The Republic Reborn

[LD]

[ic=Private to Basile]
I understand your position and I respect it. I also understand that you have agreed to consult with me regarding Council business. I appreciate that we are two of like minds on issues before Rome. I look forward to working with you and to having you as Rome's Interior Counsel.
[/ic]

[Polycarp]

[ooc=Election of 1153]The Consular election of 1153 has ended.  The winners are Fortis Calafatus and Roberto Basile.[/ooc]

[ic=In the Senate]Despite the missteps of last autumn and the ongoing crisis between Calafatus and the Patrician, the Senate has renewed the Consulship of Fortis Calafatus and Roberto Basile for another year.  The continued string of military victories and the reconciliation of the Senate with the Pierleoni clan - however shaky that may be - clearly helped to ameliorate Rome's troubles earlier in their terms.  Fortis Calafatus is entitled to choose his portfolio, though few doubt the the current division of powers between them will continue.[/ic]

[ic=To the Roman Senate]Romans,

Our beloved father, His Holiness Eugenius III has passed on to his eternal rest, accompanied by the angels unto the Kingdom of God.

On behalf of His Holiness Anastasius IV, now Vicar of Christ and leader of the One and True Apostolic Church, I greet the Romans and express the fervent desire of His Holiness for tranquility and harmony among the faithful, particularly in the City of Saint Peter.  The Son of God is not only the King of Kings, but the Prince of Peace, and it is in pursuit of that peace that His Holiness seeks a rapprochement with the Senators of Rome.

As the officiator of the ceremonial of the Curia, I call upon the councilors of the Romans to allow the burial of the blessed Eugenius in the crypt of the Basilica of Saint Peter in the Vatican.  Let this be from the Romans a gesture of respect to the honor and piety of this holy Prince, a sign of faith and goodwill before the eyes of his rightful successor Pope Anastasius, and an act of Christian charity and humility before God and his Holy Church.

His Eminence Odone Bonecase
Cardinal-Deacon of the Basilica of Saint Giorgio in Velabro
Protodeacon of the College of Cardinals[/ic]

[ic=To the Roman Senate]Senators,

It is with great pleasure and profound humility that I am able to formally express the desire of the Consuls of Perugia, on behalf of the Commune, to accede to the Roman proposal of a defensive alliance between our two cities.

Camerarius Ildibrando Ferrante, for the Consuls of Perugia[/ic]

[ic=A Parley for Ransom]Representatives from more than a dozen minor noble families of Sabina have arrived in Rome to secure the release of their noblemen, noble scions, and men-at-arms.  In total, these families offer [2 Wealth] for their release.[/ic]

I may have more letters soon, but I need to wrap this up for now!

[Nomadic]

[ic=Speech before the senate]
Friends and Romans first I wish to offer my congratulations to our own Consuls Calafatus and Basile. Regardless of anything anyone might say none can deny that Rome has prospered under their care. We have greater stability and strength through these men and if God Almighty does so will it, we shall continue to see such gains in the years to come.

Beyond this news I also hear these tidings of the passing of Pope Eugenius III. There has been much strife recently amongst brother Christians of late. Those for Arnold and those for the Papacy have much to disagree on. Yet I say this, the one thing we can agree on is that we are all still followers of Christ and brothers in our fellowship. Let us not deny such honorable burial as Christian duty demands of us to a brother, be he great or small. I see no reason why we should not permit the proper burial of the Late Pope Eugenius III. Nor would it be ours to deny such a thing to a Christian.
[/ic]

[ic=Private letter to Consul Calafatus]
My friend, congratulations to you on your successful re-election. You have done much for the Roman people and it brings my heart joy to see you once again in a position to lend us your skill. Furthermore you do so on the eve a successful battle, truly Farfa must fear the name of Rome by this time. I think that we are in a good position to offer favorable (for us) terms to the Farfans. Certainly you have made a name for yourself and Rome has done well in its making.

There is perhaps one matter regarding this venture that I would speak to you on. I am, as you are no doubt aware, a merchant. My duties are to God and Rome, but also to the men under my care. I hear that there has been much success in the wake of the battle with Farfa and that my men did much, despite desperate odds, to aid you in turning defeat into a great victory. If you are in accord with this view of their efforts perhaps you might, if nothing else, offer from the spoils a recompense of [1 wealth] to cover their costs. I ask this as I turn now my attentions to the needs of Rome. She requires a strong market if she is to prosper and I seek investment in one part of that market. Perhaps that is something you have knowledge of. I require access to more land if my plans to boost the local wool industry are to succeed. As one of the noble persuasion perhaps you might keep an eye open for the possibility of available land for the raising of sheep.

