The Campaign Builder's Guild

HARP (High Adventure Role Playing)

I think some of you have heard how I like a little game from Iron Crown Enterprises or I.C.E. (the guys that make Rolemaster, and other similar games).  All of the rules come in 1 book (Like having the PHB, MM, and DMG in one book).  HARP Revised is the current rendition of the game, but it is very similar to the 1st edition of the game.

For more info, and to purchase the rules you can go here:
http://www.harphq.com/

For the I.C.E. forum (where the designers of the game take the time out to answer questions, and are really cool guys) go here:
http://www.ironcrown.com/ICEforums/index.php

For those that played Rolemaster, it has some influences from that game, but it is a departure from many aspects of it being heavily influenced by D&D and simpler.  What I like about the guys at I.C.E. is there are MANY variant "official" rules that they have published.  I think the game has 4 or more optional combat systems depending on how deadly you want your combats, or how involved you want them to be, or how gritty you want them to be.  There is the official combat system in the book, Hack & Slash PDF, one in the Martial Law book that is a bit more complicated, and several other ones given out in their semi-annual HARPer's Bazaar $2 PDFs.

It is a D100 skill game that is close to being almost classless.  Although there is an option for making it a D20 game (I love the official house rules these guys put out).  Those who have played D&D will wonder at how the races and the professional abilities are very compact and aren't that involved at all.  Your character is mainly determined by the skills that you choose and how many ranks you put in those skills.  Races give you stat bonuses, save bonuses, starting hit points and power points for magic.  They also have 3 abilities (like feats or in this game Talents).  That's it.

All of the skills are broken down into categories, and the main thing that professions do is tell you which categories of skills are cheaper to purchase.  Much like D&D's class skills and non class skills but they are in categories instead.

Talents are much like Feats, except they have a DP (development Point) Cost.  Everything in the game has a cost in DPs from putting ranks in favored and non favored skills, buying Talents, raising stats, and buying Fate Points (like luck points in other systems).

The game gives out DPs based on your stats, but yet again there is an official house rule that gives out 40 (+1 per level) DPs per level called "Flat 40", which I like a lot as it is more fair for each player.

Another thing that D&D players will notice when making a character is that the only restriction to purchasing Talents, Skills, Fate points etc, is how many points you have to spend.  THERE ARE NO RESTRICTIONS!  So, if you want to blow all of your points buying Talents (like feats) then you can.  Sure you will suffer in other things and not be good at them, but you will have a character with lots of special abilities.

Instead of Saving Throws being given out per level, they are a skill you need to put ranks into.  They are called Resistance Rolls in HARP.  So if you want to neglect putting ranks into these 3 skills, you will be a walking target for calamity, but it is your choice, which I think is really cool and flexible.  You don't HAVE to have good saves if you don't want to.

Hit Points (called Endurance Hits, or Endurance Points) are also only given out depending on what race you chose, plus the Endurance Skill.  SO if you want to have a character with lots of Endurance Points you can max out the skill every level.

Power Points are also done in a similar fashion as the Endurance Points.  The more ranks in the skill the more Power Points you have.

So some of the above are a few of what I like about the game.  I must admit that I've imported my own initiative system for awhile to one more like D&D, and recently I am going to use a card initiative not tied to stats (just flip and see who goes first).  But I've always house ruled games.  HARP seems to be the first company that I've seen that supports and encourages house rules, and gives you plenty of options for just about everything in the system.

The Magic System is really darn cool in my opinion.  There are no levels of spells, but rather the amount of power points you can sink into a spell is determined by the rank in that spell skill.  Every spell is its own skill (which balances mages out with non magical professions as they have to spend more ranks to get more spells).  Each spell has optional bonuses if you spend more Power Points when casting it.  Another thing that I sometimes ignore (but some might like) is that spells with a lot of Power Points in them take longer to cast, so they can be interrupted by fighters and such mid-casting.

There is also a nice line of books that add optional races, professions, talents, spells, and magic items if you want to add onto to the base book.

And they also have a rules-lite version of HARP called HARPLite that can be downloaded for free to see if you like the game first (which I think is really cool).  It is on the HARP Vault page that has lot of other free downloads as well.

HARP Vault
http://www.harphq.com/vault.htm

They are also working on a Sci-Fi game called HARP Sci-fi for those that like space and such.

So for me HARP is my "upgrade" from D&D 3.5, as I'm done with WOTC. :P

I actually bought the HARP book way back in the days when I was searching for an alternative to D&D.  I like the customizing aspect of buying your skills and Talents, but when I actually got the book I regretted it: the task resolution requires a chart, healing resolution requires a chart, combat requires a chart'¦'¦'¦too many charts.  Then there are other issues: combat seems to have too many steps, it contains some maneuvers I left D&D because of ("Disengage from Melee" is a too much like "Attack of Opportunity" for me), I think piecemeal armor just adds too much complexity'¦'¦'¦'¦'¦

In short I see HARP as only upgrading character creation, and actually being worse than D&D in other areas, particularly combat.

