The Campaign Builder's Guild

For sure there will be a somewhat Roman-inspired people in my Savage Age. Although it'll be more akin to the Rome by the Bosporus than the Rome in Italia :)

Quote from: EvilElitestFor that matter, what about Mongolians? They are so awsome but never get there own setting

I have a weird obsession with horse-riding nomads, and nearly every setting (or piece of a setting) I've created has incorporated that in some respect.  I went a bit further in one particular setting and made a great centaur empire based on the Magyars; if I did something like that again I'd probably try and make it less cliche, but the concept still appeals to me.

As long as we're going with alternate historical settings, I'd like to see a high medieval setting based on the premise that the Great Khan Ogedei didn't die in 1241 and the Golden Horde under Batu Khan proceeded to conquer all of Europe.  Maybe the British Isles would be the last holdouts, like Japan in the east.  You could have a "Westernized" Mongol elite rather like a European version of Yuan dynasty China (Holy Roman Khan?).

Quote from: Polycarp!As long as we're going with alternate historical settings, I'd like to see a high medieval setting based on the premise that the Great Khan Ogedei didn't die in 1241 and the Golden Horde under Batu Khan proceeded to conquer all of Europe.  Maybe the British Isles would be the last holdouts, like Japan in the east.  You could have a "Westernized" Mongol elite rather like a European version of Yuan dynasty China (Holy Roman Khan?).

I won't lie, thank god for Russia! And that's the only time you'll ever see me say that! :)

The problem with allowing the Mongols to conquer Europe is that those that would have conquered it most likely would have been Muslim (or converted soon after). I just don't see Christianity appealing to the Mongols, especially after all the mud they dragged the Nestorians through. One could hold out hope & believe that the Mongols, like the Vikings, tended to adopt the native religion to placate the peasentry and thus make the Mongol rule feel more plaetable. But on the whole I think islam is just more appealing to the mentality of the Mongols if for no other reason than the fact that Christianity tended to be more of a philisophical religion with much debate over important but ultimately minute pieces of doctrine. Islam has the same problems, I am sure, but it presents itself in a way that could be much more forgiving for the less educated/interested. Which is not to deride islam but lambast Christianity for its consistant history of being too complicated.

It would be interesting to run a campaign of England being the last hold out of western independence, however I doubt the Kamakazei would save her :(  Perhaps at that time myths of the 'promised lands' that lie to the west would spring up and there would be an exodus to iceland, Greenland and (eventually) the Americas... Could you imagine a mass exodus of Europeans sailing west and colonizing the new world... Would the Mongols follow, how would the Native Amiericans react? Ooo, too many cool posabilities... :)

Honestly, I wouldn't mind seeing a fantasy setting that focuses on the lands ventured to and fro by the Hsiung-Nu/Huns. The setting would be less of a 'We own this land, here be the details' and more of a 'well we traveled through this land, raped and pillaged, then moved on and here's what the scolors remember of those lands.' Essentially you'd be describing and detailing these neighboring cultural zones who are only connected by way of being neighbors and suffering the ills of the 'horse riding barbarians.'  

The Mongols seemed to drop their native religion (or any religion they had currently) like a bad habit as soon as it became politically convenient to do so.  The Byzantines and their Patriarchs never really crafted a theory of "righteous warfare," but this was still the age of the Crusades among the Catholics, and had Batu Khan ended up with a largely Catholic domain I don't doubt it would have been a perfect fit both politically and theologically.  The Ilkhanate only went Muslim some time after its conquests, understanding that it was going to be difficult to rule over the Islamic heartlands as Buddhists.  I don't think it's too presumptuous to say that they almost certainly would have gone the Magyar route and become good Christians (well, maybe not good) in under a century, and the Magyars demonstrate that once you did that it wasn't terribly hard to be accepted as legitimate.

You're right about the English Channel though, not many tropical storms through there.  The Commonwealth of Iceland might be a better safe haven.

Sure, there's plenty that's a bit improbable about the whole premise, but it's still fun to contemplate a Borjigid Dynast ruling Europe with an iron fist (and plenty of adopted local culture).

In general, I agree that I'd like to see less "modern nation state with fixed borders" and more "people on the move" in campaigns, whether historical or fantasy.  This strict Westphalian state stuff always hits me as anachronistic in "dark ages/gritty medieval" settings.

Quote from: Elemental_ElfThe problem with allowing the Mongols to conquer Europe is that those that would have conquered it most likely would have been Muslim (or converted soon after). I just don't see Christianity appealing to the Mongols, especially after all the mud they dragged the Nestorians through. One could hold out hope & believe that the Mongols, like the Vikings, tended to adopt the native religion to placate the peasentry and thus make the Mongol rule feel more plaetable. But on the whole I think islam is just more appealing to the mentality of the Mongols if for no other reason than the fact that Christianity tended to be more of a philisophical religion with much debate over important but ultimately minute pieces of doctrine. Islam has the same problems, I am sure, but it presents itself in a way that could be much more forgiving for the less educated/interested. Which is not to deride islam but lambast Christianity for its consistant history of being too complicated.

Lolwut.

Islam probably has a stronger philosophical tradition than Christianity.  In fact, European philosophy after the fall of the Roman Empire owes a great deal (if not everything) to Islamic philosophy; indeed, the works of Aristotle (and others) would have been all but forgotten without Muslim philosophers.  I would argue that Islam is much more philosophical than people give it credit for, and at least as complicated as Christianity.