Regardless of your thoughts on the matter I am glad to see you safe back in Rome and continuing to serve the people most excellently. May the blessing of Christ be upon you and your household. You are in the thoughts and prayers of me and my household.

Your friend and Brother in Christ,
Senator Arrigus Sismondii
[/ic]

[Elemental_Elf]

About the case. Is Calafactus actually going to present evidence or is Polycarp... Or should I just go back and read the posts and discern Calafactus' side of the story?

[Polycarp]

Llum should make an IC post for Calafatus if he has a differing view of events than Pierleone.  I wasn't intending to post for him.

[Llum]

Woops, totally missed that Calafatus was asked about the case. I'll get to that tonight!

[Llum]

[ic=The Case]It is true, I met with Patrician Pierleone on the 15th. I had been trying to meet with him for some time, months in fact. Since the Patrician refused to meet with me to make amends alone I offered, perhaps naively, to let him bring an honor guard. I would imagine the Patrician did not expect my newly formed house guard to be present when he concocted his assassination plot. That was when the Patrician tried to assassinate me, with the aid of his guard. By the grace of God I was able to defend myself in time for my guard to save me and slay most of the attackers. I did not kill the Patrician himself, though it was within my power. Fearing for my continued safety I left my home with my guard and the captured Patrician to find safety elsewhere.

It was at this point that the true heinousness of the Patricians plan showed itself. At this point hundreds of men loyal to Pierleone attacked my group as we sought safety elsewhere in Rome. It was clear that these hundreds of men were waiting, in fact had been waiting in advance. If I had stayed at my home I would have been trapped within and slaughtered along with my family and guard. Once again by the grace of God I managed to fight my way to safety, but the group had managed to retake their vile leader.

It was at this point that the Patrician kidnapped several innocent senators to ensure his "safety" and would not return them until he had extorted favorable terms from my fellow Consul, the honorable Roberto Basile.
[/ic]

[Polycarp]

Hello folks,

I hope you have been enjoying RR so far.  I enjoy the direction the game is going, but I am also aware that the way the game works is somewhat opaque; I have to arbitrate a lot of inquiries as to whether something is feasible or appropriate and to what extent it is successful.  So far, the feedback I've gotten on how I've handled these inquiries has been positive.  By its very nature, a player's actions in this game have limits, often historical or cultural ones that are not immediately apparent to someone unfamiliar with the time period, and I've tried to both enforce those limits while also explaining them and providing alternatives as to not frustrate any player's designs or ideas.

In the past few turns, however, I have been building up some concern about the nature of Wealth in the game.  I greatly underestimated the amount of attention that would be paid to personal economics, investing, and so forth; so far, the dynamic has been towards personal enrichment instead of the collective enrichment of the state.  This is not a bad thing; it may be, indeed, a very in character thing to do, since as long as your money is yours the Consuls can't get their greedy mitts on it.  What it has meant, however, is that players are continually looking for new ways to expand their estates and interests, and this has come up against the limits of my knowledge of the period and the limits of my time.  I am increasingly unable to answer questions about how much X do I need to invest in Y to get Z, as well as the economics of cattle and sheep and such.  I do a lot of historical reading and research for this game, but the rate of return for medieval sheep in Latium per acre is something that I do not know, cannot know, and honestly don't really want to know.

It's not possible for me to fully codify the rules of this game.  The possibilities of player choice are so broad as to exclude that.  I have, however, decided to propose a revision and codification of the rules on Wealth.  This is a significant rule change, so I'd like to hear your comments and opinions before I do anything.

[spoiler=Revised Wealth System Draft]Revised Wealth System (ROUGH DRAFT)

Previously, Wealth was savings, but in this revised system Wealth is income.  It determines how much you can spend per turn rather than how much you have squirreled away.

Each turn, you may choose how to use your points of wealth.  Using Wealth does not decrease your Wealth; you're simply choosing where your income is going to.

