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[poll] d20 Mana System: Need Help Fast!

Started by Xeviat, June 04, 2006, 08:25:06 PM

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Which idea do you favor? (Please read below before posting)

1a: Same MP, wizard has less spell slots but unlimited knowledge
4 (36.4%)
1b: Wizard has less MP and less spell slots but unlimited knowledge
2 (18.2%)
2 (Erudite): Same MP, wizard has unlimited knowledge, but limited access to that knowledge each day
2 (18.2%)
3: Wizard has less MP, but unrestricted access to their spell book\'s spells.
3 (27.3%)

Total Members Voted: 0

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Epic Meepo

#15
June 05, 2006, 05:44:23 PM
I guess I originally didn't understand the goal of your mana point system.  Let's see if I've got it right, now: You like the idea of the spell point system but not the execution, so you are essentially modifying that system and then writing up all OGC spells in psionic power format.  Am I understanding your project correctly?
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Soup Nazi

#16
June 05, 2006, 06:27:44 PM
QuoteI guess I originally didn't understand the goal of your mana point system. Let's see if I've got it right, now: You like the idea of the spell point system but not the execution, so you are essentially modifying that system and then writing up all OGC spells in psionic power format. Am I understanding your project correctly?

He actually already wrote up all the OGC spells. It was a huge project (I'm sure), and for those of us who think the power point system of the XPH is actually better than the spell slot system of the PHB, it works out great. The of course you run into the problem that the wizard and sorcerer both become spontaneous casters, which makes it kind of pain in the neck to differentiate between them.

I also suggested using the wilder as the base class for the sorcerer, just like you did. I thought Charisma casting, 3/4 BAB, d6 Hit Die, and 2 skill points (for the sorcerer) was a nice parallel to Intelligence casting, 1/2 BAB, d4 Hit Dice, 5 Bonus Feats, and 4 skill points (for the wizard).

I then advocated the erdudite parallel for the flavorful difference in their casting abilities. Innate vs. Learned.

Here's the link. 4th post has the zip file of all the spells

http://www.thecbg.org/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?4672

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Xeviat

#17
June 05, 2006, 06:34:09 PM
Nasty's correct; I've already completed converting the PHB SRD spells to the XPH format (If everything goes well, I'll be converting the few D&DG SRD spells too).

I do like the wilder base for the sorcerer, but that is beyond the scope of this, the first leg of a long project. This first step is simply a template to be applied to the current system, so I don't want to change the classes too much (which means I've been holding back my urges to use this as an opportunity to "rebalance" that which I think is unbalanced).

I do think I will be using my most recent idea; I'll be posting charts here for preliminary review before I publish it in "the Post". I do value all of your opinions, which is why I'm coming here first instead of just going it alone. I'd love as many playtesters as possible, so soon I will be running a fairly combat heavy/rp light play by post game here on these boards, to test things out.

Thanks all.
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Túrin

#18
June 06, 2006, 07:43:54 AM
I'd just like to comment on the exact number of mana points you wanted to give the wizard in theory 1. Since most people in my experience have preferred to play a specialist wizard (which gets one extra spell per day of each level) rather than a universal wizard, a ratio of 5/6 seems more reasonable than 4/6.
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Xeviat

#19
June 06, 2006, 06:47:56 PM
I finished building the class tables; I decided to give the wizard 270 MP to the sorcerer's 360 MP; it's only 1/4th less than the Sorcerer. Specialist wizards will be able to prepare one additional spell of their specialty at each level, but I can't find an elegant way to give them extra MP that is limited to their specialty.

I'm reading up on the table tags right now, so I'll post them shortly for review. Unless a very good arguement is posted as to why this version is doomed from the start, it will be the version I will test. I'm also going to begin to write a super dungeon, going from levels 1 through 20. I'll need 6 players: a paladin, a bard, a cleric, a druid, a sorcerer, and a wizard. No sources outside of the PHB (aside from my mana spells) will be used (though I'll consider swapping out the paladin's warhorse for the charging smite varient from PHB2 since the environment won't be conducive to a mount).

I'll be making a preliminary thread for the PbP play-test; Please apply within if you're interested.
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Xeviat

#20
June 06, 2006, 08:00:45 PM
Here are the charts. The slots shown are for preparatory casters to prepare their spells into. If these MP amounts end up being too little for preparatory casters, I'll increase it and test again.

I'll post the full system as soon as I finish it, unless I get some good arguements against what I'm going for. Thanks!

