Discussion: The World

Numinous · April 01, 2006, 05:12:20 PM

maybe that's something important to work out, how old does everyone think the bad-as empire is?

I was thinking it was old enough to have decayed into a small country, which then went out and started rebuilding an empire because it had an inferiority complex. not sure how old that is, but that's how I saw it.

brainface · April 01, 2006, 06:11:38 PM

how i saw:
1.big empire
2.decay inhto citystates
3. resurgence, BFG using traditions of old empire

daggerhart · April 01, 2006, 06:25:42 PM

from what history i know, normally a specific warlord decides to re-take ancient empires.

perhaps 100+ yrs ago, 'Tim, the Great' reunited like, 5 of the city-states politically, then started war with the others (since it was significantly larger than the others).

'Tim, the Great' was the first man to kill a totem god.

i dunno.

Numinous · April 01, 2006, 06:32:14 PM

The first man to kill a totem god... now that is a place to start... That could explain what started the wars, the increasing insecurity od the city-states as they realize their gods are mortal, etc.

Túrin · April 18, 2006, 07:28:34 AM

So I think it is time that we get a map for this setting. Anyone want to propose any alternatives to the ideas Ishy posted? Maybe Ishy wants to post more of them? I think we'll be wanting to vote on a map for the world soon...
Túrin

Ishmayl-Retired · April 18, 2006, 06:03:07 PM

well, here's the thing... to be quite frank, I think I can hand-draw maps that would better suit our purposes. I mean, they won't be as fancy-schmancy, but they'll be more cohesive for the ideas we already have, and then other ideas can be planned around the geography if we pick one. I think planning the world around a map - as opposed to planning a map around a world - is the wiser way to proceed from this point.

Túrin · April 18, 2006, 07:09:41 PM

Though I would normally favour the other way around, I think in a community project it will help many people to have a visual idea of the world. So are you willing to post one or more proposed maps (handdrawn or otherwise as you prefer)?

Ishmayl-Retired · April 18, 2006, 08:45:41 PM

sure, I'll work on that for the next couple days and get a few ideas up by the weekend.

fw190a8 · May 30, 2006, 11:07:04 PM

I have a few ideas to add to this thread. I hope it's still alive, because I notice there hasn't been any activity in quite some time here.

I notice that a few people have been talking about map A so here is my input.

The eastern continent
I think the large continent on the right side should be moved away from the main one, depending on the population:
Densely populated: This shouldn't need moving very much but obviously if it's populated at all, it will probably be populated all over, unless there is some other reason for a concentrated population (mostly desert or tundra, for example).
Sparsely populated: This would probably be easiest and would make sense if the continent was shifted east far enough so that travel is difficult, but not impossible. People would only travel here if they had nothing to lose (wanting to begin a new life) or if there were significant rewards to be had (there is a rich, untapped source of precious mineral).
No population: This is probably easiest because it's less work. Nobody has settled here because the continent has not yet been discovered or there is simply no means of getting there. It would probably need moving a good distance to the east.

The northern bit
Ishmayl's large colourful map makes sense, but only if the area north of 'D' is water or some other inhospitable environment. It would perhaps be easiest to change everything north and west of 'D' to water, although another alternative is to just separate 'D' and the other area with a body of water.

World scale
If you start messing around with the size of the globe compared to the Earth and you're using 'real' physics, gravity becomes an issue. If you use a globe the size of the Earth, according to Ishmayl's colourful map, region 'A' would be about 10,000km (6,250 miles) north to south and this is about 2.5 times the distance from Los Angeles to New York. If you halve the circumference of the globe, it becomes about 5,000km (3,125 miles) from north to south of region 'A' but this has the effect of reducing the gravity on the surface to 1/8 of the Earth's (these are really rough calculations). A few work-arounds:
Ignore it totally and continue as normal. Is it important that players encounter a world where all the laws of physics are obeyed to the letter? Does this mean that all magic needs a base in physics too? Has the concept of gravity even been introduced?
Change the density of the planet so that even though it has 8 times less volume (or whatever figure is decided upon to make the desired world size), it has 8 times the density so the mass and the gravity are unchanged.
There is no globe and the world is flat, waterfalls to endless oblivion at the edges, or some Pratchett reference involving elephants and turtles that everybody thinks is really witty until they realise it's been referenced about a zillion times already.

