Sinister Illusions and Hidden Magic

[Numinous]

[ic=Natural 20]Hey guys, it's just me again.  With my return to an active position within the Guild, and with the many new developments that have occurred within my world creatively, I have decided to post some of my rough ideas for my setting.  With an amorphous concept, it should be fairly easy for new readers to understand, and easier to give feedback.  So, without further ado...[/ic]

The Setting: This world has no name yet, but it is made from the remains of Godswalk and Hubris, my two former settings.  Any suggestions for a name are appreciated, but I want it to be simple and symbolic of the mood I intend to create.

The Themes: The world is filled with secrets, and their nature is as varied as the settings on the forums.  Corruption lurks everywhere, especially where it is least expected.  Nothing is as it seems, and everything can use a second look.  Misery is everywhere, and human nature is the greatest evil.  What makes us Human?  Is it intelligence, free will, the blood that flows through our veins, or something greater?

The Goal: I want to make a diverse and interesting world, which can be interpreted as art  or be used as a gaming environment at the same time.

The Game: I build worlds as a hobby, but also to game in.  It will most likely be quite a while before this world sees any games, so I feel safe in not making a decision on system yet.  The systems I am looking at are Mutants and Masterminds (unlikely), World of Darkness(likely), and the Triad system, by LC(assuming it is ever completed)

The Messy Part: I have ideas, and lots of them.  If you want to help out, pick one and ask me to elaborate, or try to interpret them yourself and post the results.  I can't promise I'll take advice you give or suggestions you make, but everything helps to inspire me, so post anyway!

[spoiler=Ideas]
Iron is anathema to magic, and so it can be used to ward off magical effects.  In all ways, it is impervious to supernatural effects, and partially to completely nullifies those around it.

The magic in the world was once plentiful, but now it has thought to have disappeared.  In reality, it is hidden.  I'm working for a Narnia-like feel here, as in the middle-books.  People remember magic, and dragons, and giants, but they believe them to be only stories.  But Dryads sleep in the ancient forests, vampires walk on moonless nights, and the power of magic can still be tapped if one knows the right method.

Anarchy.  The world was great once, but something ruined that.  Whether it was war, plague, or an outside force, the age of prosperity ended long ago.  Remnants remain, and ruins are ripe for the plundering.  Ancient records exist, chronicling secrets which have been lost for generations, just waiting to be found in a dusty room which hasn't seen the sun for ages.

The Simulacrum.  Ancient beings from a time long past.  I'm not sure how to work them yet, or even whether they are a race, a single being, or even a god.  What I do know is that they should be immortal, born unnaturally, and exist without a conscience.  Their existence serves to blur the line between human and monster.

The Guardians.  A powerful group, similar in nature to the inquisition.  They seek to protect their flock ruthlessly, but their methods are unsavory, and their efficiency s questionable at best.

I'm a bit lost on divinity, although I have several idea on this matter.  Suggestions are welcome, and I heartily encourage them.

I already have rough sketches of cultures worked out, but I'll post them later on, pending feedback from the community.[/spoiler]

That's all for now.  And feel free to post in this thread, I'll make a content thread later on.

UPDATE: There is now a content thread.

[Matt Larkin (author)]

Hubris is a former setting!?  What?

[Matt Larkin (author)]

Iron is anathema to magic, and so it can be used to ward off magical effects. In all ways, it is impervious to supernatural effects, and partially to completely nullifies those around it.

SaGa Frontier 2[/i] (a pretty poor game IMO, but I played it).

The other ideas are interesting and have potential.

[Numinous]

Hubris is a former setting!?  What?

As of today, yes.  I decided to discontinue my revision efforts towards Hubris in the interest of starting with a clean(er) slate on which to craft my world.  Your reviews of Hubris did not go unnoticed Phoenix, and I am grateful for them.  you might even see some of the ideas suggested for Hubris finding their way into this setting.

[Matt Larkin (author)]

Well, I'm sure scrapping a setting, especially one with so much effort, is never an easy decision.  But as much as I liked it, I commend you for being willing to make such a decision if you think it's best.

