Half-Orcs and the method by which they are conceived

Elemental_Elf · February 06, 2009, 04:42:08 AM

DISCLAIMER: Before this thread begins, I just wanted to say that I do not condone Rape in any way and think of it as a horrible, horrible act that should not be forced on any one for any reason.

I was wondering why so many people despise the concept of Half-Orcs being born from the forced union of an Orc and a Human. Granted it is a 'heavy' topic but given the context of what fantasy games encourage PCs to do (kill sentient beings and get a reward) is it really that 'heavy' of a concept? We're talking about worlds (and game systems) which reward players for murder, often murder on a grand scale. It upsets me that people put up their blinders to the basics tenets of the game but object to something that is far more common (historically) and reasonable (in context of course).

I'm not one to say Half-Orcs must always be the children of rape, there are other less 'heavy' means of conceiving the baby but, why must so many rail against this one concept to the point where even WotC is changing, nay discounting this method?

Nomadic · February 06, 2009, 05:59:14 AM

Quote from: Elemental_ElfDISCLAIMER: Before this thread begins, I just wanted to say that I do not condone Rape in any way and think of it as a horrible, horrible act that should not be forced on any one for any reason.

I was wondering why so many people despise the concept of Half-Orcs being born from the forced union of an Orc and a Human. Granted it is a 'heavy' topic but given the context of what fantasy games encourage PCs to do (kill sentient beings and get a reward) is it really that 'heavy' of a concept? We're talking about worlds (and game systems) which reward players for murder, often murder on a grand scale. It upsets me that people put up their blinders to the basics tenets of the game but object to something that is far more common (historically) and reasonable (in context of course).

I'm not one to say Half-Orcs must always be the children of rape, there are other less 'heavy' means of conceiving the baby but, why must so many rail against this one concept to the point where even WotC is changing, nay discounting this method?

I counter you by asking the question "why must orcs be these pillaging terrorizing bad guys?" However, I shall consent and answer your question as best I can. People tend to shy away from the socially taboo. Sure in a game like this that might not make sense. However, people are still a part of the real world and even while playing their character they still remain aware of that which is taboo in their culture.

Loch Belthadd · February 06, 2009, 06:38:30 AM

I fixed this problem a while ago. In my generic games there are tribes of just orcs and tribes of just humans. But the most successful tribes are the ones that banded together. With the orc's bruteness and the humans cunning and intelligence. Also in my game the barbarian tribes are much like the real life barbarians. They are semi-nomadic. They have strict hospitality laws that makes them alow friends and strangers alike to come into their tent, share their food, and spend the night. And if you break the hospitality laws you get to stick your arm into a pot of boiling water. When they go to war they kick ass and never retreat.

Loch Belthadd · February 06, 2009, 06:39:20 AM

Yes, there will be rape, but not all half-orcs are born from it.

Kindling · February 06, 2009, 07:37:59 AM

I think that while the ideas presented in the article you linked to are sound, they also seem to only apply to one setting. Surely they can't expect every GM everywhere to have the same story about hobgoblins breeding half-orcs?

I think the origin story should vary by setting. In a dark, violent setting with minor evils running rife, rape fits right in, thematically. However, if you're running a more "sparkly" fantasy setting, maybe a magical origin is more appropriate, where some power in the distant past fused humans and orcs together to create a half-caste race.

Ultimately, I think it all depends on the kind of game you're trying to run, and what's appropriate for that.

EDIT: Also, your setting idea of the mixed human/orcs barbarian tribes sound like a lot of fun, Gnomish Cheetos.

SilvercatMoonpaw · February 06, 2009, 07:38:55 AM

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/images/LiXMZNMmJmm16Q1nw7k.gif

Kindling · February 06, 2009, 07:42:22 AM

Heh, that comic also presents a good point - it is possible to have an orc with a high charisma score. They'd be rare, but they would exist. Maybe the half-orc's parent was one of those few orcs who are downright charming, and the other parent plain old fell for him/her...

Loch Belthadd · February 06, 2009, 07:54:38 AM

Quote from: KindlingHeh, that comic also presents a good point - it is possible to have an orc with a high charisma score. They'd be rare, but they would exist. Maybe the half-orc's parent was one of those few orcs who are downright charming, and the other parent plain old fell for him/her...

That could happen.

Loch Belthadd · February 06, 2009, 07:57:02 AM

Quote from: KindlingEDIT: Also, your setting idea of the mixed human/orcs barbarian tribes sound like a lot of fun, Gnomish Cheetos.

It is kinda fun/funny when the players go into the camp of the barbarians who just raided a town, and are given a warm, friendly welcome.

Ninja D! · February 06, 2009, 08:08:13 AM

Legends have often been full of violence and theft. Same goes for even religious myth.

Rape is considered different by our society. It is just like some words are considered inappropriate and offense and other words, even ones that started with such an intent, are not.

It is all about how people choose to look at things. I'd like to be the first to make the observation, in this thread, that they way people look at things like this are often not logical, sometimes not even rational.

EDIT: I was going to be the first person to reply and then my internet connection temporarily disappeared...now to catch up.

[spoiler=To E_E]On another note, I love the "Faith Manages".[/spoiler]

Ninja D! · February 06, 2009, 08:21:52 AM

Alright, it looks like all I missed other than the obvious is this: It depends on your setting. That pretty much solves it but I do understand why you are bothered by this.

SilvercatMoonpaw · February 06, 2009, 10:24:54 AM

Quote from: KindlingHeh, that comic also presents a good point - it is possible to have an orc with a high charisma score. They'd be rare, but they would exist. Maybe the half-orc's parent was one of those few orcs who are downright charming, and the other parent plain old fell for him/her...

Or maybe the human is just in to that sort of thing. Seriously.

Ghostman · February 06, 2009, 10:38:06 AM

Quote from: NomadicI counter you by asking the question "why must orcs be these pillaging terrorizing bad guys?"

Or better yet, why are the other races NOT pillaging terrorizing bad guys? Why do we never hear about an elf warband sacking a halfling village?

Quote from: SilvercatMoonpawOr maybe the human is just in to that sort of thing. Seriously.

Given some stuff I've seen on the 'net, that doesn't sound at all unplausible :ill:

SilvercatMoonpaw · February 06, 2009, 11:29:46 AM

Quote from: GhostmanGiven some stuff I've seen on the 'net, that doesn't sound at all unplausible :ill:

Given some of the people I've seen in Real Life it's totally possible.

Kindling · February 06, 2009, 11:33:44 AM

Given some of the stone cold orcish foxes I've... I mean... yes, I suppose a human could feasibly be attracted to normal, low-cha orcs.

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Half-Orcs and the method by which they are conceived

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