• Military: Wealth can be used to maintain a standing force or hire mercenaries.  1 Wealth will maintain 100 semi-professional soldiers with a militiaman's equipment or its equivalent.  Armored infantry cost twice as much to maintain (1 Wealth for 50 men).  Other units, such as cavalry, will cost even more.  Mercenary costs depend on the type you are hiring; in general, they are much cheaper than maintaining your own forces but are only on board for a single campaign rather than being on permanent call.
• Projects: Wealth can be devoted to long-term projects.  Examples of projects include shoring up Rome's walls, building a tower-house or palazzo, and so on.  Projects all have a Cost; I list some standard costs below, but I will adjudicate the costs of special projects separately.  A project is completed when you have paid its entire cost; thus, the more Wealth you spend on something, the faster it is completed.  Some projects may be somewhat effective even if only partially paid for (like repairing walls).  Players may cooperate on projects.
  
  • A fortified Tower House: 15 Wealth
    
  • A modest Chapel: 10 Wealth
  • A stylish Palazzo: 20 Wealth
    
  • A rocca (small castle): 30 Wealth

• Payments: Wealth can be paid as a gift or tribute.  If paid to another player, it becomes temporarily that player's Wealth; for instance, if my friend and I each have 8 Wealth, and I give him 2, for that season I can spend 6 and he can spend 10.  NPCs may demand tribute in the same fashion.
• Investment: Any Wealth that is not used can be "invested."  Invested wealth is put towards further increasing your Wealth.  When you invest, you must describe how your are investing; all Wealth is equal, but the manner in which you are invested may have a bearing later (for instance, if you are fully invested in wine production and rampaging Germans burn down all the vineyards).  How you invest may also have an impact on the economy of the city and what kinds of industries and crafts develop, or which social classes benefit from your endeavors.  Some kinds of investments may anger certain classes or foreigners (or, alternately, appease them).

Investment, which is the main attraction of the system, is handled rather like a project.  Each level of Wealth has a cost; when you have filled that cost, your Wealth goes up by 1.  The cost of advancing a level of wealth is equal to four times the level you are trying to reach.  For example, if I have 6 Wealth, it will take 28 Wealth spent (7x4) to reach 7 Wealth.  That means that regardless of what level of Wealth you are at, it will take one year to raise it by 1, assuming you spend Wealth on nothing else.

Though in theory all Wealth used for investment is equal, in practice I will retain the ability to give out small investment bonuses for a plan that is particularly well conceived or a trade or industry that is particularly valuable or becomes particularly important.  Likewise, some niche investments may be capped in terms of how much you can actually invest in them.

It will be possible for Wealth to decrease as well as increase.  If your investments are compromised, whether by war, competition, or other events, your Wealth will decrease - basically, points will be taken away in the same way that they are added by investment.  Certain exceptionally large projects or constructions may also decrease your Wealth if you expect to finish them in a reasonable time frame; this will be noted if it comes up.

Senator Vin Diesel has 7 Wealth.  On his sheet, it looks like this:

Wealth: 7 (8/32) [116 Total: 70 Farmland, 26 Wool Production, 10 Salt Harvesting, 10 Hospitality]

8/32 means that he has invested 8 out of the 32 points needed to get to Wealth 8.  The numbers in brackets represent where his investments are; in this case, these investment points total 116 (it takes 108 points to get from 1 Wealth to 7 Wealth, plus the 8 he's invested towards 8 Wealth).  Senator Diesel appears to be a noble (most of his wealth comes from farmland) who has recently branched out into wool, salt, and boarding guests coming to Rome.

Senator Diesel's player might put the following in his OOC orders:

[ooc=OOC Orders]

• Spend 2 Wealth on troop upkeep (200 masnada).
• Spent 2 Wealth on my Tower House.
• Invest 3 Wealth in sheep grazing, seizing lands and running peasants off the contado for sheep.

[/ooc]

At this rate, Senator Diesel will have his Tower House completed in 8 seasons; 2 Wealth will be added to the cost until it's paid.  3 Wealth will be put towards investing in Wool Production, and there may be consequences of the way he's invested it – the peasants or local clergy might not like him running roughshod over them, and if a marauding army ravages his pastures he might lose Wealth.