I can certainly say I've scrapped old worlds to mine them and use what I've learned, so I look forward to seeing this setting.

[Lmns Crn]

Hubris is a former setting!?  What?

For real! I was just starting to read Hubris last night, in preparation to give a belated Showcase review. Luckily, I guess I stumbled upon this project right at its start, so I can follow it as it grows.

That said, let's get down to it! *pushes up sleeves*

something like that[/url] from another world....

Here's another thing that strikes me as tricky to handle, like just about any setting-wide mystery of this magnitude would be. If you let the cat out of the bag, let the mystery be solved, you've just weakened one of your big themes by taking away the mystery central to it. On the other hand, if you treat it as static, and progress toward figuring it out is impossible, players are going to treat it as static as well. You go from "wow, that vanished, vast civilization... what happened to it?" to "oh, just more of those creepy old ruins again."

Don't misunderstand-- it's a powerful motif. It just requires careful handling that makes it problematic.

The Simulacrum. Ancient beings from a time long past. I'm not sure how to work them yet, or even whether they are a race, a single being, or even a god. What I do know is that they should be immortal, born unnaturally, and exist without a conscience. Their existence serves to blur the line between human and monster.

The Guardians. A powerful group, similar in nature to the inquisition. They seek to protect their flock ruthlessly, but their methods are unsavory, and their efficiency s questionable at best.

I'm a bit lost on divinity, although I have several idea on this matter. Suggestions are welcome, and I heartily encourage them.

I already have rough sketches of cultures worked out, but I'll post them later on, pending feedback from the community.[/quote]POOOOOST IIIT

[snakefing]

Meditations on lost/vanished magic:

The magic is gone? Where did it go? Was it destroyed (in some vast cataclysm)? Will it grow back?

Or maybe it was hidden. By the gods? Or by those who hate/fear magic? Or maybe by those who decided this knowledge was not meant for man? (Perhaps after aforesaid cataclysm?)

Or maybe just lost? The knowledge, very widespread in the first place, was scattered and the few keepers of it died without worthy heirs?

Or some combination of the above.

Many people don't really believe in monsters? Do they regard them as fairy stories? Or things that used to be but are no more? Or maybe the kind of thing that was driven out and destroyed, but might live on in far corners of the world.

You know, a lot of people today believe that burning bushes once talked, and whales could swallow people, or a man could survive a fiery furnace. But these same people usually are pretty sure these things don't happen today. We're in a different age, so they think, and those are things that belong to a mythical and heroic past. Of course, some people hope for a return to such a time, or believe that particular people or places might still retain some of the old power.

It seems like the kind of setting that is ripe for peculiar beliefs, superstitions, cults, and secret societies. They believe (rightly or not) that they have stumbled on to some of the great secrets of the past, or found a prophet who can resurrect the ancient glories.

Personally, I'd stay away from too much of the D&D style divinity. Makes it too easy to dispel the mystery and clear away the fog. The divine should be distant, seen through a crystal darkly. Perhaps when the magic went, the gods themselves were driven far away?

[SDragon]

corruption, misery, illusion? most people don't know about monsters or magic? i assume this means the average Joe commoner trots through his dreary life, completely oblivious to the abuse of power in the world, thinking along the lines of, "sure things could be better, but this is how things are; we live in this world, not never-neverland." i like this.

as for the name... theres no real need to get too far into that at this point, but since most fantasy names are expressionist at best and jumbles of letters at worst, may i suggest Godris?

[Epic Meepo]

Recycle Bin[/url] *cough*

[Matt Larkin (author)]

It sounds like he's planning on using some material from Hubris himself.

[Stargate525]

This looks like it'll be a great setting, and I can't wait to see it fleshed out.

I do have one bit of a question though;

Iron is anathema to magic, and so it can be used to ward off magical effects.  In all ways, it is impervious to supernatural effects, and partially to completely nullifies those around it.

You do realize that what little magic that is in this setting will be very much suppressed by this, right? Also, does this magical shielding trait carry over to steel?

[Numinous]

Wow.  Lots of feedback.  I'd hoped, but I never expected this much!  Thanks everybody, I'll get down to answering questions now!  Answers to questions and responses to posts will be categorized into spoilers by the user who made them.

