prematurely, but this is the best time to get input (when I'm not sure about everything already).

QuoteOn an amusing side note, you may notice bits and pieces of my own post-apocalyptic campaign world scattered about in old threads. True to form, my dying world is almost the exact opposite of yours. I'm starting to think you might be my goatee-having evil twin from a mirror universe.

Call me Flexo!

-Peace and Love-

Epic Meepo · October 06, 2006, 12:36:48 AM

Cool. If this is just the brainstorming, I can't wait to see what it'll look like as stuff actually starts getting put together.

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Kemujin: the Dying World [Discussion]

Soup Nazi

Endless_Helix

Soup Nazi

Tybalt

Soup Nazi

Epic Meepo

Soup Nazi

Epic Meepo