There are some obvious advantages of this system - firstly, the research burden on me is decreased, and the need for you to query me about moneymaking or how much investment is needed to get X or Y is also decreased.  Secondly, it means you will always have something to spend; no longer will you have to take no action in a turn just because you're low on cash.  Thirdly, it lets me see at a glance exactly how much you stand to lose (or gain) from fortunate and unfortunate events.  Fourthly, investment is more granular than Wealth, allowing me to penalize and reward you in smaller, less momentous increments than increasing or decreasing your income by a whole Wealth per turn.  Finally, because Wealth is the same in all seasons, we no longer have to keep track of exactly when you are getting income and when it is being spent.[/spoiler]
Though you are free to post and continue the game, I'm not going to put down a due date for orders until I hear your opinion on this issue.  Hopefully this will also give EE some time to resolve his court dilemma, as well as give the broader Senate a chance to make a decision on Bulgari v. Gosiani.  Thanks! :fluffy:

[Magnus Pym]

Clearly, this new method would be much better. At least from how I understand it. My question though, with how much Wealth do we start, the amount we're at? I think that would, perhaps, be unbalanced.

[Nomadic]

Personally I rather like it. Regarding our wealth levels I'd say that's something where you'll have to go over our assets with us and hammer out a starting wealth for each of us. Alternatively you might just set our wealth at our starting level (5 for nobles and 6 for citizens), optionally giving out or taking away points based any major investments or hits we've taken. For any serious money (like the huge amount of loot calafatus recently scored) made recently you could add it on as temporary income for this next season.

[LD]

Fortis gave a significantly better defense than I would have imagined possible. Good work Llum :)

Still thinking about the new wealth system. First thought is that we wait a few turns to phase it in-it shouldn't just come into effect next turn, maybe in 2 or 3. (e.g. implement it in Winter when there isn't much to spend on projects as a test rather than in Summer and Autumn where cash might be flying out the doors en masse).

It is also difficult to set a starting amount... Could you share with us how you will set the starting amounts before you do? I suspect something like what Nomadic suggests- set the base and then adjust based on the investments that were made, might work. But some people have investments out that lead to temporary drops in their current wealth.

Also, does this mean that the seasonal income no longer exists (e.g. nobles +1 in autumn, citizens +1 in spring).

[ic=Before the Senate]
Congratulations to Fortis Calafactus and to Roberto Basile; both of these men have served Rome to prosper in the past year- rebuilding the wall and the aqueduct and sacking our enemies in Tivoli. I look forward to continuing my friendship with both men; although our policies and our backgrounds may not always be in step, I am confident that we can work together as Senatores to serve the glory of Rome. Let us have a round of applause for the Consuls!

*later*

I speak now of the request of the Cardinal to have the former Pope buried in St. Peters. I agree with honored Arrigus Sissmondi that it is only right to grant a proper Christian burial to a person who desires one. We should grant this burial but we should negotiate with the Cardinal and his men about a proper contingent to arrive--we should not cede our wariness even when we extend our arms in embrace. And we should negotiate for a proper size for the ceremony--extravagance is to be avoided lest the people of Rome be offended.
[/ic]

[ic=Private To Basile]Congratulations on your victory, Consul Basile. I look forward to seeing the fruits of your upcoming year of Consulship; may they be even more fruitful than in the year past.[/ic]

[ic=Private to Fortis]Congratulations on your victory, Consul Calafactus, and good wishes to you for truth to prevail in your Court case much as success has prevailed in your military campaign. Much of Rome looks up to you for your bravery and stamina.[/ic]

[Elemental_Elf]

[ic=The Case]Consul Calafactus, you say you attempted to meet with Patrician Pierleone for several months. Why did you not attempt to meet in a neutral location? Your private residence, though beautiful and welcoming, is an odd choice to hold such an important meeting. What is your rational for conducting City business within your private house? Would a more public setting not have been a better fit for such an important discussion?

You claim that Patrician Pierleone assaulted you almost immediately. I have already accepted evidence from our City's Vigili who have stated your personal guards outnumbered the Patrician's by a sizable margin. Why would he instigate such an assault while you still possessed the advantage? Even if successful, it would mean certain doom for the Patrician.  

You claim Patrician Pierleone instigated the riot but how could one man, a foreigner to our city, orchestrate such a plot completely under the Consul's nose? With all do respect, you lead the city at the time and should have known of any advanced plot against your person, much less the city.

Can you, Consul Calafactus, provide any concrete testimony or documents that support your version of events? [/ic]

[Llum]

[ic=The Case]
As you point out in your question, a public place is in itself public. As Consul I treat with many delicate affairs and am discrete about these topics. While I do hold public office, for the good of Rome and its people I cannot discuss everything in public where it is open for everyone to hear. I offered my home because it is welcoming and thought it would bring an air of welcome to our discussion. Sadly it appears I welcomed a rabid wolf instead of the friend I had expected.