[spoiler=Luminous Crayon]First off, lucky me!  I'm glad you're reading, and that's partially why there is so little material up right now.  I plan to let people follow along as I work so that I get more feedback.

In the way of systems, I have had Ars Requiem suggested to me numerous times, but I'm still holding off on a decision.

The corruption I speak of is pretty much what you say, in as many forms as the word can be applied.  Decay, decadence, hedonism, greed, and sins in general.  Nothing is absolutely pure, and all but the most ignorant can see that the world has some issues.  The world itself might even be warped in some ways, although I'm unsure how or even whether to implement that yet.

I like misery, as it's an emotion I am familiar with, and I like to keep things dark in general.  whether or not the world's focus should be on defeating the darkness or feeling the pain as it mercilessly crushes your hopes, I haven't yet decided.  Also, the darkness defines the light as much as the light defines the darkness, and that is something I am really anxious to play with.

Humans-only in the broad sense, and humanocentric in the extreme.  I want to examine our nature, both by comparison, and by viewing the race as a whole.  there won't be any goblins or elves in hubris, although spirits, vampires, zombies, and even robots will make an appearance.  Or so ?I plan now, anyway...

I honestly did not plan for any type of synergy between the ideas other than the fact that they are all very compatible to begin with, and make for an interesting world IMO.  However, if an exponential gain in the quotient of awesome can be gained by blending the ideological bits of my world together, then that's a happy accident indeed.

Yeah, iron being the opposite of magic isn't original, but it's an idea that I really am fond of.  Magic wasn't intended to b an outside or antagonistic force, just misunderstood and largely feared.  However, your comment intrigues me and I might have to reconsider that...

I don't so much plan for the lost civilization to be a mystery, but that from explaining it comes great effects.  As the civilization actually collapsed and culture faded, rather than the people disappearing, the situation is slightly different.  Perhaps it is more similar to the ancient ruins in India, or Stonehenge, in that we can remember and see proof of the past, but are incapable of finding any real explanation of events or ideas.  Another example is greek fire, a technology that was found and then lost in history, yet still live on in history, and even legend.  Religions claim to hold the truth about the past, different cultures have their own explanations, but only a few know the truth.  Namely those with immortality, or scholars who can be easily refuted as mad.

The Simulacrum are a key idea to they world, but as of yet I'm really unsure how to handle him/it/they.  It's main purpose is to be a contrast to humanity itself, but your last sentence leads me to think it might be more influential as an an entity with influence akin to a deity in the traditional D&D sense.

Yeah, the Guardians are heavily based on the inquisition.  I intend them to be heavily anti-magic, and to be tied to iron symbolically.  some might even follow them in belief of their cause, while others want power.  Also, witchcraft is something I intend to play with, whether simply herbalism or an insidious otherworldly presence, I'm not sure yet.

Oh, and I'll post more later on, I just have to address all this incredible feedback I've received![/spoiler]

[spoiler=snakefing]The magic is gone mainly as it is a sort of science or lore.  Lost in an event similar to a cataclysm which led to the anarchy which has obliterated most attempts to record history throughout the past years, it still exists but is difficult to obtain and certainly is mysterious.

Monsters are addressed as superstition commonly and many believe such superstitions.  I hope to shake up any players with a blend of false myths and real horrors.  some were destroyed, others left, and some still exist, hiding in shadowy depths, remote mountains, ancient forest groves, or even the shadows under your bed.

I have ideas about divinity...  Entities who can subtly influence the world, granted power by faith, yet largely unable to effect matters in the mundane world like in FR or other similar worlds.  Of course, all of this is subject to change. ;)[/spoiler]

[spoiler=sdragon1984]I'm glad you like it.  I'm really hoping to create a lot of interesting moments when players discover some secrets, and then have to learn discretion in such matters as superstition and faith.

Sorry dude, but Godris doesn't carry the right ring for me.  I'm hoping to create a symbolic title that ties into the world and hints at it's flavor, like Hubris did.[/spoiler]

[spoiler=Stargate525]Glad to hear it.