I would like to note that I did not say this to be mean or to try to imply that anyone who likes HARP is wrong.  I just felt that since I made a mistake in evaluating whether I should purchase it I wanted to warn others.

HARP has lot of optional rules to make it what you want in a RPG.  They support house rules, and have many optional combat systems, and other optional ways of dealing with many parts of the game.

Healing when using spells, is easy and without a chart.  I guess you mean natural healing, which I've never used because of the Minor and Major healing spells.

The combat options are more of the Crunchy I was talking about.  It would be fairly easy to not use most of them.  HARP fully supports the GM's right to say Piss Off to the rules.  I've tended more towards rules-lite games lately, but for a crunchy game I really like HARP.

I like the charts with vivid realistic descriptions of damage, bleeding, stuns, negatives to hit from pain, it's more realistic and gritty.  But I know some people like more generic ways of damage, as just Endurance Points/Hit Points.  I'm not knocking that if that's your style, but for me, I like the tables for damage.

Disengage from Melee is there, but I've never seen anyone use it or care about it.  Again, as a GM, just ignore it.  I think HARP put the authority back in the GM's corner, where D&D was left to the vultures that are rules lawyers, hehe.  GM's can where the pants in the party, hehe.

I use my own initiative system, and simplified combat to just the 5 or 6 main categories of weapon skills.  Again, make it what you want with a few minor changes.  They love when players do that.  They are very helpful over on the I.C.E. forums, and offer many suggestions for any way to change the game to suit your needs.

A lot of your problems with the system, can be cured with many of the "optional house rules" that I.C.E. has put out.

There is a combat system without a chart, using Life Points.

I prefer only letting my players using full sets of armor, I don't like the piecemeal approach to armor either.  

I personally think, if you spend the time looking at it again, and modifying it with the optional rules they came up with, or optional house rules you come up with (for the problems you saw with it) that it would at least be better than D&D... (I won't lie, you saying it was worse than D&D about killed me, hehe.  I'm so burned out on that darn game).

No offense, but I'm a HARP cheer leader, I can't lie.  :)

There is a D20 (instead of D100) optional download in the Web Specials page off of the HARP Vault.  Basically you divide your skill totals by 5, so there is less math.  I plan on using that D20 version for my next campaign.  Let's face it, a lot of us suck at math, hehe.

I also love that it doesn't produce clones.  Two Dwarf Fighters can be VERY different from each other because of their choices in flexible character creation and choice in skills and ranks in those skills.

Okay, I'll stop beating a dead horse.  :)

Like I said I just wanted to make sure that people had a full impression of it.

Plus if I actually house-ruled it eventually I might as well move on to another system.  There are good point-buy systems out there that do what I like about HARP without the things I don't.

Quotetask resolution requires a chart

Actually I was thinking about this as well, most skills are all-or-nothing skills that need a 100 total to succeed for a Medium maneuver.  Harp gives out bonuses for tasks that are easier or harder in the 20 point range.  So much like D&D's DCs you could also think of it as 140 very hard, 120 hard, 100 Medium, 80 Easy, 60 very easy, etc.  For spell rolls you need the chart however, because sometimes the spell's effect can be doubled with a high roll.

There are certain times when a percentage result is needed for extended actions, and that is when the Percentage Column takes place.

For skill vs skill, one player rolls in the RR column, and the other player has to beat the number listed in the column.

So I guess you do use charts, but only rarely, as most are all-or-nothing skill rolls.

Well, it sounds like your mind is made up.  But it was fun to try to convince you. ;)

I'm still an avid HARP fan.  The guys are super cool on the forum as well.  It's cool to be able to talk to the designer of the game fairly frequently.  Customer Service there is top notch as well.  I've bought a lot of their products on PDF, as they are very reasonably priced compared to the actual books.

Quote from: samwise7Well, it sounds like your mind is made up.  But it was fun to try to convince you. ;)

Maybe I should convince you to switch to my favorite system.

MWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!  :demon:

Hehe.

QuoteMaybe I should convince you to switch to my favorite system.

What is your favorite system?  You can't leave me stranded like that... :)

I also use a rules-lite houseruled version of the old White Wolf D10 dice pool engine for a fantasy game.  I think the rules are 3 pages long.  :)

I also like Barbarians of Lemuria for a nice lite sword and sorcery action.  It uses 2D6 plus stat and profession (9 is standard success).  Oh, and it's free. :)
www.geocities.com/barbariansoflemuria/

So right now, the only company that is getting any money from me is I.C.E. or companies that produce settings for HARP.