As for why he would instigate this assault with my personal guard there? Perhaps he thought they would be worthless, since they were recruited from the poppolo minuto, something they have proven wrong with their valor and courage. Perhaps he was enraged by the fact that I was successful in my attack on Tivoli, therefore proving him wrong in his accusations that we should flee to the Pope, may he rest eternally in heaven, and beg forgiveness as he public demanded the Senate do. Perhaps he was over confident that his hundreds of men in reserve would be able to arrive in time and slaughter myself, my guard and my family in my own home. Instead they caught us outside as I retreated to safety.

First off, the Patrician is no foreigner. He has lived in Rome his whole life. Longer than many of the merchants in the Senate, and even Nobles like yourself. As for under our own noses? I am the Consul of the Exterior. I have no special authority inside Roman walls. I treat with ambassadors and foreign powers, I handle our military. I am not a glorified policeman here to ferret out trouble. The inner workings of Rome are under the parasol of my fellow Consul, Roberto Basile. And he was quite understandably ridding our city of it's enemies ensconced in the Papal palace.

I am not all seeing like the our almighty Lord, I cannot forsee every plot and sin concieved by the wickedness of men. I am just thankful that in this instance I was able, by the Grace of God, to escape it, not once but twice.

Now I did not say he caused the riots. I said that he had several hundred men ready, a great number, ready for assault. He brought hundreds of armed men into the streets of Rome to attack myself and my guard who were retreating to a safe place. That could easily spark the riots that happened, it was a most vile thing to do after all.
[/ic]
[ooc=Orders for The Case]
-Send my masnada far and wide within Rome. Find all willing to support or offer evidence to my testimony.
[/ooc]

[Polycarp]

Clearly, this new method would be much better. At least from how I understand it. My question though, with how much Wealth do we start, the amount we're at?

No, definitely not.  Because everyone's income is essentially the same right now, everyone would probably start at the same wealth level.  I would, however, count your current treasury and investments made so far into progress towards the next level.

First thought is that we wait a few turns to phase it in-it shouldn't just come into effect next turn, maybe in 2 or 3.

It seems like that would create a disincentive to do certain things because you are holding back and waiting for a major economic revision.  I, personally, would rather delay this turn while we decide rather than keep up a running discussion over several turns, during which time nobody is sure what effect their actions will have in the new structure.


A major issue was brought up by Llum in chat.  If we use the rules in the draft, investing would eventually become futile.  For instance, to get to 8 Wealth from 7, it takes 32 investment points (8x4).  At 8 Wealth, it would take 32 turns, or 8 game years, before you broke even and started to make back your investment; while it would be nice if we were around that long, it's... well, a long time to wait.

The reason I made Wealth scale geometrically like this is to provide some kind of reason to use it instead of just investing constantly until an emergency hit, and I stand behind the general idea.  There is also some basis in realism - unlike today, when you can make vast fortunes just by betting on the right stock, few people in medieval history multiplied their fortunes year after year for eternity.  There is a real issue of diminishing returns - once you are the Cattle Baron of France there is a lot of time and money you have to spend just to keep that massive cash cow (pun intended) from spinning out of control or being sapped by thieves and embezzlers.  The number of notaries, overseers, and vassals (in the case of land) multiplies as one's holdings expand.  The only people who were truly rich on the same scale of kings and emperors were the moneylending families like the Medici and the Fuggers of a later age - right now, banking was only just starting to be pioneered by the Knights Templar as a means to keep nobles' assets safe while they were on crusade.

There may be ways to make the scaling less dramatic.  For one, we can simply decrease the multiplier (from 4 to 3 or even 2) - the problem remains in this system, but it's deferred until higher levels.  It may, however, make advancement at lower levels too fast.  I am open to suggestions on this matter, and will continue to think about it.

[Elemental_Elf]

[ic=The Case]I do not mean to offend dear Consul. The burden that has been thrust upon me is as heavy as it is dire. I wish to find the truth and, as Patrician Pierleone has pointed out, the burden of proof is your cross to bear.

As a matter of record, could you please tell the court what the meeting between yourself and Patrician Pierleone was to be concern? Additionally, please explain Tivoli's role in this matter.

Patrician Pierleone has claimed you placed him in a sack and took him across the city. Where were you headed? [/ic]