I don't see it so much suppressed as made more interesting.  Knights will wear armor as much to protect against insidious magics as to stop a blade.  It gives a reason for wizards to avoid armor, and it adds another level to strategic thought.  The iron is the yin to magic's yang, a balance is created here, and manipulating that is a key part of the world.

I'm not sure about applying this trait to steel.  However, due to some wikipedia research, I have learned steel was both rare and expensive in medieval times, and cold iron also had much significance for superstitious folk.  I intend to tap into these, but as to tie steel in, I'll definitely have to give it some thought.[/spoiler]

New Theme: As I was reading my reviews and writing back, faith came up a lot.  I think I'll take this into consideration and play around with the effects of it, both good and bad.

Inspirations: something I forgot to put into the first post.  This setting draws heavily from literary and other sources of inspiration.  Some of the bigger ones are...

Dystopia
Dune
The Nightmare
Ravenloft
Girl Genius
Promethean: The Created
H.P. Lovecraft
"The Village"

and others...

Thanks for the feedback guys, and I'll work to get some more material up this weekend!

[Stargate525]

Glad to hear it.

I don't see it so much suppressed as made more interesting.  Knights will wear armor as much to protect against insidious magics as to stop a blade.  It gives a reason for wizards to avoid armor, and it adds another level to strategic thought.  The iron is the yin to magic's yang, a balance is created here, and manipulating that is a key part of the world.

I'm not sure about applying this trait to steel.  However, due to some wikipedia research, I have learned steel was both rare and expensive in medieval times, and cold iron also had much significance for superstitious folk.  I intend to tap into these, but as to tie steel in, I'll definitely have to give it some thought.

Ah, I see. This would be an interesting thing for party dynamics as well, if you're going to leave the standard four;

"Damnit Bob, cast the spell to get these Kobolds off me!"
"I can't, the paladin's too close to me!"

But in seriousness, as iron has an effect on magic, I'm assuming the opposite is also true? It seems to make sense with the yin-yang concept, and could give motive for the two not to come in contact.

Inspirations: something I forgot to put into the first post.  This setting draws heavily from literary and other sources of inspiration.  Some of the bigger ones are...

Dystopia
Dune
The Nightmare
Ravenloft
Girl Genius
Promethean: The Created
H.P. Lovecraft
"The Village"

and others...

Thanks for the feedback guys, and I'll work to get some more material up this weekend!

Joy. Lesse... carry the 4... I've read a total of one of those. Should be interesting having opinions thrust upon you by a person who has no concept of the source material. x.

[Wensleydale]

Dune! Hoorayz!

Can't wait to see this setting. It does look a bit... depressing... but that's all well and good :P

[Numinous]

Due to inquiries of late, I present to you all the most polished of my pieces as of now.  It's a geographic region ad the accompanying culture which has been in development for a few months now...

Gothica

[/size]

[Working Title]

[/size]

This is a region which draws heavy inspiration from the D&D module "Expedition to Castle Ravenloft" and the city of Cairhienin, from the Wheel of Time series.

In the steep valleys of the Winter-fang mountains, storm-clouds constantly swirl and obscure the peaks of the stony behemoths.  Several deep valleys cut deep into the range, and it is here that the people eke out a living.  Protected by their remote location and the Lords Noctum, they live out peaceful lives as subsistence farmers.  It is rare for traders to visit the area, and so news from outside is both rare and consequently given little thought or importance in daily life.

Each valley here is ruled by a Lord, who is usually a member of the sinister organization known as the Lords Noctum.  This aristocracy passes the years playing games of power and influence with the other nobles in the area.  Trading mines and real-estate, competing for trade and knowledge, they have much to entertain them.  To handle the local populace they rule, their vassals, known only as Knights of the Lord {name} patrol the area and deal out "justice" as they see fit.  These Knights dress in simple, dull black, armor with the royal crest of the noble they serve emblazoned in bright colors upon their breastplate.  Due to their unquestionable devotion to their lords' will and the faith he in turn has in them, they have virtually limitless power within the valley they haunt.

I'll refine a post of the region later, but here you have a glimpse of what I want to make.




As always, questions are both appreciated and extremely useful.