There are LOTS of cool rules lite free RPGs on the net.

The only system I can really seem to stand right now is Mutants&Masterminds.  It's point-based, but unlike other point-based systems it uses d20's linear scale in a way that actually allows for good power balance between characters.  While character creation takes work the number of options in play is dependent upon the character build (and the fact that they eliminated such things as Attacks of Opportunity), so a player can have as complex or simple a character as they want.

I have various problems when choosing a system:
'"Rewarding a bunch of numbers over options.  I've not all that interesting in a +3 to Jump, but I'd be happy to grab that Jump Attack feat.  And I'd like it if my Jump skill was still useful afterwards.
'"Unneeded management complexity.  e.g. Vancian casting.
'"Unneeded option complexity.  I know I said I like options, but I don't need you to create 6 different "boost ability score" spells.
'"Unneeded rules-while-playing complexity.  Like I said that HARP has too many charts.
'"At least some balance built-in to the system.  I'm not an experienced GM, I need to system to do work for me.
'"There's no challenge if I can't make a weird character.  Yeah, sometimes weird characters are just bad ideas, but occasionally they mean something deep.  When that happens I'd like a system that can mechanically support them.

I have a friend that likes that game I think.  I heard it was a D20 spin-off game.

It's good you have a RPG that works for you.  In the end that's all that matters.

I like to make weird characters as well.  :)  I like to take characters that sometimes have more negatives than positives, as it makes roleplaying him much more fun.  I played a Dwarf with one arm, just because I thought it would be fun.  It was.

Thanks for posting about HARP.I have been looking at it for some time and have downloaded HARP lite and for the most part liked what I saw, but I don't have a fondness for the charts, just like in the old Role-master game. I think I might look into some D20 games since I haven't played an RPG in a while.  

Both of you have said that charts are bad, I like the charts personally, but to each his own.

For combat, I noticed (while preparing for my new HARP campaign) that the Life Points Combat Option is right in the HARP book.  Instead of rolling for combat and looking at a chart, there are no charts involved.  It is a less gritty system with only numbers and no descriptions.

I guess for me, being able to make exactly the kind of character I want to make shines very brightly.  I like making unique characters and HARP seems like a very good system for making them.  

I like the graphic violent combat descriptions in the combat charts.  I guess I'm a chart/table fan then, hehe.  :)

QuoteFor combat, I noticed (while preparing for my new HARP campaign) that the Life Points Combat Option is right in the HARP book. Instead of rolling for combat and looking at a chart, there are no charts involved. It is a less gritty system with only numbers and no descriptions.

I guess for me, being able to make exactly the kind of character I want to make shines very brightly. I like making unique characters and HARP seems like a very good system for making them.

I like the graphic violent combat descriptions in the combat charts. I guess I'm a chart/table fan then, hehe.

This might be an interesting option, I don't remember seeing the Life Points option in the lite version.  I'll read over it again later to see if its in there.  The combat critical charts are kind of cool, I've been in games where the GM adapted them for use in other games. So perhaps I may yet be convinced to add HARP to my collection.

HARPLite doesn't have everything in it (since it's free).  I doubt the Life Points option is in there.  You can buy a PDF of the HARP book, and it is reasonably priced.  :)

Basically the Life Point system uses Endurance Hits like normal (Hit Points) and also Life Points (that take the place of all the bleeding, stuns, dying in x rounds, negatives to skills etc, but they are very much like Hit Points as well).

It looks like you would have a higher amount of Endurance Hits, than Life Points.  When you loose all of your Life Points you instantly die, but you loose them less frequently if that makes sense.

You have Life Points equal to your Constitution Bonus plus the number of RANKS (not bonus) in your Endurance Hits skill.  So if you had a +5 Co bonus, and had 12 ranks in Endurance, you would have 17 Life Points (and a lot more Endurance Hits as normal using the skill).

You look at no tables but instead you make your attack normally, subtracting the DB (Defense Bonus) of your target.  When you get your result with weapon sizes factored in, you round the result to the nearest multiple of 5.

Every 5 points above zero results in 2 points of Endurance Hit Damage done to the target.  Every 10 points above zero results in 1 point of damage to Life Points (so you loose them less frequently, but you also have less of them).  Both types of damage are applied at the same time.

That's a summary, there is also a section in the back of the book in the GM chapters, that say how you have to modify some of the healing spells with using Life Points.

I was thinking though, if you only want something like D&D with only one set of Hit Points (Endurance Hit Skill as normal) you can scrap the Life Points idea, and use just Endurance Hits rule of loosing 2 hits for every 5 points above zero.

Or if you are really inspired, you could make your own combat system. :)