[table=Preparation Caster 1-9]
[tr][th]Level[/th][th]MP[/th][th]1st[/th][th]2nd[/th][th]3rd[/th][th]4th[/th][th]5th[/th][th]6th[/th][th]7th[/th][th]8th[/th][th]9th[/th][/tr]
[tr][th]1[/th][td]1[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]2[/th][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]3[/th][td]9[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]4[/th][td]12[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]5[/th][td]22[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]6[/th][td]27[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]7[/th][td]42[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]8[/th][td]48[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]9[/th][td]67[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]10[/th][td]75[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]11[/th][td]99[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]12[/th][td]108[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]13[/th][td]136[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]14[/th][td]147[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]15[/th][td]180[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]16[/th][td]192[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]17[/th][td]229[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]18[/th][td]243[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]19[/th][td]256[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]20[/th][td]270[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][td]4[/td][/tr][/table]

[table=Spontaneous Caster 1-9]
[tr][th]Level[/th]   [th]MP[/th]   [th]Spells Known   [th]Spell Level[/th][/tr]
[tr][th]1[/th]   [td]2[/td]   [td]3[/td]   [td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]2[/th]   [td]4[/td]   [td]5[/td]   [td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]3[/th]   [td]6[/td]   [td]7[/td]   [td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]4[/th]   [td]16[/td]   [td]9[/td]   [td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]5[/th]   [td]20[/td]   [td]11[/td]   [td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]6[/th]   [td]36[/td]   [td]13[/td]   [td]3[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]7[/th]   [td]42[/td]   [td]15[/td]   [td]3[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]8[/th]   [td]64[/td]   [td]17[/td]   [td]4[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]9[/th]   [td]72[/td]   [td]19[/td]   [td]4[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]10[/th]   [td]100[/td]   [td]21[/td]   [td]5[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]11[/th]   [td]110[/td]   [td]22[/td]   [td]5[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]12[/th]   [td]144[/td]   [td]24[/td]   [td]6[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]13[/th]   [td]156[/td]   [td]25[/td]   [td]6[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]14[/th]   [td]196[/td]   [td]27[/td]   [td]7[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]15[/th]   [td]210[/td]   [td]28[/td]   [td]7[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]16[/th]   [td]256[/td]   [td]30[/td]   [td]8[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]17[/th]   [td]272[/td]   [td]31[/td]   [td]8[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]18[/th]   [td]324[/td]   [td]33[/td]   [td]9[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]19[/th]   [td]342[/td]   [td]34[/td]   [td]9[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]20[/th]   [td]360[/td]   [td]36[/td]   [td]9[/td][/tr][/table]

[table=Spontaneous Caster 1-6]
[tr][th]Level[/th][th]MP[/th][th]Spells Known[/th][th]Spell Level[/th][/tr]
[tr][th]1[/th][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]2[/th][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]3[/th][td]4[/td][td]3[/td][td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]4[/th][td]6[/td][td]4[/td][td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]5[/th][td]15[/td][td]5[/td][td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]6[/th][td]18[/td][td]6[/td][td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]7[/th][td]21[/td][td]7[/td][td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]8[/th][td]36[/td][td]8[/td][td]3[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]9[/th][td]40[/td][td]9[/td][td]3[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]10[/th][td]45[/td][td]10[/td][td]3[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]11[/th][td]66[/td][td]11[/td][td]4[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]12[/th][td]72[/td][td]12[/td][td]4[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]13[/th][td]78[/td][td]13[/td][td]4[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]14[/th][td]105[/td][td]14[/td][td]5[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]15[/th][td]112[/td][td]15[/td][td]5[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]16[/th][td]120[/td][td]16[/td][td]5[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]17[/th][td]153[/td][td]17[/td][td]6[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]18[/th][td]162[/td][td]18[/td][td]6[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]19[/th][td]171[/td][td]19[/td][td]6[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]20[/th][td]180[/td][td]20[/td][td]6[/td][/tr][/table]

[table=Preparation Caster 1-4[/table]
[tr][th]Level[/th][th]MP[/th][th]1st[/th][th]2nd[/th][th]3rd[/th][th]4th[/th][/tr]
[tr][th]1[/th][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]2[/th][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]3[/th][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]4[/th][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]5[/th][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]6[/th][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]7[/th][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]8[/th][td]8[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]9[/th][td]9[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]10[/th][td]10[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]11[/th][td]11[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]12[/th][td]18[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]13[/th][td]19[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]14[/th][td]21[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]15[/th][td]22[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]-[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]16[/th][td]32[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]17[/th][td]34[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][td]1[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]18[/th][td]36[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]19[/th][td]38[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]2[/td][/tr]
[tr][th]20[/th][td]40[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][td]3[/td][/tr][/table]

There they are. I gave the wizard slightly more than I originally wanted to (because this one has a more smooth formula).

I'm going to post the final in "the Post".
Endless Horizons: Action and adventure set in a grand world ripe for exploration.

Proud recipient of the Silver Tortoise Award for extra Krunchyness.
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