Dushkun Discussion Thread

[Wensleydale]

This is the Discussion Thread. The main thread can be found here.

[SilvercatMoonpaw]

The undead are not evil - they guard the living so that in death they may feed. Elves are not high and mighty - they lost whatever nation they may have once had long ago, and have lost their racial identity. Dwarves don't usually mine - their role is as traders, selling gifts throughout the land and travelling from their race's original home - the northern steppes of beyond the River Ring. Orcs are the smiths of the world, taking great delight in the spirit that they say enfuses any well-made object. Humans are a minority, a barbaric race sharing lands with the dwarves in the north. Four new races - the elitist daemons, the beast-like mana'tau, the ever-shifting or'tar and huge shamir - each fulfil their own role.

have[/i] to be evil they are just restless spirits.  I do agree that some myths about undead creatures do portray them as beings of pure melevolence, and so those undead could be evil.  But if undead are not-yet-departed spirits than it stands to reason that some of them haven't departed for a Good reason.
Elves aren't haughty, dwarves don't mine but trade, orcs are the smiths, yes!  Great recharacterization of established races.  I especially like orcs as smiths because it's just something you see strong people doing.  I look forward to seeing how you do the elves.
"Humans are in the minority, and are barbaric."   :rambo:   Smack it to them! (end rant) This is a great idea to try and focus more attention on the non-humans.

[Wensleydale]

:) Trust me, the humans are getting smacked. Most of them are slaves to the so-called daemons, the rest wander the steppes, no more cultured than your standard orc in DnD.

Racial info being typed up now.

[Endless_Helix]

I do have to say that I like Orcs as smiths. That makes a lot of sense. A lot more sense than dwarves doing all the mining and smithing. I might steal that for my orcs. The one thing that's bothering me is the humans. Why do you have them at all? Is it illustrate how evil the demons are for enslaving them? If so, why do demons have to be evil?

[Wensleydale]

I do have to say that I like Orcs as smiths. That makes a lot of sense. A lot more sense than dwarves doing all the mining and smithing. I might steal that for my orcs. The one thing that's bothering me is the humans. Why do you have them at all? Is it illustrate how evil the demons are for enslaving them? If so, why do demons have to be evil?

*shake head*

Well, they're there for two reasons. One you will realise if you read the daemon information section (see the main thread). The other is to serve as a barbarian race. Daemons aren't evil, necessarily - they just need sentient food to survive, and humans are hated by everybody, so...

[Matt Larkin (author)]

Is this a completely independent project from Kahtar, or a new section of the world?  It sounds like something brand new, but I figured I should ask.

[Wensleydale]

Brand new :)

[Matt Larkin (author)]

Daemons - Kheprer in their own tongue - are an ancient race of folk, blessed and cursed by the magic of the Elder Gods in far-off times. Since then, their race has become adaptable and changeable beyond belief, and developed its own social hierarchy and culture. Daemons hold themselves above all other creatures - their dual existence, immortality and magical nature giving them a feeling of superiority.
But now, we must explain. What are daemons, exactly?
<snip>

Your section on daemons is probably my favorite part, though I haven't gotten through all of it yet.  If this is new, does it mean you have abandonned Kahtar, or is this a secondary project?

Do you still want people to continue reading through Kahtar (there's a lot), or would you rather we look at this?

[Wensleydale]

You can still read through Kahtar, but, to tell you the truth, I'm suffering from acute writer's block over there at the moment. Thus, I'm building this for the moment. I haven't abandoned it, this is merely a... side project, although it is primary whereas for the moment Kahtar is secondary.

[Seraph]

By any accounts, though, apart from the dwarves, most races see humans as nothing more than second-class, barbarous immigrants - "Coming over here and taking our jobs".

Hee, hee!  The humans are the Mexicans of Dushkun!

The elves are a people without a racial identity or sense of unity - scattered through the many cities of Dushkun in their thousands. Although once they had a nation, a homeland, it is long gone - lost in the sands of time. Now they are wanderers, living in the cities of other races and trying to fit in. Many work for half pay, and spend their entire lives outside their jobs in meditation - dreaming, as it were.

Nice take on the elves.  Different, but it still pays tribute to the archetype of the proud, fallen race.  

no dwarf will betray his clan, although other clans are fair game

hmm. . .  sounds like my dwarves.  :D

relations between dwarf clans are a complex web of intrigue, backstabbing and competition, be it for hunting and land on the steppes or money and deals in the central lands.

Also sounds like my dwarves.  A bit.  You emphasize backstabbing and intrigue, I emphasize competition.

Of course, dwarves don't cakk themselves dwarves

Call; they donâ,¬,,¢t call themselves dwarves  :D   But still, itâ,¬,,¢s always nice to have a better name for them than dwarves (or Halflings for that matter)  Why would they refer to themselves from the viewpoint of a human or other tall race?  

[Endless_Helix]

Hey Golem, is the Daemon stat block up yet? I love all the fluff on them, and the human inclusion makes a little more sense. When I posted my first comment, I hadn't seen the races section. My only other qualm is with the elves. They sort of feel like a bit of a cop out... The connection witht the Other is awesome, but it seems kind of forced as it doesn't really give them much. Over all, I think that they would gain some tangible advantage besides immunity to sleep effects from this apparent link. Also, I'm curious, what happened to the elve homeland? I'd think that whatever happened they'd want a new one. What event was so destructive that it completely shattered the elve's unity?

[Wensleydale]

Hey Golem, is the Daemon stat block up yet? I love all the fluff on them, and the human inclusion makes a little more sense. When I posted my first comment, I hadn't seen the races section. My only other qualm is with the elves. They sort of feel like a bit of a cop out... The connection witht the Other is awesome, but it seems kind of forced as it doesn't really give them much. Over all, I think that they would gain some tangible advantage besides immunity to sleep effects from this apparent link. Also, I'm curious, what happened to the elve homeland? I'd think that whatever happened they'd want a new one. What event was so destructive that it completely shattered the elve's unity?

The event... who knows? I'm still thinking of ideas for the elves, so help me if you can ;)

As for the daemon stat block, no. It's kinda complicated - although the base race is pretty darn weak, you can customise them massively...

[Seraph]

I can see a couple different possibilities for the elves:
Every night they enter this trance-state and dream, right?
For my purposes, let us say that in this state, all elves are connected to each other.
1.) A predator of the dreamscape assaulted the minds of the elves
2.) A mental surge wiped out portions of their minds
3.) While engaged in trance, something cut them off from the dream world, leaving a portion of their minds behind.

In any case, a portion of their minds and sanity are shattered.  They have lost all sense of who and what they are.  They may even forget their own names.  They lose all sense of community.  They lose all sense of direction in life (what to do, not north and south), causing their nation to quickly fall and fade away.  Each night, they are drawn inexplicably back to the site of their disaster, the Other of their dreams.  It is not known for what purpose they must return, but they suffer horribly if they do not.  Perhaps it is their subcounscious/unconscious mission to recover that which was lost to them. . .

[CYMRO]

Overall a very good read.  

Shamir don't have much of a culture themselves, apart from their simple language and farming tradition.

Aww, come on! Don't be stingy with the culture crap! :-p

As for the Stalwart, should they not get Defensive Stance a bit earlier?

[Hibou]

Unless I'm missing something, there's something very wrong with the classes.

How do you justify the Stalwart, a class with the attack bonus, fortitude save, and bonus feats of a fighter, which also has a d12 HD and access to the Defensive Stance and Mobile Defense abilities? Sure, their skill list is different, but that's hardly a fair tradeoff when it comes to balance. Is Dushkun more high-powered than normal?