Civilization 4
Assuming map A above isn't set in stone yet, this game has a good (albeit tile-based) random world generator, the strength here being that as well as generating land shapes, it also generates terrain types based on climate and other features, so you automatically get mountains, deserts, jungles and resources like iron ore. The other advantage is that it is pretty customizable in terms of whether the world should be made of continents or archipelagoes, whether its climate should be wet or arid, etc. I would not advocate the use of a map that the game generates though; I'd still recommend some cartography based on its generated world. It doesn't even have to be Civilization 4; Civilization 3 and even 2 have perfectly good random world generators, although 4 is the one I own.

Ishmayl-Retired · May 30, 2006, 11:14:26 PM

I wish every new user started with such a productive post.

Welcome aboard, fw190a8. This project has fallen by the wayside, but that doesn't mean it can't be picked up again. More than anything, we just need people (such as yourself) who will actually talk about it and participate in it.

fw190a8 · May 31, 2006, 02:36:29 AM

Thanks for the compliment Ishmayl! I did notice more recent activity in The Aniga Project thread and considering I'm new, I think I'll divert my attention over there. :afro:

SDragon · June 01, 2006, 11:06:32 PM

question:

are there any alternate explainations for the ring? if we go strictly by real-world physics, then the world MUST be several times the size of earth in order to have enough gravity to hold a ring. this, of course, brings up the obvious problems of weight and distance, as well as possibley even more issues that arent so apparent...

given that this is a fantasy world, i assume the possibility of coming up with alternate solutions. assuming we can come up with alternate explainations for the rings, should we? if we do, what are they?

Xathan · June 01, 2006, 11:34:12 PM

You know what, I don't think we ever figured that out. I don't think an explaination is needed, any more than explaining a flat world is. The rings exist because they exist. Still, having a solution of some sort would be good. Two ideas that pop into my mind: The world magical field holds the rings in place, instead of gravity, or the particles that make up the rings are effected by gravity differently due to their magical nature.

SDragon · June 04, 2006, 01:36:17 PM

no, im sure no explaination is needed, especially considering it might not even have any practical impact on any game in this world. that said, the questions 'who', 'what', and 'where' are the easiest, but as luminous crayon has shown, the questions 'how' and 'why' play a large part in the realism of the world.

other optional explainations for the rings:

its a demiplane, or even a completely different plane, visible from ours.
its an illusion, but so convincing of one that everybody thinks its real.
its the physical home to the gods. on par with olympus, or the firmament (mentioned early in the book of genesis).

i dont want to detract from the actual geography of the world, so maybe the ring should have its own thread?

edit- also, if all else fails, we can fall back on the world being larger, and then deal with the problems of gravity and distance when those come up.

Xeviat · June 14, 2006, 03:44:24 PM

I believe there is still some will on these boards to get this project going. I think the best thing to get the ball moving on this isn't the direction we have been going. Rather, I believe just a few more broad details need to be decided on and put into stone, and then someone needs to start a campaign.

I would, but my current project will be playtesting my MP system. I'd have the playtest take place in our world, but because of the bland nature of the playtest, I don't think it would really contribute to the world's creation.

So, who are the people most familiar with the setting? I think a group councel should be formed to put the final decision on important things such as:

If I were to run a campaign without these questions answered, I would be tempted to shape things too much in a direction I would like for the setting, rather than what has already been decided. I'm out of the loop, so I suggest a key thread be made, if one hasn't already, of the information that has been formalized.

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Discussion: The World

Numinous

brainface

daggerhart

Numinous

Túrin

Ishmayl-Retired

Túrin

Ishmayl-Retired

fw190a8

Ishmayl-Retired

fw190a8

SDragon

Xathan

SDragon

Xeviat