Also, most Mongols and Huns (as well as other Turkic and Mongolian peoples), including ÄŒinggis Qaγan, followed Tengriism, a monotheistic variant of more ancient animistic religions of the various Altaic peoples.  ÄŒinggis himself was fairly tolerant of religions, and supposedly talked with Christian, Muslim, and Taoist scholars.  I don't really see Mongols leaning one way or the other in terms of religion.

And where are you getting this stuff about the Mongols not being on good terms with the Assyrian Church?  I've never heard anything like that.

Quote from: Polycarp!I have a weird obsession with horse-riding nomads.

1. Get a horse
2. Ride it around in front of Polycarp
3. ???
4. PROFIT!

Quote from: Polycarp!I have a weird obsession with horse-riding nomads.

While that's usually a logical progression I can't help but agree with, I'm gonna have to take a step back here and ask you if you're really sure you'd wanna do that... :p

Quote from: Nomadic1. Get a horse
2. Ride it around in front of Polycarp
3. ???
4. PROFIT!

But in order to be a horse riding nomad, you're going to have to become homeless first.  Ride around in front of me waving your foreclosure notice and then you've got my attention.

Wouldn't you need a tribe to travel with? I mean with out a tribe, you're more just a dude on a horse... I'll join your tribe, if there's profit in the venture for all of us! Maybe we can carve a little piece of Hungary out for ourselves! :)

Quote from: Polycarp!

Quote from: Nomadic1. Get a horse
2. Ride it around in front of Polycarp
3. ???
4. PROFIT!

But in order to be a horse riding nomad, you're going to have to become homeless first.  Ride around in front of me waving your foreclosure notice and then you've got my attention.

... You do realize who you're quiting, right? Besides, I may be mistaken, but I don't think nomads technically have to be homeless. Granted, the modern concepts of land property are quite a bit different then they used to be in many parts of the world (EG, now, Land Property concepts actually exist), so there might be some difficulties finding the precise difference between "nomad" and "wandering hobo".


Elitest, I like your explanation of the difference between Huns and Mongols. I knew there were/i] a difference, but aside from physical locations, I didn't know what those differences were. My favorite part of your explanation?

Quote from: EvilElitest...in a kinda sorta not really sort of way.

Quote from: Halfling Fritos... You do realize who you're quiting, right?

I'm going to need more corroborating evidence than a screen name - real nomadism must be established.  I'm not actually a fish, you know.

Quote from: Halfling Fritos... You do realize who you're quiting, right?

I'm going to need more corroborating evidence than a screen name - real nomadism must be established.  I'm not actually a fish, you know.[/quote]
I actually know and have worked with a nomad (from Tibet) here at the Linguistics Department at University of Hawaii.  She has an apartment down in Waikiki, IIRC.  Granted, she did spend most of her childhood on the steppe...

Steerpike- Well thats right, but Asia is a very very big place.  They are were decedent from more central asia, IE russia, Kasastan those sort of areas, rather than far asia.  

Polycarp- Yes, horse riding nomatics are one of histories coolest groups, having very little to offer in terms of building  civilizations, but much to offer in terms of destroying them.  the western north american tribes are quite cool as well.  I don't think the Mongolian empire is cliche actually because we don't often see that very much in modern day fiction sadly.  That being said, The idea of the eastern empire would be interesting.  The mongolians problem was they couldn't hold that massive colossi of an empire, hence why they broke it into 4 parts, so i'm interested in what would have happened.  I imagine they would dominate Eastern Europe, but hte massive amount of small states in Germany might slow them down.  If that doesn't work, Britian might be save, but will be cut off (or be as you said as second japan).  I think western Europe wouldn't be his focus, the larger kingdoms of the Middle East and north africa would be more interesting to him, as they were more advanced at the time

Elemental elf
1) Russia helped during WWII........and Napoleon (damnit)
2) kamikaze most likely wouldn't work, but the mongolians were horrible sailers, and the Alantics were much rougher seas
3) Hmmmmm, yeah hte Mongolians were like the Romans, they just kinda stole what ever they could find in terms of religion.  But Islam is a massively complex religion, i mean in some ways more so than Christianity, because it was never centralized the way Catholisim was (and thats saying a lot).  Through the badass Mongolians riders might be attracted to the badass Isamic riders


Fritos-Thanks, i try


does anybody have any links to the settings the've made...
from
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Beejazz-You have no idea how cool i find that.  Leo X was my least favorite pope, and yet the most amusing in history (he had naked boys come out of one of his birthday cakes), and that is such a cool idea for a history location.  Thanks you very much for that.

Ghostman- The great thing about Rome is because it is so old, there are so many different eras you can do

Quote from: Polycarp!

Quote from: Halfling Fritos... You do realize who you're quiting, right?

I'm going to need more corroborating evidence than a screen name - real nomadism must be established.  I'm not actually a fish, you know.

Does the fact that the race I best relate with is the Kender satisfy you (or does that just scare you)? Oh and try as you might babe, you just can't quit me. Nobody can. :P

I think Rome isn't too represented because everyone expects it to be.  Authors want to challenge expectations and drive away from the expected, to try and stick out more.

M.